Beaverton Grace Bible Church, BGBC Lawsuit, Grace Community Church, John MacArthur, Phil Johnson, Tony Miano, Troubling Tweets, Women and the Church

Question for Tony Miano: Did Joni Preach?

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Tony Miano, author of Should She Preach?, attended John MacArthur’s Strange Fire conference at Grace Community Church, along with Pastor Chuck O’Neal (suing pastor who had minister’s license revoked and currently in discipline), Phil Johnson, Dr. Steve Lawson, all of whom contributed to Miano’s book.

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Joni Earekson Tada spoke at the Strange Fire Conference

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The question is:

Did She Preach?

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Source
Click to see pic of BGBC members and Miano in the same pew at Strange Fire Conf
Source
Source

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Below is the video of Tada speaking at the conference:

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Listen in particular around the 20-minute mark.  She reads scripture and expounds on it.   Is she not teaching/preaching?  This is exactly what I hear pastors do.  But wait . . . she’s a woman!

Now, don’t get me wrong.  I do not have any problem with Joni taking the podium.   I loved listening to her testimony, how she spontaneously broke out into singing hymns,  how she has navigated her very challenging life of paralysis.  She’s very inspiring and I’ve always been encouraged by her faith.

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Tada was asked to take the podium by her friend, Pastor John MacArthur, to promote the message of his conference, his agenda – to call out charismatics as false doctrine.

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One of the disappointing patterns I see among church leaders is one of giving free passes:  if you hold to the “correct” doctrine, other hypocrisies will be overlooked (ie, “forgetting” to notify civil authorities about sex abuse, excusing the fact that a pastor sued former church members, etc).

It’s not right that they get a free pass to do what they tell others not to do simply because they are church leaders or in the public spotlight.  I’m not going to overlook these hypocrisies. If these guys are going to be so black and white, writing books about women preaching/teaching, I will challenge it when I see the blatant inconsistencies.

I would like to hear your thoughts.  Does it sound like Tada was teaching using scripture?  Did Joni Eareckson Tada get a free pass to teach/preach because Dr. MacArthur “approved’ of it or she has the “right” doctrinal beliefs regarding charismatics? Is that why Phil Johnson, Dr. Steve Lawson, Chuck O’Neal, and Tony Miano could sit comfortably under (whoa!  I just typed “under,” I can hear the moans and groans now) her teaching?

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Related article:

Strange Fire Conference: John MacArthur, “Reformed Theology is not a Haven for False Teachers”

120 thoughts on “Question for Tony Miano: Did Joni Preach?”

  1. I am curious to know how much he was paid and if it goes to SBTS or in his pocket. I get sick of these guys double dipping all the time. But his line about persecution was interesting. I think Mohler is going to ramp up the culture war to get the non Cal SBC minds off Mahaney. Not sure it will work anymore.

    When it comes to persecuting Christians I am just glad Mohler does not have civil power considering his historical heros

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  2. Just read on twitter that Miano’s next target is Bethel. If you think your sole purpose in life is to attack others, you need to go back and read your bible. His arrogance is astounding. There are many doctrines I don’t agree with, but to make it your life’s work is disturbing.

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  3. IMO Miano ought to give you a %age of his book sales for stirring the pot!

    This blog is like the Thelma and Louise of Christianity! (For those who are old enough to remember!

    I never understood deleting controversial comments.
    You would think it would give them an opportunity to help set you straight with genuine Godly love!

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  4. Hannah, I believe they delete comments because they don’t want people to actually ‘think’ about what someone else said because they may actually investigate themselves and find out that what the preacher/pastor etc IS actually wrong.

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  5. lynette

    Even Jesus allowed others to question Him.
    And it was always for the benefit of those asking.
    That’s a servants heart.
    I do understand that these leaders think that any comment they see as negative is an attack and of the devil.
    I have personally dealt with this stuff…way before social media existed.

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  6. Nothing unifies like pontificating on the woes of the immoral world… as a basis for correcting the real evil: the evil of people stepping out of their place in the hierarchy. And women are the worst offenders to these guys.

    Piper’s retirement video in Geneva, articulated the evils there during his hero, Calvin’s reign. Of course, Calvin had to whip Geneva to righteousness by killing & physically punishing those who merely disagreed with his doctrine… or fell asleep during his preaching, which could last several hours.

    The Puritans murdered women in Salem, MA (now Danvers, MA). A punishable crime would be a woman teaching a Bible study in her home. A woman. Or maybe you’re a Native American? Or slave? Or a Quaker? All inferior, discardable toward the Puritans ends of pure doctrine & personal gain, which of course go hand in hand.

    And CBMW? We’ve come full circle. Their (Ligon Duncan, Wayne Grudem, John Piper, Al Mohler) statement is called the Danvers Statement on BMW. They traveled to Danvers, MA several times to craft & then sign it. Salem, MA, infamous for killing Eve-il women is AKA Danvers, MA. That’s their mecca? That’s where they decided they needed to go to officially sign their document. There should no longer be any question in anyone’s mind about what’s been going on. I’ve wised up greatly of late.

    Complementarianism & it’s master craftsmen ain’t nice. They spell Evil: Eve-il. http://paulspassingthoughts.com/2012/08/01/destroying-eve-il-is-a-reformed-family-tradition-today-danvers-tomorrow-the-gallows/

    Thank God our founding fathers were paying attention to the Puritans & kept church & state separate. But don’t kid yourself about today. A theocracy is what these groups are after. Geneva. Salem. Through a good SWB, PCA, etc. church near you.

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  7. When I read Daisy Flower’s comment about “suppose an atheist man and a Christian woman were the only survivors of a plane crash on an island?”, I thought about one criticism people have had when my church has done mission work in Russia: women did the translating.

    So apparently, if the only person in your group that knows both English and Russian is a woman, it’s better to let a Russian-speaking person never hear the gospel than to have it translated to them by a woman.

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  8. I just want to say something admittedly uneducated. I know nobody here and found this link researching something else.

    That said. I am charismatic(but very conservatively so see video if you care for in depth reasoning why: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2ooPj-6XIM&feature=c4-overview&list=UUhO13khFWU-0VJ0ueo34hLA), hold to the soteriological distinctions of the Doctrines of Grace, and have the ebook for “Should She Preach”, but have yet to read it. I also have met and preached on the street with Tony Miano and Pastor Chuck O’Neal. I spoke extensively with an elder at Pastor Chuck’s church and was directed to the following website regarding legal/spiritual issues with the church. I never needed to go there because thee elder and I had a great and long talk. Here it is if you’d like: JA Removed Link to Impostor Blog

    I will only say this. Tony is an awesome and kind preacher. He is a leader and does so with strength but such that lacks intimidation as a tool. His passion for the lost is rival to anyone you’ll ever meet and he walks out his faith. I spoke to him personally while street preaching with him and Pastor O’Neal in Seattle about his book, prior to it’s release. He was clear then and in everything I’ve seen since that he is not making this issue one to break fellowship with anyone over. He also is very clear that people should not take his words or anyone elses, but God’s word as truth. Does he have strong opinion? Yes? We all do or we wouldn’t make our cases on anything to anyone.

    Pastor Chuck O’Neal and his family were some of the most gracious people I’ve met. Their church(and this is no wealthy mega church)hosted a week long absolutely FREE(in great sacrifice to them)evangelism conference. I think that might be unheard of! I only made the last evening and following day. Pastor O’neal having never met me or my friends who came with me opened his church and let us sleep there overnight. He has further offered to do so again if I need it. He has even offered to pick me up and take me to conferences he was driving to hundreds of miles away from his church. He and his church’s passion for the saving of souls in unrivaled in anyplace I’ve ever seen.

    On top of all that these men are both front line against the holocaust of abortion.

    I’m not judging anyone here as I know none of you. I only hope you are half as dedicated to serving the Lord in reaching the lost and protecting the unborn as you are yammering on negatively(notice I didn’t use the term attack. I did not read every post here but plenty to get a very negative feel.) about two great men who labor in those ways for the glory of God.

    All that said you may have legit complaints about what you see as hypocrisy. Again I don’t know. All I know is this just sounds like a big bash session on some awesome brothers I happen to have been very blessed by and am thankful to God for. Let’s all speak truth in love. God bless and take care.

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  9. Hi Mason:

    False teachers are not dumb enough to let their dirty laundry out. They hide it and sometimes it takes months/years to discover. You’re not going to find out a pastor is a false teacher by talking to an elder whose tithes had to help pay for the probably close to $100K of legal fees because of his pastor who sued (which btw is against scripture). No, they still want to protect and defend him at all cost because otherwise they would have to admit that their pastor is a false teacher. Perhaps if you’d talk with the scores of people who have left that church, you’d hear different stories. This “story” is not over yet. Chuck will not have the last word on his false teaching and abuses.

    I am speaking the truth in love about Chuck O’Neal. It’s no bash session, it’s about a man who uses his position of pastor inappropriately to control others, about a man who preached a grace-less gospel. Yea, he looks good and sounds good, but don’t be fooled. We were fooled and we paid for it.

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  10. Mason – You’re using the phrase “Holocaust of abortion” and you’re not judging anyone??? Right.
    I’m afraid that Julie Anne has far more credibility than you as to the merits of Chuck O’Neal and his ilk.

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  11. Hi Mason

    Was wondering…
    Are you open for a discussion?

    Your “CORE’s Statement of Faith” web page says…

    “We believe the Bible to be the inspired, infallible, authoritative,
    and inerrant Word of God.”

    Well, that always sounds good. – At first. – But, I’ve noticed…
    Many who say this “Ignore” and “Twist” many scriptures to their benefit…
    And “Add” lots of stuff NOT in the Bible. And claim it is “Biblical.”

    I’ve read your comment and have some questions. Are you open?

    What is popular is NOT always “Truth.”
    What is “Truth” is NOT always popular.

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  12. Mason

    Is what you believe, and preach, from the Bible?

    Or, is what you believe, and preach, “Tradtions of Men?” NOT the Bible?

    Mark 7:8
    For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold The Tradition of Men…

    Col 2:8
    Beware lest any man spoil you through *philosophy and *vain deceit,
    after **the tradition of men,**
    after the rudiments of the world, and NOT after Christ.

    What if you, Mason, are now preaching “Tradtion” and NOT the Bible?
    Would that be a concern for you?

    Mark 7:13
    NLT – you “cancel” the word of God to hand down your own tradition.
    KJV – Making the word of God of “none effect” through your tradition…
    ASV – Making “void” the word of God by your tradition…
    NIV – Thus you “nullify” the word of God by your tradition…

    Ps 138:6
    Though the LORD be high, yet hath he respect unto the lowly:
    but the proud he knoweth afar off.

    Ps 40:4
    Blessed is that man that maketh the LORD his trust,
    and respecteth not the proud, nor such as turn aside to lies.

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  13. Wow, I just happened by, here, on my journey reading through all the spiritual abuse blogs. You guys are a fun read! I’ve always liked Joni, and am sad she allows herself to be used by the “strange fire” folk. I spent over 30 years in paid church/para church ministry, and have spent the past 7 years recovering. I used to tease that since Paul became all things to all people so that he might win some, I could become different things to all people so that I might confuse some! Thus, when I took pulpit duty, I’d tell my conservative friends I was preaching, and my liberal friends I was ‘sharing’. One of my brilliant theologian friends likes to tell conservatives that she preaches because her husband makes her preach. 🙂
    It’s amazing to me how these conservative characters are unaware at how irrelevant and absurd they sound to the wider world — including the wider Christian world. Keep up the good work!

    Liked by 1 person

  14. The verses she talked about were necessary to her testimony. She simply said what the verses said and didn’t go into creating doctrine or exercising authority. Using this as a claim of hypocrisy is to not understand the Biblical and MacArthur’s teaching of it on women teachers and holding positions of authority.

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  15. Get a life!!!! Joni Earkson Tada is a vessel that God has uses to speak to everyone about suffering. Very few will ever know or be called to this kind of suffering for God’s purposes. Don’t waste your time worrying if she is preaching or not. Go do something with your time to help your fellow man

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  16. Get A Life!!!! God has used Joni in a way that not many Christians are ever used. The woman is so powerful in Gods Word because she needs it every minute of her life. Her flesh is screaming but in the midst of it God is so very mighty not only to her but to people everywhere. Don’t concern yourself with the petty question if she was preaching or not. Have a heart to listen to what she is saying because it is a powerful message. Not many people could walk behind her and be used so mightly. Go get a cause and do something for the kingdom of God.

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  17. Dear Martha,

    Uhm, I think you’ve misunderstood the point that Julie Anne was trying to make in this post. She’s not against Joni preaching or offering her testimony — very few people here are. Julie Anne is against the apparent hypocrisy of guys like Miano who write (and make money from) books telling women why they shouldn’t preach in public, and yet sit gladly in the presence of a woman who does exactly that.

    As for “doing something for the kingdom of God”, JA’s been doing that for the past 5 years. Did you not notice?

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