Jesus is Pretty Lowly Compared to the Likes of Spurgeon and Whitefield among Certain Folks

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JeremiahCry and The Herald Society put on a Conference to Discuss Dead Heroes of the Faith, But Someone Seems to be Missing

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JeremiahCry Ministries is putting on a conference. Take a look at Jeremiah Cry’s primary vision:

The primary vision of JeremiahCry Ministries is the advancement of the Kingdom of God through the biblically prescribed means of the public proclamation of the Gospel of Jesus Christ. (Source).

With that vision in mind, here is an advertisement for the conference they are putting on:

 

herald society

 

 

Heads up:  a conference coming up – cost is now $75 to attend.

Where do you see Jesus mentioned on this website?  How many Bible verses do you read? The focus is on glorifying dead men and their doctrine.  But it’s not only that, now we need to go to a seminar to hear live men interpret the lives of these dead men and their doctrinal beliefs.  Whatever happened to investigating the life of Paul, or Abraham, or Joseph, or David, or the life and death of Jesus in the Bible?  Why do these men insist on elevating dead men and their man-made doctrines and then slap a Christianity label on it?

I am convinced that the further we go away from the Bible and elevate men, the further we get away from God.

What is ironic is most of these men claim to be sola scriptura, yet they go beyond scripture to satisfy their itching ears.

Here are a few who are excited about this conference:

Are they preaching Jesus or Whitefield?  Jesus or Spurgeon?

55 comments on “Jesus is Pretty Lowly Compared to the Likes of Spurgeon and Whitefield among Certain Folks

  1. I agree. A Christian blog I recently found and loved responded to a detractor’s comment with a long quote from Luther, nary a word from the Bible, even though this blog is run by a pastor. I thought about saying something but another poster simply responded to the detractor using Scripture.

    Why is that so hard, anymore? Theologians study each other and it’s just another form of elitism and bad research. Go to the original source.

    Liked by 4 people

  2. Yes, there is a problem here. For some years I went through the phase of scarfing up every biography of famous Christians of the past. I did actually benefit from reading them (you have to pick the good bios that are factual and don’t wrongly exalt the person). For example the big 2 – volume set on George Whitefield’s life and ministry taught me quite a lot of theology and practical theology. However, this kind of thing requires much caution. When you start having conferences focused upon the lives of the greats, what can happen very quickly is that man’s traditions can be embraced as if they were the Word of God. “Well, Spurgeon did this so…” and so on. “This is what Keach taught….or…this is what Calvin said about….or….we must seek revivial just like Jonathan Edwards….”. What I find when I get all caught up in such subjects is that I get hopeless and depressed and feel worthless. I feel like I can never measure up to people like that and that I have been doing everything wrong. But I don’t feel that way when I read Jesus or Paul – Scripture in other words. Increasingly over the years I find myself driven back to Scripture and the number of other books I read has diminished greatly as I have grown older and, I hope, wiser.

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  3. I love a good quote (I’ve yet to exhaust everything I could use from C.S. Lewis), but I try to rely on scripture for authority and remain mindful that the focus always needs to be on Jesus.

    All that to say that a conference like that one is one I’d be happy to give a miss to.

    Liked by 1 person

  4. “Dead Heroes of the Faith, But Someone Seems to be Missing … Where do you see Jesus mentioned …?”

    They probably didn’t include the Lord Jesus Christ in their list of dead heroes, because they really do still believe that Jesus rose from the dead on the third day, so, in *their* old-fashioned belief system, He isn’t dead any more, and is therefore disqualified from appearing in their list of dead heroes of the faith.

    Have you any more difficult mysteries than this that you need me to solve for you?

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  5. The church I’m thinking of leaving uses Sunday school material (for children 6-12) that has, over the course of 6 years of junior Sunday school material, 29 characters – 26 from the Bible and Constantine, Calvin and Luther – that they have pictures of to highlight them. Ahab, Malachi and Josiah are on the list – Jesus is not…

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  6. “They probably didn’t include the Lord Jesus Christ in their list of dead heroes, because they really do still believe that Jesus rose from the dead on the third day, so, in *their* old-fashioned belief system, He isn’t dead any more, and is therefore disqualified from appearing in their list of dead heroes of the faith.”

    John, the argument could be made that if Jesus were “alive” to them they would actually talk about Him more.

    Liked by 1 person

  7. Mr. Allman: May I ask a related question?

    When Calvinists engage history, why is it that they always jump from the Book of Acts to the 16th century (with maybe a passing nod to some of the writings of Saint Augustine)?

    Were there no heroes of the faith in those intervening centuries? Like, you know, Ignatius of Antioch, Saint Polycarp, Saint Clement of Rome, Saint Irenaeus of Lyons, Saint John Chrysostom, Saint Athansius, et al., on and on? It seems to me that some of those folks played fairly major roles in Church History. Some were even martyrs for Jesus, which has traditionally been regarded as a pretty big deal.

    Just curious. I love Church History and all, but the truncated, highly selective version thereof represented by this conference strikes me as rather a-historical.

    Liked by 1 person

  8. This just seems to me to be another money making scheme where there books will be set out on tables for sale. It has nothing to do with Jesus. I don’t personally care what a lot of dead men’s doctrines were, they are primarily false. I do like C.S. Lewis, but he wasn’t about exalting his theories, he was about exalting Christ.That man spent a lot of time trying to disprove God and couldn’t, so he became a Christian.

    Liked by 2 people

  9. …and one more thing, while I’m on a roll.

    John: You know that’s not what Julie Anne at SSB was getting at, you know what she meant, you know that your rationale in your post was not the reason they didn’t include Jesus in the build up to their Big Conference, you know that all you were engaging in was a cutesy wordplay that had nothing whatsoever to do with the truth or the reality of the situation.

    You know this to be irrefutable fact. It is, at the end of the day, just another form of lying; the heart’s there. Why does that not surprise me, coming from you, John?

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  10. “What’s all this I hear about Transformers and their theology? Who cares what Optimus Prime and Megatron believe? What? Oh …Reformers?? Never mind.”
    — Emily Litella

    Liked by 1 person

  11. @ Julie Ann

    “The point is they seem to place these dead heroes in a more prominent place in their lives, in their words, in their preaching, than Jesus. Are you okay with that?”

    I don’t know these people. They don’t “seem” to do anything of the kind to me, but that is probably only BECAUSE I don’t know them. I don’t particularly WANT to get to know them, or to learn about them. (Some might recall that I made an appearance here some months ago because I had a Google alert on Tony Miano’s name, because of something that had happened in Scotland a bit more relevant to my typical web presence than my foray into this blog turned out to be at the time.)

    However, taking your word for it that they *are* as the *seem* to be to you, for the sake of argument, my answer to your question is “No”. I would NOT be “OK” with them, or ANY church leader or professing believer, ACTUALLY placing dead heroes in a more prominent place in his life, words, or preaching, than the place he assigned to the Lord Jesus Christ himself, assuming that this is what “they” have been doing.

    I suspect that what they would say in their defence (if it wasn’t for the fact that several of them aren’t on speaking terms with you and quite possibly consider you to be so-to-speak The Wicked Witch of the West for having criticised them so often), is that studying what church leaders of the period of history called The Reformation had to say about the Lord Jesus Christ, helps them, and would help others living in modern times, to know Jesus better, because, as these dead so-called heroes explained the scriptures (especially those about Jesus) in the language of their time, having read it and interpreted it in a way characteristic of many who lived in those olden days, they uttered truths that we lose sight of at our peril. I am not saying this myself, but I think it is how they would try to defend their dead heroes shindig.

    Thank you for publishing my comment, Julie Ann, and for saying that it was a “cute” comment. It was such an *obvious* comment for anyone to make, mind you, that I am surprised nobody has said how much it hit the nail on the head.

    @ Jeff Crippen & Tim

    I agree (quite strongly) with the comments of both Jeff Crippen and Tim, who posted the second and third comments respectively, before I posted the fourth comment on this blog post.

    I like the worship heroes who are still alive even less than I like the worship of dead heroes.

    @ Lydia

    “the argument could be made that if Jesus were ‘alive’ to them they would actually talk about Him more”

    Yes, I suppose that argument could be made. Be Julie Ann’s guest, if you want to make it.. To be honest though,many of “them” probably shame me by talking about Jesus more than I do, or than Julie Ann does for that matter, especially given the dead heroes whom they adulate, who are by-and-large renowned for each talked about Jesus rather a lot, before he died.

    @ Dianeski

    “When Calvinists engage history, why is it that they always jump from the Book of Acts to the 16th century (with maybe a passing nod to some of the writings of Saint Augustine)?”

    I don’t know. I am not a Calvinist. Maybe it’s an example of “groupthink”? The few Christians I know who would describe themselves as “Calvinists”, none of whom have two heads, although a few sometimes admittedly seem only to have half a brain, don’t actually do this though, at least, not whilst they are talking with me.

    @ Retha

    Some people (me for one) don’t like pictures that purport to be realistic representations of Jesus’ physical appearance during his earthly ministry, or *approve* of such pictures for that matter.

    @ Truth Detector

    And may God bless you too, brother. Or may he *rebuke* you, for that matter, if you ever need *that* particular service from Him, in order the better to serve Him.

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  12. The primary vision of JeremiahCry ministries is the advancement of the Kingdom of God through the biblically prescribed means of the public proclamation of the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

    First impression:
    BUZZWORD HEAVY.
    DOTTING ENOUGH T’S TO CROSS THE EYES.
    Just from that, I’d expect it to be BS in a Gospelly(TM) Silk Stocking.

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  13. @DianeSki:

    When Calvinists engage history, why is it that they always jump from the Book of Acts to the 16th century (with maybe a passing nod to some of the writings of Saint Augustine)?

    Because that was the time of CALVIN! CALVIN! CALVIN!

    Exactly the same view of Church History as the Mormons and Jehovah’s Witnesses: The Book of Acts as a mythological “Holy History”, then all was Apostasy and Heresy until Our Founder (whether Calvin, Joseph Smith, Charles Taze Russel, David Koresh, or Jim Jones) finally Got It Right and Restored the True New Testament Church as GOD Intended It.

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  14. @Scott:

    People who love theology more than Jesus Christ are very easy to spot.

    Because they resemble classic Communists in their Ideological Purity, Ideological Snobbery, and Attitude.

    Liked by 1 person

  15. If you’re going to spend $75 just to get into a conference, at least make it something enjoyable — like AnthroCon, Further Confusion, Equestria LA, BronyCon…

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  16. Or spend $135 and attend an awesome upcoming conference called “The Church Pain Paradox: Understanding and Healing from Desctructive Religious Experiences.” November 7-8 in Portland. The woman leading it, Connie Baker, is *phenomenal* Assuming, of course, that you’re of the persuasion able to be taught by a woman…

    http://www.thechurchpainparadox.com

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  17. “What’s all this I hear about Transformers and their theology? Who cares what Optimus Prime and Megatron believe? What? Oh …Reformers?? Never mind.”
    — Emily Litella

    This was the laugh of the day for me. I do remember Emily (and Gilda) fondly.

    Liked by 1 person

  18. Interesting dialogue here on this topic, for I too, have been a participant in the “conferenced system” of the culture of what is defined as Christianity in this century. I will share on a personal level here so as to not add insult to those who are commenting for we each have a story to our life.

    I love Paul’s words here, writing under the inspiration of God, the Holy Spirit, found in 1 Corinthians 3. This whole chapter is rich in truth and worthy of serious study; just a few verses here that speak to us: “For when one says, “I am of Paul,” and another, “I am of Apollos,” are you not carnal? Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers through whom you believed, as the LORD gave to each one? I planted, Apollos watered, but God gave the increase. So then neither he who plants is anything, nor he who waters, but God gives the increase.” 1 Cor. 3:4-6

    “For we are God’s fellow workers; you are God’s field, you are God’s building.” 1 Corinthians 3:9 Love this verse, for when we become born again by the Spirit of our Living God, the Holy Spirit, comes reside in the temple, which is our body…..our bodies house the Holy Spirit, so we can now worship God in spirit and truth wherever we are….no longer do we make pilgrimages to Jerusalem.

    “For no other foundation can anyone lay than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ.” 1 Corinthians 3:11. The Apostle Paul, even as a great inspiring evangelist, teacher of the truth of the Gospel as he was in history, still points souls to Jesus Christ, and not himself nor any other man and soul proprietor of foundational truth. What amazing faith!

    My Dad raised sheep on our farm growing up as a child and I loved our sheep, especially the lambs; they are precious and wonderful to hold. When our sheep saw an opening in the fence, like any other fenced in animal, they chose to escape to the nearby grasslands for the “fresh stuff,” instead of that dried up baled hay. So when Dad asked us kids to help out in rounding up those sheep, he always reminded us “to watch for the leader and corral that one in first because the rest will follow.” He was right. In every instance, once we herded the leader in, the rest obediently followed him into the pen. Pigs and cattle by the way, do not exhibit this characteristic, they are rugged and stubborn and took longer to chase back into their perspective pens, pasture.

    We are like those sheep of my youth and I fell into the same trap of following man, instead of God at His Word. When I became born again, I began reading my Bible for the very first time in my life and loved/still love every Word that God, the Holy Spirit reveals to me, for every believer in Jesus Christ, loves and seeks truth. Throughout my years as a Christian, there came about a movement in which “spiritual elitism” was promoted and encouraged within Christian communities and we were commanded to follow those elitist leaders. As the Name of Jesus became lesser and lesser, the names of man became louder and louder to the point that the measure of our faith is now based on:

    1) How many conferences you attend
    2) How many books you read from the “Christian bookstore venue”
    3) How much you watch TBN and God TV, etc. networks
    4) How many Christian band concerts you attend, whether its at an event center or in someone field and how much greasy Christian food one can consume
    5) How many Bible Studies you attend where the Bible is never opened up for truth, but you follow every word penned by Mike Bickle, Chuck Pierce, Paula White, or Joyce Meyers….and for good measure Benny Hinn.
    6) How much boasting and bragging you can do in promoting your own goods works to others so they may hear of the great wonders of yourself…church “testimony time” gives way to “praising the self” to the assembly where the Name of Jesus and Praise to our LORD is rarely voiced. Extremely rare.

    I too, like one of those sheep following the strong willed leaders of our churches, have spent “big bucks” in attending conferences such as these and even “bigger bucks” in purchasing their wares and tares after the show (one thing I will not purchase is a tattoo or nose ring). Yes, I WAS a part of the “Christian Culture” that we have created here in this country and desired to “be like the spiritually elite” that surrounded me, for I was made to feel like a nothing for not following certain men and women’s teachings. Hence, they become lords over your life with the words they choose to speak from their hearts.

    And oh, how the churched can make you feel like you do not measure up for not attending a Todd Bentley revival, for example…..they are professionals in speaking “you don’t know as much as I do for you have not been a Christian as long as me” when you choose not to follow man. Yes folks, I have literally been told this for NOT attending certain “events” when I do not believe in the false teachings of certain individuals.

    Of all the conferences I have attended, there was but one that truly ministered to my soul, conducted by a man who loves Jesus as His own. This conference was free with a “free will” offering taken, no admission charge with no pressure to purchase books, cds, dvds, etc. I left refreshed and renewed in my faith for the Name of Jesus was proclaimed, and in a packed auditorium, we sang worship hymns of old with no musical instruments, we heard the Word of God with our Bibles (most people attending brought their Bibles as wise Bereans should) opened to test everything this man preached, and our trip home was filled with joy in knowing that we were fed sheep. And we praised God for His faithfulness as this assembly glorified Him and not that of any man or woman.

    Please allow me to speak honestly here…..if churches truly preached and taught the Word of God, and lived lives pleasing and glorifying to our LORD, why then do we even need to attend conferences for pay. Would not that money be better spent giving it freely, anonymously to our brothers and sisters in Christ, for say, their medical expenses, their shelter, food and clothing, a trip to their homes for visitation in encouragement in their faith edifying the Body of Christ?

    And I believe some of these comments are right in pointing out that when we consciously choose to place man on the pedestal of the golden calf, we have hence, replaced Jesus Christ. Does not the word “antichrist” literally mean “in place of Christ.” And I have been guilty of assimilating into the religious Christian culture as well, and am enjoying the fruits of being called out of that system where there is no water, no eternal life. Psalm 63:1-5

    Liked by 3 people

  19. John Allman said,

    “…if it wasn’t for the fact that several of them aren’t on speaking terms with you and quite possibly consider you to be so-to-speak The Wicked Witch of the West for having criticised them so often…”

    “Several”? You mean guys other than Tony Miano are sucking their manly thumbs and sulking because Julie Anne had some hard questions for them? Honestly, I’m not sure I’ve even heard of any of the men on that list, apart from Miano. Has she really ticked off that many guys?

    Interesting. JA, you’re even busier than I thought you were! 😉

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  20. Katy

    Well said…

    “We are like those sheep of my youth
    and I fell into the same trap of following man,
    instead of God at His Word.”

    “when we consciously choose to place man
    on the pedestal of the golden calf,
    we have hence, replaced Jesus Christ.”

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  21. Julie Anne

    Well said…

    “I am convinced that the further we go away from the Bible
    **and elevate men,** the further we get away from God.”

    “What is ironic is most of “these men” claim to be *sola scriptura,*
    yet they go beyond scripture to satisfy their itching ears.”

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  22. @ Katy

    During childhood, in about 1965, I believe God showed me that during my later life, I could expect to suffer the indignity of being thought mad.

    God posed me a challenging question during an intense period of my coming back to faith from the wilderness, in 1985. Which would I rather be, when I was older, somebody who belonged to him and knew it, but also somebody whom other believers were most likely to suspect of not being a real Christian, albeit not completely unknown, or somebody who didn’t belong to him at all, even though he thought he did, whom other believers were likely to look upon as a great Christian leader, with a magnificent ministry, one of those whom others considered least likely to be unsaved despite his public professions of faith.

    I made my choice, and today I am what I am, more-or-less exactly what I believe that the God of Moses who gave his very *name* as “I AM WHAT I AM” enabled me to foresee that I would be, one day. The Lord is magnificent. He is our King, nobody else.

    I cringe whenever I hear people names-dropping famous Christians, or mentioning their special places of pilgrimage, blessing or revival, tourist destinations for the faithful, such as Toronto became during the 1990s.

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  23. Serving said:

    “Several”? You mean guys other than Tony Miano are sucking their manly thumbs and sulking because Julie Anne had some hard questions for them? Honestly, I’m not sure I’ve even heard of any of the men on that list, apart from Miano. Has she really ticked off that many guys?

    Evidently I do have a reputation. But I don’t think they know what to do with me. I have heard from 3 recognizable names that word on the block is that I am scary and to watch out for me. (LOLOLOL)

    The problem is they can’t put me in a box. When I see someone acting like a bully in a public forum, sometimes I will confront that behavior publicly. If they see me say something positive about Peter Lumpkins (that he wrote a paper for how to deal with child sex abuse for the SBC), they think I’m siding with everything of his. When they see me publicly say something positive about Dustin Germane or JD Hall, they don’t know what to make of that because they are trying so hard to fit me in a doctrinal box. I just told Dustin that his daughter is cute on Twitter yesterday. I’m sure he or I will get in trouble for that 🙂

    I don’t mind keeping that reputation. I don’t care to please men. I just don’t like bullies.

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  24. I’m convinced of two things.

    1. Conferences are pretty much 99 percent crap. I admit at one point I was amazing by rock star preacher line ups until I realized all that these guy do is write books and blogs and go to conferences to talk about theology or in this case, “dead heroes”, but they don’t actually do anything in the realm of practical application. Its self-glorifying garbage.

    2. When one of these guys inevitably gets busted for banging his mistress on the side, he will eventually quietly be removed from the all star line up and the others will pretend he never existed and never take any responsibility for promoting him to the crowd.

    *If you need a recent example of this, notice how quickly R.W. Glenn just fell of the map with no mention from TGC, John Piper, Todd Friel or any of the others who promoted his teaching materials. and put him on their conference dockets. R.W. Who?

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  25. 2. When one of these guys inevitably gets busted for banging his mistress on the side, he will eventually quietly be removed from the all star line up and the others will pretend he never existed and never take any responsibility for promoting him to the crowd.

    The exception to this is C.J. Mahaney, of course. He’s special and I don’t know why.

    You’re sure right about R.W. Glenn – – that was odd. Todd Wilhelm got the story here.

    Here’s a YouTube with Piper and Glenn. I’ve read that Glenn’s affair was going on for about 3 years, so during the time of this video.

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  26. Somehow the poster screams “VISION FORUM” to me, even though I don’t recognize any of the names from that source, and they’re obviously dressed more “hipster” than “historical”. And for those familiar with Jacksonville, aren’t we glad that the Robert Gray they name happens to be black and not associated with THAT atrocity?

    But to the poster, since Hebrews 11 is the faith Hall of Fame as it were, I don’t object to their suggesting that the Reformed divines would count as such, and which of us, no matter what our own theological bent, would state that the heroes of our own heritage–whether it be Luther, Spener, Wesley, whoever–ought to be counted among them? No?

    The big thing I would likely object to is not a sincere Calvinism (which is not TULIP or the Synod of Dort, BTW), but rather an unthinking theology of any kind which tends to devolve into mere hero worship. No?

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  27. “The exception to this is C.J. Mahaney, of course. He’s special and I don’t know why.

    You’re sure right about R.W. Glenn – – that was odd. Todd Wilhelm got the story here.”

    Yes, Todd’s blog is one of the very few that pressed this story. I’m a little passionate about this one, because Glenn was a guy I followed when I was sucked into the neo-cal hipster thing (a bit of a revolt from my IFB upbringing).

    What really ticks me off is that these guys set themselves up well beyond the limits of their local church ministry, into a broader realm of conference ministry to the “universal” church, as sort of new age apostles. BUT as soon as one of them messes up, it quickly becomes a quiet “local church matter.”

    Nothing to see here. Move along. We are dealing with it.

    This is what I HATE about the conference circuits. Guess what, if you are going to make yourselves little conference mini-popes, then when you fall, you don’t have the expectation to fade into obscurity, with private church discipline. And if you advertise this guy as trustworthy (John Piper and Todd Friel), then don’t think you don’t have a responsibility to tell people that you were wrong about this guy. I’m one of those guys that bought RW Glenn CD’s and paid conference fees, all while he was living a double life. And I guess I’m owed no explanation because I’m not in his local church.

    If you look at Todd’s blog, one of the Pastors of Glenn’s church responds and basically tells everyone not to talk about it or else they are “sowing discord.” Typical. And then he promises a forthcoming statement on the website. Did it ever come? No. Cover it up and let him slip into obscurity.

    Meanwhile, our friends over at Wretched Radio move most of their Drive By Series featuring RW Glenn, to the bottom of the pile on the online store and never mention dear ole Bob Glenn again.

    Why does CJ get a pass? I’ve always assumed it was because it was a founding member, the other guys were quick to defend him, and instead of admitting they were wrong and shouldn’t have been quick to defend, they go with the whole, “That’s my story and I’m sticking to it” routine.

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  28. Drove by Redeemer 3x/week back when i lived in the Cities. Always seemed like a sleepy little evangelical church to me, and then apparently around 2012 hit the big time with a 3-4x enlargement and a big mortgage. 2.2 million smackeroos. As Mel Brooks noted in “Spaceballs”, “Use the Schwartz”, I I guess.

    Was Mahaney credibly accused of adultery, too, or was it more the failure to report child molestation and abuse of position that people dislike about him?

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  29. @ John,

    The Lord may well rebuke me for 10,000 things, and after He’s done with that, He’ll have about a million more to go. He rebukes me regularly and I have it coming.

    But I also know we have a God who rebukes lies and disingenuousness, and I am telling you right now, your first post was that in spades–and you know it. Whether you care about it or not is your business and God’s.

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  30. One other thing, John, as I’m still on a roll…

    You like to congratulate yourself a good bit (e.g., your comment “hit the nail on the head”, and you were surprised nobody noticed just how much, and of course that maudlin bit about being the real deal Christian yet though “mad” by others, that great and wise fork in the road you took. Why you poor brave hero, the one who sees round us all.

    Oh yes, and using the same name as our Lord used for Himself–the I AM WHAT I AM line. There is this thing called blasphemy, and not a good thing at all, John, pretty ugly stuff.

    Thank you for showing us the fruits John. Informative.

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  31. One who refers to both himself and the Lord God with the that special name (that the rabbis of old were afraid even to mention) used by the Lord as a special identifier for Himself in the same sentence is not one from who’s mouth an indifferent “whatever” should proceed. I’d think that person ought to fall flat on their face in repentance and fear. Perhaps such a person hadn’t ought to be so concerned with God’s rebuke of others.

    But you live your own life, John, you’ll one day give an account, as will we all.

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  32. Julie Ann Smith (assuming that you are), your comment of OCTOBER 3, 2014 @ 1:33 PM gave me the impression that Mahaney actually HAD been caught “banging his mistress on the side”, i.e. that he HAD been accused of adultery. (Can you see why?) Thank you for clarifying (in your OCTOBER 3, 2014 @ 5:01 PM comment) that I had misunderstood that earlier comment of yours.

    We already established several months ago that I was in the wrong place here, because so much of this blog is devoted to criticising people on a fairly short list of targets of frequent criticism, and I know almost nothing about any of them, and therefore don’t want to join in the criticism, or defend those criticised either, or to learn about those criticised.

    Thank you for not taking offence at my first “cute” comment on this thread, which I returned here after a long absence to make. I have added some extra comments, which I hope somebody appreciates.

    Please do not take offence either if I soon resume my habit of not posting here. I have read some excellent comments that I agree with in this thread. However, there is one person here whose comments have been directed against me personally. I have so little to contribute that it isn’t worth my remaining here, if there is even one person who finds my presence annoying.

    You are welcome to visit my own WordPress blog, but I won’t take offence if you never do. If you do visit my blog, you will learn quickly why I don’t feel the need to linger here.

    In case I don’t post again, let me say this now: Goodbye, at least until the next time you post a thread that arouses some passing interest in me, and there is something short I would like to say.

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  33. And in keeping with my new found two-post-at-a-time tradition, I despise that word “whatever”.

    So unbecoming on the tongue of anyone over the age of 15, expresses pure contempt, but in such a juvenile manner. I correct my adolescent children when they use it; I want them to get a job some day and move on to capable adulthood.

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  34. Sorry, Julie Anne. That wording of mine was indeed clumsy. (I’m tired.) All I meant was that I had supposed that you, the Julie Anne whose blog this is, were the Julie Anne *Smith* mentioned in connection with some court case or other brought by somebody called Chuck something, if I remember correctly. I was sort of inviting you to correct me, if you are a different Julie Anne from her. It’s not important.

    You run a jolly lively blog, in the sense that you attract a lot more comments on your posts than I do on the posts on my own blog. This creates a strong sense of community here.

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  35. Yes, you are correct, that is me. The Chuck something would be Chuck O’Neal who is still the same wolf in sheep’s clothing who is now best buddies with Tony Miano.

    We do have a great community here. I love it.

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  36. I hope you don’t mind that I haven’t got the time to do justice to your project, by making this blog’s comment pages a home from home for myself. I have no loyalty to you or to the people you criticise, no calling to get involved with what somebody once described to me (if I can be allowed to paraphrase the gist, from distant memory) as a refuge for people whom those whom this blog criticises have offended, creating in them a need to recover from that.

    I wouldn’t be much use here if worked on trying to fit in better here, because I have no experience of any of the regular targets of criticism, or of the sort of abuse that they are being accused for dishing out. I am never likely to feel at home with them, or with you and your more devoted followers.

    I’m staying as a follower of this blog, and (if that’s OK with you) I might make comments occasionally. I’ll try to keep them (as you put it) “cute”.

    Incidentally, I have had, and am still having, some experience of libel actions. You are welcome to email me about the one you defended against Chuck O’Neal. My contact details are on my blog.

    Farewell.

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  37. They did not include the Lord Jesus Christ because he is not on the agenda, we only play the Jesus card when we are ranting at people in public over a loudspeaker and annoying those passing by or getting arrested for being a public irritant and then going on social media portraying our plight. Or the presup mister himself that says we cant know what we know unless we have an arbiter of all knowledge and he does that while typing on a computer that was developed with methods of evidence and mechanisms that refute his claim. That is badly worded I am working on that. Or those that belittle women, without women the church would have shriveled up way back in the day and they have been treated like trash for well always in many faith communities.

    I have an idea why dont they all come to a conference and just pray, pray for each other, pray for the attendees, have communion and listen, really listen to the needs of the attendees and then pray and offer real communication. That would be a sight and it would be worth 75 bucks which is not an unreasonable price for a conference to be honest. But Im a heretic and I hate God so what do I know.

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  38. HUG “The primary vision of JeremiahCry ministries is the advancement of the Kingdom of God through the biblically prescribed means of the public proclamation of the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

    First impression:
    BUZZWORD HEAVY.
    DOTTING ENOUGH T’S TO CROSS THE EYES.
    Just from that, I’d expect it to be BS in a Gospelly(TM) Silk Stocking.”

    In a way its a schtick, in their clown act they stand on a box, I mean literally, and yell at people with a microphone with the desire to provoke a response. Think Nuremberg circuite 1938, I dont say they are Nazi’s at all but the ritual outside of realism and apart from the real needs of the people you are suppose to communicate with. They have a one trick pony and they will beat that poor horse to death over and over again.

    Then there is the presuppositionalism, which means we have our belief and we will go cherry pick the evidence to support our worldview and if we can’t find any evidence we will just well, make it up. Christ invaded history, became one of us and he listened. I cant support this to much with scripture but rather experience, Christ listens to our prayers far more that answering them with verbal rantings from atop a box with a megaphone. Christ in the real world today does not follow people around haranguing them with cheap one liners and sophomoric apologetics. He listens, and in a still small voice, often drown out by the world, including these folks, but He does get through with light. I may well be wrong but that is how I have experienced it.

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  39. Julie Anne,
    Your comment above with this video with Piper? (OCTOBER 3, 2014 @ 1:33 PM)

    I read very similar concepts out of the writings of the cultic Watchman Nee who was very influential in the early Shepherding Discipleship Movement. Nee wrote something nearly identical in one of his books — that if you didn’t get enough sleep, you were sinning. I had this talk with a young mother who was so stressed out because she wasn’t sleeping (like most young mothers), and she was confused and felt condemned.

    Why am I not surprised?

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  40. Mahaney and his ilk are tools, trust me as one tool to another we can spot each other. As to the physical work out video by Piler, Paul said there was some use for physical work out if I am remembering the scripture correctly . But it is the spiritual workout we should look for. How about a clear phrase concerning the abuse of kids, women, men , by non repentant enders. How about raking in bucks while lying about the evidence that supports and old earth creation and the validity of the ToE. Even more so a repudiation of the concept of the witch children of africa and the idea that children can even be influenced by satan, talk about a caustic theology. These are our children and they experience God on a real level every day than most of us.

    Maybe we could start by honoring women, being October is domestic violence awareness month awareness and most domestic violence happens to women, no offense to the men that suffer from domestic violence. I do know one thing the church would have died on the vine if it was not for women, all the men ran away save maybe John, when Jesus was crucified. It was the women that stayed, wanted to anoint Jesus and he appeared to them first. I never quite understood why paul did not pick up on that part of the narrative when he penned some of his most “controversial” text. Personally I did my best and it was concerned women that saved me. They really were there by my side. Men as well, it was sort of a family affair, but I thought it important to emphasize the female aspect of my help in the faith.

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  41. Truth Detector,

    Thank-you for that faith reminder; the name “I AM” only belongs to our LORD, not to that of any man in the OT, NT, or in our present age. His Name is Holy as the angels in heaven are continuously singing “Holy, Holy, Holy.” This is humbling in truly acknowledging that I, for one, cannot totally fathom the Holiness and Glory of our LORD for my/our minds are so finite. Until that day when we are in the presence of Jesus, our Savior and Redeemer, then, we shall truly know and understand the greatness of His Majesty. Praise His Holy Name.

    God bless and protect you, TD.

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  42. @brian:

    In a way its a schtick, in their clown act they stand on a box, I mean literally, and yell at people with a microphone with the desire to provoke a response. Think Nuremberg circuite 1938, I dont say they are Nazi’s at all but the ritual outside of realism and apart from the real needs of the people you are suppose to communicate with.

    Actually, it was the other way round. Foreign eyewitnesses to Nuremberg 1938 described them as “Revival Meetings”.

    Like

  43. @CindyK:

    I read very similar concepts out of the writings of the cultic Watchman Nee who was very influential in the early Shepherding Discipleship Movement.

    Watchman Nee — among Born-Agains back in the Seventies he was the Fifth Evangelist, right up there with Matthew Mark Luke & John, and everything he wrote was quoted as SCRIPTURE(TM).

    Like

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