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There is now overwhelming evidence that the for-profit arm of Vision Forum is indeed closing at the end of the year. Also, there are public statements alluding Doug Phillips’ public statement of repentance was not genuine.
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To save some time, I will relay each new development and brief summary in no particular order. At the end of the post, I will post a timeline so you can see how it all fits together.
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Compelling Evidence of the End-of-Year Closing of Vision Forum Business
The biggest news you may have heard is that T. W. Eston at Jen’s Gems is reporting that Vision Forum, Inc., the for-profit arm, will be closing effective December 31, 2013. I’ve asked Mr. Eston if he could provide source information and he has respectfully declined in order to preserve his sources’ anonymity.
Today there were two new comments confirming Eston’s assertions of Vision Forum, Inc., closing:
TnT Says:
November 29, 2013 at 1:32 pm
I have numerous friends who are employed by VFI and have been told they will no longer have a job as of Dec. 31st, 2013. Tis true indeed.
noturniptruck Says:
November 29, 2013 at 4:42 pm
ditto! I can also verify that!
This most recent comment is the most revealing, seemingly coming straight from Vision Forum:
mike race Says:
November 30, 2013 at 11:10 am
In an email my wife received this morning from Vision Forum it stated this near the bottom:
“By placing an order you will be participating in our inventory liquidation sale. This means great prices for you as we liquidate our entire remaining inventory. Due to the nature of this sale, all purchases are final and returns will no longer be accepted. This is your last opportunity to buy our books, CDs, DVDs, and toys for you and your family, so get them before they’re gone!”
Be sure to take a look at the post, because there is a lot of information – especially in the comments. But please keep in mind that none of it is confirmed with identifiable sources. I checked the Vision Forum site and the Vision Forum blog and there is no notice of this.
Incidentally, SSB blog reader loveoneanother, left this comment Monday:
Home School Enrichment Magazine just sent me a Black Friday ad for Vision Forum’s Catalog. I could see Vision Forum sending it to me, but another homeschool company? Doesn’t that seem like an inappropriate endorsement given the circumstances? Maybe I am reading into it too much!
loveoneanother forwarded the e-mail to me and I took a screenshot of part of it:
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You can see similar ads on the Vision Forum, Inc., website. I’ll keep you posted if I get more credible information. (I guess it doesn’t bother this homeschool business to promote Vision Forum’s wares, even under the current circumstances.)
Today at the Vision Forum site they are announcing the last day of Black Friday sale with 50% off everything. Maybe tomorrow will be 70% off everything?
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San Antonio Independent Christian Film Festival is Postponed for 2014
I’d like to bring your attention to another business venture (he’d probably say “ministry) of Phillips and Vision Forum. In 2004, Doug Phillips founded the San Antonio Independent Christian Film Festival (SAICFF) which boasted of a competition with generous cash rewards (approximately $100,000). Just 10 days before Phillips’ first public statement, the following announcement was posted on the SAICFF website and Facebook page:
Update Oct. 21, 2013: The Christian Filmmakers Academy and SAICFF for 2014 have been postponed. Due in part to financial concerns and for other reasons, the Board of Vision Forum Ministries is looking to bring greater accountability to our practices and events, and therefore is allowing more time before launching this significant event once again. October 22
Did you catch the phrase, “financial concerns and for other reasons?” Inquiring minds want to know what other reasons.
Some notable friends of Doug Phillips weighed in on the conversation on the Facebook page announcement as people expressed their sadness about the cancellation:
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Were these men privy to Phillips’ personal affair and troubles? I wonder if we will ever find out.
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Voddie Baucham Reveals the Phillips Family Personal Damage Brought on by The “Esquire”
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Voddie Baucham has revealed more information that I have not seen published elsewhere. (Baucham was the first to publicly confirm that Phillips was no longer teaching elder at Boerne Christian Assembly.) A Facebook reader asked on Baucham’s Facebook page:
I am struggling with these questions as a homeschooling mom who has a huge amount of Vision Forum products in her home therefore has allowed my children to be taught by Doug Phillips. What do I tell them? That he was living a lie? Of course the Bible is the final authority on everything. Basically if you were to come forward with a similar confession what weight would all the books that you have written carry?
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You can read the entire response here. In the response, Baucham disclosed that Doug has lost his home due to the scandal:
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Warn them about the cost of sin. Tell them how Doug has damaged his marriage, lost his home, collapsed his ministry, and devastated his family spiritually, emotionally, and financially. Tell them how the enemies of God are rejoicing right now; how people like you are in turmoil.
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This was not any small home, but a 6,000 SF home. Sadly, I predict a major lifestyle change for the Phillips family.
As of yet, no one has been willing to come forward and identify themselves publicly to share these kinds of details. T.W. Eston (a pseudonym), who has recently begun submitting articles and responding to comments at Jen’s Gems blog, had this to say about the financial state that is to come upon the Phillips family. Eston has been given this information by unnamed informants:
The board of directors has given until the end of the year for Doug and his family to move out of the ministry-owned house. The VFM board of directors will repossess (and may have already repossessed) any and all assets that Doug purchased with VFM monies for his personal use. This includes everything from automobiles, home furnishings, and perhaps even clothing. Some may view this as retaliatory on the part of the board (and perhaps it is to some degree), but the fact of the matter is they have a legal obligation to do everything they can to remedy any tax fraud and fiduciary malfeasance that Doug Phillips may have perpetrated.
The VFM board will be liquidating all VFM assets, including the house, home furnishings, office equipment and furnishings, all remaining inventory, and the Vision Forum office building at 4719 Blanco Road, San Antonio, starting January 1, 2014.
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Vision Forum YouTube Videos
On the Vision Forum’s YouTube page, there are quite a few new videos which were uploaded late September and early October, just about a month before Phillip’s announced he was stepping down from Vision Forum Ministries in his public statement. This is a screenshot of the page in case it disappears, but presently, you can see the videos here. The videos uploaded were part of the Vision Forum, Inc., for-profit arm and are advertisements for products in the Vision Forum catalog. Why would someone make the effort to produce a bunch of videos if they thought their business ship was sinking? This action convinces me that Phillips had full intentions of keeping his Vision Forum business afloat.
Narcissists think like that. Just like the captain of the Titanic, they think they are invincible.
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In my snooping, I stumbled across something that could be part of the financial/business puzzle with regard to the Vision Forum business. Vision Forum, Inc., had an affiliate program which was suspended late March of 2013. This is what the website looked like before the program was suspended: And this is what it looks like now:
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This may or may not be significant, but I haven’t seen anyone discuss it and the new change occurred the month following Phillips stepping down or being forced out of his teaching elder position at Boerne Christian Assembly in February of 2013.
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The Secret of Happiness in the Home
According to the FORGE (Families Obediently Restoring Godly Education) Ministries website, FORGE Ministries hosted a conference on September 5-7, 2013, in which Phillips spoke. Phillips’ messages included:
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Session 1: The Doctrine of Fatherhood From Genesis to Revelation, Doug Phillips
And get a load of this next title:
Session 7: The Secret of Happiness in the Home, Psalm 128. Doug Phillips
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Do you think he canvassed his wife, Beall and his household to get a big “Amen” for that?
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Ancient Greece Tour
Vision Forum offered an Ancient Greece Tour and posted about it on their website. Phillips was slated to teach on the tour, but ended up not teaching. Did something come to light between the publishing of the trip itinerary and the actual trip that prevented Phillips from teaching? Here is an excerpt from the website indicating Phillips would be teaching:
The Lord answered our prayers by granting us a top-of-the-line cruise ship, dedicated to our group. The tour will be 9-10 days beginning in Istanbul, Turkey and ending in Athens. Your teachers will be Dr. Joe Morecraft, Bill Potter, and myself.
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Public “Show” of Repentance by Doug Phillips
Last night, I posted an article, Doug Phillips: “Disowns” Former Vision Forum Executive Assistant to President, Peter Bradrick, Calls Him “Destroyer” When Confronted about Sins about Peter Bradrick coming out publicly on his Facebook page which he recently made public. There is another revealing comment I found here from someone in the inner circle of Doug Phillips, Bob Renaud:
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This is more clear evidence that Phillips has not repented as he has led us to believe by his two public statements.
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Timeline Recap
February of 2013: seems to be the month that most people agree that he stepped down from Boerne Christian Assembly where he was one of two teaching elders (pastors).
March 26, 2013: The Vision Forum, Inc., affiliate program at Vision Forum, Inc., was suspended.
August 2013: A blog article by Doug Phillips, True Repentance. Was he really thinking about his own repentance when he wrote/posted this article? Or was this to benefit someone else?
September 5-7, 2013: Phillips spoke at the FORGE Ministries conference.
September 20-20, 2013: Ancient Greece Tour in which Phillips was slated to teach, but did NOT.
September 2013: Many Vision Forum advertising videos were uploaded to the Vision Forum YouTube account.
October 21, 2013: Board of Vision Forum Ministries canceled the Christian Filmakers Academy and events connected with San Antonio Independent Christian Film Festival (SAIFCC) (just 10 days before Phillips’ first public statement)
October 31, 2013: Phillips issues first public statement
November 11, 2013: Vision Forum Board announces the closing of Vision Forum Ministries.
November 14, 2013: Doug Phillips issued “clarification” statement which only muddied the waters.
November 26-27, 2013: Peter Bradrick comes forward publicly to share his involvement and pain.
November 28-29, 2013: People coming out publicly on Peter Bradrick’s Facebook page insinuating that Doug Phillips profession of repentance may not be genuine.
November 30, 2013: Notice on Vision Forum correspondence that they are liquidating inventory.
Spiritual Sounding Board 
WomanforFreedom – – You are welcome to submit something for a guest post on how your life has been impacted by Doug Phillips/Vision Forum/his family.
You know where to find me.
Oh, and thanks for that visual update: 4 white conversion vans, 2 white suburbans, etc. 🙂
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lol it’s just like the FLDS “God Squad” huh? I might try and work on something to submit to encapsulate, problem is, I am so wordy and “with child” so i might go off on a tangent about the other Doug and his coven, i mean place. I’m not near as good a writer as you are though JA–and let me just say how incredibly grateful and blessed i feel in having found a reputable site to discuss this stuff. I’m kinda like Gladys Kravitz, the nosy neighbor from “Bewitched” –gasp–yes i watch t.v.–lol– i always know what goin on down here in da hood;). Specially within the cult-de-sac
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You are hilarious and write very well. No worries, though, I can fine tune it 🙂
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well, i will give it some thought, prayer, and a look-see by the hubs as he has more of a proper filter than i do. It might be of some use–theres alot that hasn’t been said unfortunately. I just have to be careful to not use the stories that i know of only from hearsay–and stick to the actual verifiable things i know. Its often easy to get that skewed. Meantime–ill be your ‘man on the street’ reporter/gumshoe detective ;). Im sure today was probably a meeting about his comeback ala Ted Haggard–hey maybe they can go on tour together!!! They can title it “Doug’s really really very true Hazardous Journey and How I Was Tempted ,Even Though as a Female She isn’t Nearly As Smart as Me and I still Dominate”
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Actually, that sounds like more of a field trip for the kids. Do these Patriarchal dads really drive around in those vans when going to meetings? Don’t they have a “normal” size vehicle? I know my full-size passenger van sits in the driveway most days and is only utilized when we all have to go somewhere (church). Besides, it’s a gas hog.
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All white? Could be IRS. Hmmmmm.
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Yeah they actually even almost all do the all white versions of their mini buses . I stepped out to catch a pic and only dougies is there now . I’ll email you a pic tomorrow if they’re there again ;). Maybe they were putting up Xmas lights…… Oh wait ….. 😉
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LOL. You are having too much fun on your cult-de-sac. You know, if you would have started journaling from the very beginning, publishers would be banging at your door to give you a book offer.
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WomanforFreedom, quick question: do you generally remember the last time you observed JG over at the Phillips mansion? I’m curious about that and working on a theory….
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Well I hardly a writer -I’m
At that point in pregnancy where I have zero filter and I’m either gonna say something inappropriate or cry ;). Blame it on my weak female hormones. So Jezebel of me–which by the way every time they called me that I couldn’t help but think of Bette Davis in her beautiful dress gazing longingly out her window and actually feeling quite complimented . Not sure that’s what they had in mind 😆
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At Sweet t- I know exactly when it was because it was our anniversary which is in early February of this last year . That was when we had our ‘talk’
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You mean they are calling you Jezebel in your present with-child condition?
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dougie actually did with my daughter right beside me. Not sure if I was showing yet or not though . My daughter didn’t understand though she’s only 3 but she knows enough to have said ‘dat man bad ‘
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Funny Lynette ! I’ve always pictured Feds would be in all black with tinted windows . Nah unfortunately these are the same stick figure sticker conversion kidnap vans they always are
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When you say that’s when you had your “talk” are you referring to when dougie called you a jezebel, or a different talk WomanforFreedom?
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The talk I was referring to was to a certain feline in the pride. Dougie and I had recurrent conversations with the same name calling . I can think of 6 different adults who have called me names at various times over the years. Though not in my heart, I am the exact opposite of what ‘a godly’ woman looks like. It threatened their way of life for some strange reason . So they were pretty vocal. Plus I’ve never been quiet about how I thought things looked and they knew who was challenging them in the neighborhood . I didn’t care and that made it worse to them. To their way of being I was a heathen, but God knows my heart, my husband and pastor and family and friends know my sinful but earnestly seeking to die to the cross heart and that is truly what matters . It’s weird to see adult bullies . It just comes accross as very simple minded . It’s also weird to see grown men in costume. Really weird.
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“It’s also weird to see grown men in costume. Really weird.”
ya think?
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Would you please be sure to capture any future costumed performances in the cul de sac on video for us? I think in the midst of all of this a laugh would be much appreciated! 😉
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Now, now, Mrs. W. – – I don’t want this SSB blog to have the reputation of chortling (Doug Wilson’s term).
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Mrs w. I can assure you with the utmost sincerity that I will absolutely send pictures of said cult-de-sac should I peek and see any more costumed adult photo opportunities . I fear however those times may be at an end -sigh- I will miss the tri- corn hats and velvet breeches. I will miss my daughter clapping her hands and saying “ooooh mommy those mens are faaaaaancy”- and my hubby choking on his cereal. Life will be much duller when the cult -de sac just turns into a regular street and my dogs will particularly miss their special places mommy let’s them run to for their private moments of relief . Mrs W. You are right we have to have the chance to laugh at some of the idiocy that went on there. It’s either that or weep and I’ve done enough of that for the poor kids over there. Please know I take this situation very seriously but c’mon when you’re dealing with men in velvet pants and tights…….
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I posted this on another thread but want to share it here as well, especially for the San Antonio area bunch, who may not read other places:
It is a characteristic of human nature that some people what to have rules to live by, to simplify their thinking and not have to ponder the right and wrong of a situation. And it is also a characteristic of human nature that many people who end up in leadership want to make rules for everyone else, and then multiply them. The reason that rules multiply is that in application, every rule bumps into reality in ways that subvert the original intent, so a rule becomes more and more elaborate (this is regulatory theory which I have taught at the graduate level) in order to deal with the situations that don’t fit well with the original rule. And the leaders have to justify every rule they make, and the best justification is “God made the rule” even if it isn’t quite true, but a fairly distant extrapolation from scripture. Then you get systems to enforce the rule, including “church discipline”.
Jesus gave us a different system. He took all of the rules of the OT and made them into two very simple rules. Love God with all your being. Love your neighbor as you love yourself. And live accordingly. Simple, not elaborate, not easy, and perhaps in application different folks will see things differently. But no straight-jacket constraints to be enforced by some self-anointed dictator demanding you pay him for running your life.
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@attorney- Wow that is one of best , most concise and understandable explanation of how this works and how people are so easily compelled to follow. That was very helpful and I hope makes people feel better, it breaks my heart when the wounded ones think they must be ‘stupid’ to have bought into it when it simply isn’t true. Does that infer that said leader would have to be sociopathic or without true conscience?? That’s such a calculated manipulation . Thank you for that explanation . Any reading material you recommend re this??
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I think that many leaders are narcissistic. That is, they think more highly of themselves than they should, some willfully, and others ignorantly(!), and, when in leadership think they are blessed with authority to make the rules. As in “God called me, I am anointed, etc.” But the same thing happens in the secular world. The CEO of a large corporation makes the rules for the business and can make many mistakes. School superintendents, etc. Everybody with some kind of authority/responsibility tends to want to make rules, and some are necessary, of course. As in, you can’t have a retail business and not have policies about returns, employment, etc., that are, in effect, rules. And once there are rules, they proliferate and elaborate. Fact of life. Which is why I believe in small churches with priesthood of all believers organization — everybody has an equal say, and the pastor is an employee, not the boss, and has no role in the decision making of the body.
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I could read WomanForFreedom all day, these are so funny! I bet this process has been cathartic to you. Its been that way for a lot of us, especially the ones whose spouses were heavily supporting the Vision Forum gravy train and who were questioning the expenses and thinking inside, this guy is full of *^%&. I am curious because you said you are the exact opposite of what a Godly woman looks like. I can’t picture that because I don’t have a mental image of a Godly woman, I have a positive connotation with that phrase I guess. It could be a smiling grandma in church or a young person back from a missions trip full of energy or even my old small group leader in college who had…gasp….tattoos! Now a religious woman, or a fundamentalist woman, I have some pictures of those in my head, none of them good. But a Godly woman, a real Godly woman, could look anyway they wanted and still confidently know they are making a difference in the world!
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Thank you Jenny- look I’m a native Texan and Irish to boot , there’s not one part of my genetic makeup that blends well with playing follow the leader . 😋What I meant by being the opposite of what a ‘godly woman ‘ should look like was through the lens of their little house on the prairie filter . I’m very modern in appearance , I wear makeup , and shorts and pants lol and I let my kids run around in tank tops and diapers because it’s hot here , they’re with me, and I don’t think there’s anything cuter than a baby in a diaper . I think there are so many different ways one can look and still be a Godly woman . But they don’t. My husband prefers a wife to look like a woman not a shapeless entity and he is who I concern myself with pleasing. We have an outdoor pool not indoor and we wear bathing suits- sorry folks- my house, my rules lol I even let my kiddos swim in just their diapers . So that is what I mean by opposite. Not in God’s eyes… Just in theirs. I would never do or wear anything truly inappropriate. I would never prey on the attention of young men . I would never ever touch , hug , or do anything remotely physical with any male other than my husband. Not so in Dougies world though THEY were the epitome of ‘godly.’ This HAS been cathartic , I’ve enjoyed the chance to share and ‘chortle ‘.
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WomanforFreedom, I love your posts! I’m sorry about the way you were treated, but it sounds like you have a very good head on your shoulders and that you took it in good stride. Vision Form had an event close to my home last year and I actually met for the first time an online friend who goes to BCA. That was one strange encounter. Everything about the event was so fake! No reality to it at all. I didn’t go the event, just heard the report from her own mouth and felt so terrible for her. No one should live continually in a fantasy world, especially not when you have a leader like Doug. Good grief. Enjoy some real life and some real Jesus!
Is it because of ‘the talk’ on your anniversary that you can’t talk more about JG now?
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“To their way of being I was a heathen, but God knows my heart, my husband and pastor and family and friends know my sinful but earnestly seeking to die to the cross heart and that is truly what matters .” – WomanforFreedom
Thanks for reminding me. I sometimes get tired of being called a heathen (or “you have a problem with God/ the Bible”) at times too, for my “terrible sin” of understanding Titus 2 or “the man is the head (cranium, noggin, skull)” different from them. You encouraged me just when I needed it – you are my blessing today.
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Thanks Brooke ! I agree it’s so sad to talk to these women who have bought into this madness . Your heart bleeds for them and you want to shake them and say “I love you , but wake the heck up !” I don’t for a second think they’re stupid or bad intentioned (most of them). I don’t hate them for the hateful things they’ve said and done in response to me. I’m sickened by it and I’m sickened for their children. I make lots of jokes but this is serious dangerous stuff !
And if they only understood how their leader actually lives and behaves I think they would be sickened as well. But like Peter Bradrick I think they will have to see this for themselves firsthand or hopefully my prayer is of he gets the heck out of town, the sooner the better, and if he stays out of the limelight long enough, maybe eyes will start to open.
The hard part will be picking up the wounded pieces of their shattered faiths. God is Sovereign and can redeem all of this though and I trust and pray for that quickly.
As to my silence regarding JG, nobody is silencing me except myself. There are legality issues that don’t involve me but it’s not my info to share. Our discussions were just that and there’s children involved so I choose to not comment further on JG out of respect to that. I brought her up because I do feel like people should be warned and I have had actual personal interaction that isn’t hearsay.
Sorry to be vague. There are other blog sites that will talk much more about her in detail. As a friend to wounded families I’m just not comfortable giving details regarding her. I hope that doesn’t sound rude. I guard these kids pretty fiercely.
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Oh Retha I’m glad you received comfort but it isn’t truly from me. What I said is from Scripture. That’s just good ol pure honest Gospel .”There is therefore now NO condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh , but after the Spirit. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me FREE from the law of sin and death “- that’s Romans friend , count it a blessing to find yourself at the foot of the cross in a heap next to Paul. If it can’t be verified in scripture and I don’t mean lot testament proof texting … It’s a lie!!!!
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Now for my snarky man on the street update. Looking like the packing/moving is heading up. Ladders ladders everywhere !! Yip yip yip and a Hee Hee Heee!! It IS Christmas!!!! C’mon doggies, lets go for a spin round the block….;)
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Hmmm…where are on earth are they going to move? Thanks for the updates WomanForFreedom 🙂
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I’m assuming back to VA. Here’s hoping…..;)
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Wait a minute, W4F – – – I done a whole lot of moving in my life, but they didn’t require ladders, but moving trucks. Maybe he’s rejecting his anti-Christmas gig and putting up lights?
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Well JA I’m assuming you were and have been a good steward of the home God provided for you . They have not and are in what looks to be pre- move repair mode. But I’d like to think its lights … And that I can catch dougie up on a ladder dressed as an authentically historical elf sprinkling his charm and manly capabilities of ladder climbing around for all too see…In his little baby tiny green tights
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ohhhhhh – – yikes, that makes sense.
Your descriptions are . . .well . . hilarious.
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W4F: have you noticed their cars are gone? What kind of activity are you seeing there? Remember, they don’t believe in celebrating Christmas!
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Well…. Can’t you just picture it??? Hahaha dougie gleefully humming his favorite Bocelli masterpiece while his adoring flock gazes up in admiration of his … Tights 😭😭
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(looking for my barf bowl at the thought) 😉
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Any sign of the family this last while? I’m a bit concerned about Beall and the children.
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Yes not to worry they seem to be doing ok. They’re all there
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After reading this, I’m concerned for her safety. http://jensgems.wordpress.com/2013/12/11/doug-phillips-affair-or-criminal-clergy-sexual-abuse/comment-page-1/#comment-21577 (JA – if it’s not ok to post links I apologize!)
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WomanforFreedom, I am not sure that Virginia wants the Phillips family back in town. At least, no one that I know, and I know many!! I taught music in many a homeschool family, and I often heard the words, “Well, at least Doug isn’t around here anymore.” Texas didn’t seem far enough actually. Heh Anyway, thanks for sharing your perspective and Sherlock investigative services.
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I’ve appreciated and enjoyed quite a few of mr estons article but from my vantage point this is not verifiable or accurate. Beall is a very strong woman and is as guilty of brainwashing as dougie. As much sympathy as I have for her children , I have little to none for her . Beall was doing damage control her self not Doug . Her. Back in October trying to engage another local church to broker a legally binding agreement to quiet the poor girl Doug charmed. I don’t know what the whole ring issue is about Or what the girl thought it meant. But fortunately the church Beall reached out to chose to not engage the conflict and the girls family refused any sort of conciliation. I don’t doubt Doug gave her the ring and probably promised a lot of things but I seriously doubt he meant an inch of it. I got to see Beall reigning pretty high with a huge assortment of free labor and so on and so forth I could go on and on. I’m not a psychic and I don’t know exactly what goes on behind closed doors but Beall is not someone I personally worry about. She’s tough smart and creative . She has a tough life no doubt and one I wouldn’t trade for anything. But she isn’t unsafe. I’m sorry she chose the path she did and I pray they bring themselves out of it but that’s as charitable as I could ever be about her . This is only an opinion . But I truly think they are really reaching with that article from everything I see and know. Your worry is sweet and sincere and I’m not trying to make fun of it. I just don’t share these worries . But they all need prayer that part is true. Again this is merely my opinion and I’m sorry you are worried . I will pray that God will calm your sweet heart .
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@ Joyelle hahahaha ! I totally understand. I can’t imagine anywhere he has already left his mark will be feeling the same way. Who knows ?? I just pray this limits his control where ever he is led to be. I’m just selfishly glad he’s outta here !;)
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I am so glad to hear that – and at the same time sorry to hear that she doesn’t sound a whole lot better than her husband. The whole situation is just sick beyond words.
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I agree completely mrs W. She exerts almost as much control and power as dougie did because she owned the women and ‘instructed’ them how to he perfect like her . I’m sorry he was unfaithful to her . Truly. But I weep for the nanny. It’s all sick disgusting sad stuff.
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Mrs. W. – I’m fine with sharing links here. I couldn’t find any “ring” mentioned in the link. I’ll have to do a keyword search on that comment thread. It’s hard to keep up!
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JA This article http://jensgems.wordpress.com/2013/12/11/doug-phillips-affair-or-criminal-clergy-sexual-abuse/
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W4F – – I would love to do a study on wives of spiritual abusers. I’ve had a conversation with another blogger (Tom Rich, of FBCJax Watchdog blog) who had a spiritually abusive pastor and he is convinced after covering my story and looking at his own story that the wives are very much involved in the whole system of abuse.
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Thanks, A B Lever. I was looking in the comments and didn’t realize the ring part was in the article (or that there was a new article for that matter). This story keeps going and going and going . . .
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I think that would be a fascinating read! In my opinion they HAVE to be complicit. The whole structure of patriarchy depends on a wife as a help-meet. I saw it in my family growing up and this is why I was so keenly aware of the creep factor of these people. Beall is a very very intelligent woman. She had to do very little work ever- the reason given for that btw- why she had so many “helpers”- was do she could ‘be available to help her husband in any kind of emergency need he might have’- I call bs on that!! She didn’t have to ‘do’ anything but be a figure head, plan how to get all this weird crap covered and reap all the benefits that a queen gets to reap.
I’ve read Eston’s article over and over and it disturbs me to no end! The beginning half of who Doug is I’m ok with, but then it goes way off track into bizarre speculation. That Beall may be in mortal peril and polygamy and the continual outing of this poor girl though maintaining they are trying to protect her. I call bs. They are not protecting her – read through to the comments. By the way, there is zero proof that they were holding hands at the film festival or that she was even there. She had left the Phillips compound by then! As to the ring- I saw it a few times yes and I had daily interaction with these young people to kind if check in on how they were doing. When I saw I asked her if she had gotten engaged. The answer given was a laugh and a no that it wasn’t real – she wore it to keep men she was uninterested in at the gas station etc at bay. I did that in my 20’s too! There no more to that.
So I’m really starting to question their inside sources and again am glad I came to the right place to talk to like minded folks. Too much speculation going on leading to bizarre rabbit trails and taking away the real focus. This is just my opinion and I clarify that. This is no assertion that anything necessarily bad is intentioned. I think there is such a zeal for truth and healing and this is a hard subject to traffic in. I admire a lot of what Jen has done- she’s a groundbreaker in many ways. Mr. Eston is a great writer and has some very valid good info. But this article went pretty far. Beall is no beat down dog I assure you. And I really wish the only mention of the victim is just that, a victim who is not outted so she doesn’t feel further violation from all the rampant speculation and is free to pursue whatever legal recourse she needs to. Sorry for the rant.
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Thanks W4F – – I appreciate the balance you provide in your comments from someone who has had interactions, not based on speculation.
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Lol I’ll appreciate the typo correction on behalf of my terribly tired, can’t sleep, pregnant brain . By the way by ‘theojollios ‘ I meant ‘the Phillips ‘- no speaking in tongues over here- just dumb fat fingers and dumb iPhone autocorrect
Mod note: I think I got them all fixed now. JA
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You can turn the autocorrect off!!!!! Also the autocomplete, which is worse.
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A attorney I apologize. I will do so
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Btw I’d like to clear up something I said that may not have been clear . Last night , after reading the link the first time from mr eston , when I said I don’t know what the whole ring thing was about and that perhaps Doug had given it to her , I meant that . I did know the answer I had been given by HER but one never truly knows if she was covering for him or not. That would be speculation on my part. Now as to the ring itself if you saw it in person you would know it wasn’t a ‘real’ engagement ring or a real diamond so I took her story at face value . I was shocked that people have claimed to know that it was for sure an engagement ring and that he had made her promises and was going to leave or dispose of Beall. I’m sure there were false assurances and words and certain duties she thought she was supposed to do out of deference to him, but last night was the first I’d EVER heard of any supposed actual engagement . Dougies just not that dumb. He’s not the kind of guy to upset his very large apple cart.
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I’ve been following and so thankful God rescued my family from a fundamental cult we were in for 13 years. The similarities are bizarre.
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WomanforFreedom=
Greatly appreciate all your true, verified, first-hand *gossip*. I do think Doug was dumb enough to make the strategic blunder, a year or more ago, of failing to: resign Vision Forum, leaving any financial troubles others, openly embrace polygamy, leading any BCA sheeple who were willing into it as well, and become THE biggest, most charismatic name in the non-FLDS polygamy movement. A smaller pond, sure– but still a big fish. Only somewhat more seriously, my VERY first reaction when he resigned was that he’d been making promises to another woman to divorce Beall and marry her. Later on, I SO noticed that rock on Cassandra’s finger in the video!
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Grace – Welcome to the blog. When you have experienced spiritual abuse, the patterns will start popping out all over the place when you read other stories. It’s quite amazing how they all function they all seem to function the same way.
I’m glad that is behind you!
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I so think I should take backu statement that he isn’t dumb enough to upset his apple cart . Obviously he’s made grave huge stupid mistakes . I didn’t think he’d ever make the mistake of going full -polyg. Maybe you guys know/see more into it than I do. Bealls just mean and tough enough to NOT give him divorce or make it ugly so I don’t think he would divorce her but again , I would just be speculating . The ring …eh who knows?? Lol it would just be another lie he told if he told her it was real lol. I’m a girl- I learned the diff between real diamond and gum paste a loooong time ago😋 maybe it’s yet one more delusion he fed her.
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Welcome Grace! I hope you have found much healing and freedom since you left. I’m sure there will be people including myself who would love to have your insights when you feel compelled to share them as we all seek to understand /heal/ recover/and refresh ourselves in the aftermath of this destructive man and this dangerous ideology. Peace be with you ,friend
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BTW, not at all impressed with the direction of that most recent blog post. They say they protect the victim – – they are NOT. The picture, the description of the victim, searchable words, nope, this is not protecting a victim. Trying to solicit “stories” – – nope – sounds like the Patriarchal Enquirer.
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JA,
I do not know you, I do not know the people on the other blog but maybe everyone, including here should be careful what we say and write until we have all the fact. There is much speculation going on this blog post as well, not just over there. I like your blog so please do not take offence to this comment.
I am on the outside and it is not hard to figure out who this girls is whether they posted her picture or not. If this girl is a victim, which we do not know (maybe she is and maybe she isn’t) then she should get a back bone, step up and tell the truth to prevent this from happening to other young girls who are caught in the middle of situation like this. she can not live in fear her whole life and hide, if that is what is going on. We are all trying to know and find the truth and not meaning to speculate either.
I just think we should all be careful about speculation, even here. Just my 2 cents.
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It is important to protect the victimized , pray for true repentance for those who have been victimizers , I really pray that God convicts them , and reach out to those who need help dealing with the fallout and rejoice that God IS good. He uses these awful things to draw us closer to Him. It’s hard when bad things are done in the name of God . It’s so confusing , especially if it goes on for an extended period of time. I mean, from experience , if it goes on for long , especially for children , whoever is in control could tell you the sky is green and you REALLY actually believe it. Then when your eyes are finally opened , there’s a period of time where you are so confused by reality you don’t know who or what to believe . I’m afraid a lot of people are in that position right now . And it just grieves me. I want these people to know, there is hope and healing can happen and you CAN trust again- even in clergy . You will be changed , and you will be wary, but that’s ok. I’m just sick over this and I’ve said it before , the real healing can’t begin till this man is gone and marginalized, and never able to do these things again. Then we need to do what we can to stop this patriarchy movement altogether .period. It is NOT biblical . Period . I pray for the day this is gone , and maybe that won’t be till we reach Glory, so then please ,Come Soon Lord .
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Julie Anne
December 13, 2013 @ 12:03 AM
BTW, not at all impressed with the direction of that most recent blog post. They say they protect the victim – – they are NOT. The picture, the description of the victim, searchable words, nope, this is not protecting a victim. Trying to solicit “stories” – – nope – sounds like the Patriarchal Enquirer.
No I agree to some extent about the “victim” in this case. BUT the video is widely known and has been being passed around, ALOT!! It’s a public video out there that anyone can access…..If anyone knows anything about this (Vision Forum or not), they would have seen it (although the ones that don’t/didn’t know who she is/was would be clueless what to look for etc).
I still think that people that aren’t THAT connected with the situation don’t know who she is. But those that are, already knew who she was by talking about her “job description” without the photo. It was pretty easy to figure that out from there.
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Even on their most recent post, he identifies her as a victim, so he knows she is. That is not a subject of debate. However, anyone who understands cults, dynamics of a hero leader – understands that she is 100% victim whether or not she was a minor. This man was in a position of authority and used it inappropriately so automatically she is a a victim without.
Whether she tells her story or not is not for anyone else to decide. We have no right to tell her how she can live her life – even if she is in fear and wants to remain hidden. That is her call to make, not ours.
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I don’t care if she’s the most well-known person in the States. It is inappropriate for
“T.W. Eston” to spoon-feed information leading people to the identify of the victim. I am disgusted how he says the victim needs to be protected, yet is the one putting key identifying information out there. What do his actions show?
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Teresa N says, “maybe everyone, including here should be careful what we say and write until we have all the fact.” With all due respect, this comes across as just one more instance where there is an attempt to enforce the “do not talk” rule, a tactic employed by abusers everywhere. I am not saying Teresa is an abuser—far from it. However, I do suggest that the do not talk rule is so pervasively ingrained in evangelical church culture that abusers often do not have to apply the rule directly. Those they have influenced are conditioned to just automatically do the dirty work for them.
Theresa N also says, “ If this girl is a victim, which we do not know (maybe she is and maybe she isn’t) then she should get a back bone, step up and tell the truth to prevent this from happening to other young girls who are caught in the middle of situation like this.” This statement is more troubling than her likely-unintended censorship. It is a prime illustration of the way abusers tend to blame and shame the victim. I am not intending to condemn Theresa for having done this. My hope is that she is simply doing something she has been conditioned to do.
Maybe it all has to do with the all-too-many ways in which evangelical subculture diminishes women, to the point that all of us, including women who are themselves victims, can unconsciously begin to embrace the lies. I cannot say that this applies to Theresa. Only she can know if it does or does not apply. Still, I contend that it is self-evident that the abusive, misogynistic conditioning/mind control that is part and parcel of most streams of evangelicalism goes far to explain why misogynistic views are accepted as established dogma by well-meaning people.
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I agree Gary that this is what happens.. Ok sorry I just lost all my words. The ‘get a backbone ‘ comment is so distressing . The ‘IF she’s a victim’ sounds accusatory . I hope it wasn’t intended . People know this, when young people are conditioned for YEARS to accept dangerous abusive dogma , they buy it completely . It becomes a psychological conditioning that is as true as knowing their name . At some point they lose sight of reality and just start eating drinking and breathing and learning whatever is given out and accepting it. Backbones are broken and they take TIME to grow back . We don’t know what kinds of threats she may have been and continue to be given . She may have felt so isolated that she had been made to feel like nobody would believe her. There should be nothing but grief and pity for her just as much as we have grief and pity on his family and all those who have been harmed . I pray that people will start to understand that . This is time to build up and encourage and validate those who need it. It’s time to give grace like we have been given by God. I’m guilty of not giving enough grace to certain people and I am repenting for that. God , be with us, heal us, give is the ability to be empathetic and gracious and more like You every day. Guide us as we try to figure out all this mess so we can all move forward and advance your TRUE gospel . Wonderful Counselor, we need YOU.
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JA,
I do agree that putting her picture up like that was not a very good idea. Hopefully, in the future we can all be careful what we write, what we speculate about, here, there and everywhere.
No I am not being accusatory, I am sure in my heart that she is a victim. I am saying we do not have all the facts, none of us have walked in her shoe. We do not know the whole story of what really happened. We all can give all kinds of opinions as to what has happened but we may never know the whole truth.
I am the youngest of 12 children, not quiverfull. Yes, I know what it is like to be a victim of sexual abuse, thinking I did something wrong, it was my fault. keeping secrets and so on.
I also know what it is like to be trapped in the deception of Charismatic movement, dominion theology, kingdom theology, and living in fear of the false teachers, false prophets, false apostles.
As far as saying she needs to get a back bone, forgive me for using those words. I am 50 years old and I wasted half my life running in fear of the past, blaming God and running from God. One day, I decided in my 30 to confront the family member’s that assaulted me starting at 3 years old and up. Finally, I took responsibility for what happened, I no longer blamed myself nor was I no longer the victim.
I have at least 3 families in my church that follow Doug’s teaching to the letter and I know David Fry (deacon) amd his family at BCA in which I am very concerned about.
I am not a good writter and sometimes do not express myself well but I try. I have said my peace and I will leave quietly………Thanks
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Teresa N – – There’s no need to leave.
I’m just saying on this blog, “Cassandra” will be respected and her identify will not be revealed unless she chooses to. Even the secular media pays this kind of respect to victims. It seems that Christians should be setting the way for how victims are treated even more than unbelievers. That is why I’ve been so livid about so much leaked information from Christians who claim to protect victims. The proof is in the pudding. She is not being protected there, period.
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Teresa N,
Thank you for letting us know where you are coming from. I wish I had been more careful to make points in a manner that did not seem so directed at you. While I do think we can all get caught up in ingrained or conditioned ways of thinking, you have shown us that you were speaking from hard won wisdom. I do hope you will hang around.
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Teresa: To address the other part of your comment – – it sounds like you have indeed experienced a lot of abusive situations and even now with your family connected to “Doug’s teaching to the letter” which basically is false teachings.
My thoughts and prayers are with you as Phillips’ influence in your life through your family is an ongoing situation. That must be very difficult.
This place is for people who have been hurt by spiritual abuse. You are always welcome here. 🙂
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JA,
My family is not connected to Phillips, just my church family. I go to a Baptist church and I know 3 families in my church that follow his teachings and buys his stuff from vision forum. I personally know a family that are members of BCA right now, I am praying they leave.
Like I said I come out of the wacky charismatic movement Word of Faith and New apostolic reformation. I am use to all kinds of scandals but this takes the cake. WOW!
Sometimes I know my heart and my intentions,but it does not come out correctly.
I hate this scandal because it is deceptive on many levels…..and many people are hurt by this all over the country….my heart breaks for Cassandra and I personally pray she tell the truth to expose Doug for the scum bag he is.
Whom the Son sets free is free indeed, praise the LORD for that. I am free at last no more bondage.
Gary, no worries.
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Ok, sorry, I misunderstood. You illustrate how powerful Phillips’ teaching is – – – that 3 families from your church have their own pastor, yet Phillips’ message is louder than their own pastor!! That is the message that needs to get out!
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BINGO!!!!
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I so appreciate your careful clarification Teresa. This is such a difficult subject rife with triggers and sticky bristles and just utter devastation. I will add to my list of prayers those families at your church, that they too will break free from their bondage. Thank you for sharing your story. Praise God that you got free!!! What an amazing Father in Heaven we have!
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well you guys got your wish. The photo of “Cassandra” was edited to ONLY show her hand with the ring and her face/head has been edited out. I agree with this decision and think it was for the best. But enough damage was done 😦
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I saw that. I’m glad they changed it, but it wasn’t without a bit of a fight.
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Please leave mrs Botkin alone. She is a sincerely modest unassuming woman who is at complete peace and Godly contentment. She is so busy being a “here you are” vs. A “here I am” person in her personal interactions than she neither seeks nor basks in glory. Every time we are together she is quietly interested in others and had not interest in being front and center. God’s word. Forbids out judging motives. I no longer want my picture taken for the simple reason i am so heavy now despite very careful eating habits and i just hate being photographed
Please let us seek to use our time loving God and others. This black hole of drama seems to keep growing wider and deeper as we feed it. Let us pray for others and keep the confessing of sins and weaknesses to those in our own life.
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Seeking true humility–respectfully–i’m a bit confused…I’ve heard no negative mention of Mrs. Botkin in this thread. I’ve posted many times on this particular discussion thread so i looked back and maybe I have missed it, but I’m not sure what it is, that has you so upset. I don’t know the Botkins–so i know it hasn’t been part of any discussions I’ve been apart of–and in all the reading about this subject throughout this website,I cannot recall any negative comments directly mentioning her in a negative way.So please set your mind at ease about that. Now, most of us here are not in agreement or in support of her families’ outspoken and very public beliefs in Patriarchy and their support of Doug Phillips and Vision Forum Ministries and VF inc. Obviously by your show of concern and the words you use , you are a supporter and you are welcome to engage at any point, if you have something you’d like to refute. If I am correct, I would just like to say that i’m sad about that. I hope you continue to keep reading these threads and posts to see truth.I hope you can break free from the bondage of Patriarchy one day and that will be my sincere prayer for you. I’m not sure where your fear of being photographed comes into play..but no one will ask you to submit a photo of yourself on here. There can be anonymity found here and that’s safe. As to judging motives, I am gonna have to disagree that that is whats going on here. We are judging proven, verified, documented BEHAVIORS that are dangerous, destructive, abusive, and depending on who you talk to, illegal. We are called to hold each other accountable. I will never apologize for standing up for the Gospel truths and where i find things to be contrary, I will speak out. I don’t do this perfectly and if there is speculation and heresay,or sin on my part, I pray that we can find the right answers and that I will repent .I think we ARE ‘using our time loving God and others’ by protecting truth and revealing wolves in sheeps clothing to hopefully spare at least one Sheep . There are people in droves whose lives have been harmed and negatively altered by this man, I feel compelled to protect the victims and survivors of his type of tyranny and heresy. And it IS heresy. And I’m sorry that disagrees with what you want to hear, and my words aren’t meant to accuse you– they are with an earnest attempt to try and spare you years of heartache that many of us have endured or are enduring underneath the chains of Patriarchy. Spiritual leaders are held accountable by God for how they lead their flocks. Doug Phillips has alot of TRUE repenting to do. Others who have victimized and wounded people in the name of this movement and used their power to corrupt and destroy rather than lead to Christ, will have a lot of repenting to do. I feel no compulsion to water that down. Those who are blindly following, I pray and weep for. I’m begging God to free them, and information,knowledge, and not allowing predators to hide because we feel like the ‘Christian ‘ thing to do is to be sweet and not speak ill of others, is how we get people safe. I’m proud of that. My conscience will not be bound in this area. I wish you felt that free. Peace to you, Sister.
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WfF– I was perplexed also and did a search. A commenter brought up Mrs Botkin back on Nov 30.
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well there ya go–the post makes a lot of sense now… well I am sorry if Mrs Botkins or ‘anyone’s’ feelings were harmed by someone saying something regarding personal appearance. It was a bit insensitive.. Seeking true Humility–i assure you if anyone saw me in current state–they would say much worse things about my appearance! hahaha as i type I’m in my hubbys sweat pants because my maternity pants are too tight, nerdy coke bottle glasses, t shirt with crumbs on my belly shelf… yeah ‘frumpy’ would be a compliment to me right now. There are some really very important issues at stake here and i encourage you to keep reading. Please don’t let a slight dig take away from what this article is about! keep reading and we can come up with some good names to call ME I assure you. I was thinking of changing my screen name to WomanforFreedomFromWaddling…ill start us off.;)
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Polygamy is a topic that is occasionally broached in connection with the fall of Doug Phillips in particular, and in connection with patriarchy in general. Typically, it seems, polygamy is mentioned with a surely-they-aren’t-going-there kind of attitude. Probably the current advocates of patriarchy will not go there. Evangelical culture is just too much against the practice of polygamy. However, it may be that the doors have been opened for more extreme “Christian” fundamentalists to begin to advocate for, and practice, Old Testament style patriarchy. If news reports can be believed, some federal judge has effectively made polygamy a constitutionally protected practice in Utah. See, e.g. http://tinyurl.com/lvz44eo
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WfF: of COURSE, your Cult-de-sac neighbors would never DREAM of name-calling or saying anything insensitive about someone’s appearance…sarcasm off. Seriously, keeping up appearances seems very important to patriarchs. Any Christmas lights or moving vans yet?
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Gary W
Then there are servant girls like Hagar, Zilpah, Bilhah, and Sally Hemmings…………..
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hahha Dave AA well ya know, if you’re speaking to a heathen, apparently its ok because you have God on your side–didn’t you KNOOOOW that?? duh lol
Man on the street update…;)… ok so, lots of ‘community’ vans and trucks and still the same one trailer. Still lots of boxes, ladders and things in front drive. It appears that whatever they are doing is during the night. This morning, a really big red camping tent was put in front yard…so… its got to be moving , but here’s the thing, these are local cars and small trailer so from appearances, that would indicate they are moving somewhere relatively close. No Rental companies seen. But it aint Christmas lights and nobody is being seen during the day. Thats the latest, brought to you live from the cult-de-sac at the Phillips Compound.. Now Back to Chuck with the weather…;)
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A really big red camping tent? In the middle of winter? What kind of weather are you having there? What do you suppose the tent is for. I have to laugh because my family used to be in the possession of a big honkin’ orange tent that my dad picked up at an auction – – not just any auction, but the Rajneeshee auction – – the government was selling off Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh property. That was the first thing I thought of.
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A red tent?? OK, that is totally weird…… What on earth are they doing over there????
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Maybe they are having an estate sale/auction. Inquiring minds want to know.
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JA that was so funny about your tent! Lol ok let’s see if I can answer some questions…. Not sure about the tent but I’m assuming its a leftover from one of his hazardous journeys lol . Btw love the expression ‘big honkin’ tent –yet another term I would’ve thought was Texan lol. The weather here is funny. Yesterday we had 34-65 degree weather . But it changes from cold to hot in one afternoon here. But it’s nice out. I have no idea why they have it up but it can’t be an estate sale. Those are only allowed with permit you have to get , 4 times a year in our neighborhood/town-we are actually our own little town- so you even have to get a permit to get your trees trimmed or they ticket you. So they’re obviously clearing everything out and packing to move but they are doing it themselves so we get to put up with the mess as it takes forever to clear out an 8,000 sq ft home by yourselves . Looks like he only has help from 3-4 of the same families. He doesn’t have many supporters left down here . Certainly no one outside his community. What I find odd is the hiding during the day working at night bit.
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Ill ask one of the town police what they know bout tent and trailer cause you’re not supposed to have that kind of stuff out in your front yard. Hahahha we are a very very rule centered little city. No wonder dougie wanted to live here.
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Julie Anne–Thankfully Rajneeshees didn’t show up at the auction and poison your Dad’s salad bar! Takes me off on a tangent to remember that we used to live in a small town with a neighbor called “Ramtha”. He’s a 35,000 year old entity who enlightens folks with his wisdom via a woman named J Z Knight. Our first inkling was seeing an extravagant horse barn, complete with Crystal Channeliers, go up. Then hollywood celebrities started showing up. When her ex-husband sued her, he also sued Ramtha. Once we were in the car, and JZ was walking along the road, wearing shimmery robes which I could only describe as like those of Saruman the Many-Colored. Hide your eyes, Kids! Ramsters succeeded in taking over much of the town, like the Rajneeshees wanted to do to Antelope and VF’ers wanted to do to America.
For comic relief: http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Ramtha
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Dave AA:
Funny story – on our first anniversary, we borrowed Dad’s tent and went camping on Mt. Hood. It was really windy which caused the zipper to make noise all night. We thought a bear was trying to get in the tent. Didn’t sleep too well that night – – along with racing thoughts about bears, I have to admit my mind did wonder about what exactly had gone on in this tent when it was with the Rajneeshees. We never borrowed that tent again.
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Did you grow up in Oregon Julie Anne? I always wanted to go there. If you ever want to read a story about growing up in Oregon that will blow your hair back check out Refresh, Refresh. I think it was the short story of the year a few years back. Oh, hold on, I will find it for you. Here it is (Thank you Google)
http://www.theparisreview.org/fiction/5585/refresh-refresh-benjamin-percy
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@womanoffreedom: do you have an further update for us about what’s going on at the Phillips’ compound?
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WFF disappeared ?
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She’s probably busy with Christmas season activities or getting ready for the new baby’s arrival. I’m sure she’ll be back.
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In one of the comments above, a move to Deary, Idaho is mentioned. Is this in reference to the Philips family?
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No, Whinney – that refers to another cult that BeenThereDoneThat is familiar with. That cult is not connected with Phillips.
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