***
Pulpit and Pen’s JD Hall launches Voices in the Wilderness Radio with Faithful Theology and Faithful Preaching
***
The last we spoke of JD Hall and Pulpit and Pen was in this August 2014 article, JD Hall’s Public Confession Regarding His Twitter Conversation with Ergun Caner’s Son, Who Later Committed Suicide. JD (Jordan) spoke with both Dee Parsons of The Wartburg Watch blog and me after this public confession. Against the opinion of a lot of naysayers, we both believed Jordan’s confession to be genuine and hoped that his online persona and sharp personality would soften.
Hall did take a break from social media. It wasn’t a long break. For a while, the Pen & Pulpit Twitter account was turned over to the Pulpit and Pen contributors: Gene Clyatt, Dustin Germain, Kofi Adu-Boahen, Alan Maricle, and Seth Dunn. Late September, I saw that JD Hall had started his own Twitter account. Today I received confirmation that JD Hall, along with the Pulpit and Pen contributors, are manning the Pulpit and Pen Twitter account.
Additionally, JD Hall is also once again contributing at Pulpit and Pen blog (I think they forgot to update the contributor page to include Hall) and yesterday he announced the launching of Voices in the Wilderness radio today, January 1, 2015.
***
Here is the scoop from the website:
Voice in the Wilderness Radio (VWR) launches January 1, 2015. This new 24/7 streaming radio station will offer solid, Reformed Baptist preaching from true voices in the wilderness – pastors you might never have heard of but who offer solid, expository sermons – and preachers you’ve might have heard of like John MacArthur, Phil Johnson, Albert Martin, Justin Peters and Paul Washer. VWR will also carry programs like Generations Radio, Cross Encounters Radio and the P&P Contributor Hour. Between sermons, we will play hymns and smaller clips highlighting the work of men like AW Pink and others. It is a treasure trove of rich, dynamic preaching and sound theology.
Hall also mentioned that they “will always be seeking new pastors to highlight on VWR” and welcome sermon submissions. Please note the focus of “faithful theology” and “faithful preaching” as shown on the screenshot of the website. It’s an important and very appropriate focus.
I have some concerns, however. Cross Encounters Radio is Tony Miano’s show and Generations Radio is Kevin Swanson’s program. Generations Radio is listed twice within a 24-hr period on the current schedule. I shudder to think what will come out of Swanson’s mouth after this nonsense (saying that women who have been on birth control pills have embedded fetuses embedded in their wombs). And my regular readers have a good idea what I think about Miano who says women shouldn’t read the Bible in front of men because the Bible is authoritative and they are not in authority over men. Here are Tony Miano’s words transcribed from the 18:22 mark of this video:
And whenever a woman stands up on a box to proclaim the gospel in the open air, or even read scripture aloud, she is taking on the role of a man. She is taking on an authoritative role over whoever is listening to her.
The mere reading of scripture is to exercise authority because scripture is the authority. (Source)
I think it’s important to bring up one more note while I’m at it. Recently there has been a Twitter brouhaha with the hashtag #the15 (click on the link to see what I’m talking about) involving JD Hall and the Pulpiteers leading the pack (Pulpiteers are followers of Pulpit and Pen). You can read more about the #the15 Twitter hashtag in Bob Allen’s article, Twitter post sparks hashtag war with LifeWay, SBC elite.
The point is that Hall and those who have joined in the #the15 hashtag are rightly calling out LifeWay (a branch of Southern Baptist Convention) for selling heretical books and asking them to remove questionable material. Many people have joined the #the15 bandwagon and sadly, some of it has been contentious. (Update: please be sure to read my comment below Larry’s. I do not appreciate the methodology employed by this group in going after LifeWay and may report on that aspect later.)
While the Pulpit and Pen groupies have been calling out LifeWay for selling bad books, I sure hope Hall applies the same criteria for his new Voices in the Wilderness radio programming. The examples I provided of Kevin Swanson’s talk on embedded fetuses in wombs and Miano’s teaching that women should not read Scripture in front of men are not good examples of faithful theology and faithful preaching – they are men’s ideologies just like the very bad ideologies #the15 are publicly calling out on Twitter.
Spiritual Sounding Board 
Reblogged this on Talmidimblogging.
LikeLike
Julie, I don’t believe Hall and “the 15” are rightly calling out Lifeway, and here is why I believe that. The Southern Baptist Convention is a large group of churches with beliefs that range far and wide. In my hometown, the largest SBC church has its own program on TBN and frequently hosts crusades by folks like Rodd Parsley, Benny Hinn, etc etc. etc. Then on the other end of the spectrum you have the Calvinists, etc.
Is Lifeway supposed to decide what theology is allowed to be taught or sold? Shouldn’t that be up to individuals and churches, right or wrong? When one takes time to read the BFM2000, the statement of faith of the Southern Baptist Convention, you can see that is very generic, so as to be agreeable to Calvinists and Non-Calvinists, Charismatics and Non-Charismatics, etc. Is there good doctrine and bad doctrine? Yes. Is it the job of the SBC and furthermore, a bookstore, to police it? No.
What Hall and his crew forget in all of this, is that the SBC is not a denomination with any true authority over its membership. The churches are autonomous. The convention doesn’t own their property or select their clergy, and they are free to leave at any time, no strings attached. The purpose of the SBC was to cooperate for the sake of missions and not to form a denomination that polices doctrine.
Really, I believe when we dig through this, this is not about Lifeway at all. That bookstore has sold the same stuff for as long as I remember without any protests from the like of Miano or Hall. What this is about, as I see it, is a bullying campaign because they were called out for being angry Calvinists, all the time, about everything. And they seemingly are. The Lifeway stuff is just about getting back at Ed Stetzer.
JD Hall’s actions do not look like that of one who is repentant, in my opinion. After the incident with Caner, why would he ever wage a twitter campaign ever again? And although I may agree that some of the materials they are calling out are indeed heretical, I could never get on board with a group of people who are still defending Hall’s interaction with a suicidal 15 year old.
LikeLiked by 3 people
Great comment, Larry, and I think I may need to add a note to the post about something else. My point about calling out is that I think it’s okay and appropriate to notify LifeWay if you feel what they are selling is heretical. One thing that I don’t appreciate is the methodology they employ to do so, but this is just the introductory post as I am collecting more material.
You’ve given me a side to SBC that i was unaware of – how broad and generic SBC is. A SBC church hosts Benny Hinn? Wow.
I also will take note of your thought that it is primarily a bullying campaign directed toward Stetzer. I have seen some of that behavior and that’s the kind of thing that disgusts me with this group (and how they behaved during the Caner incident). Alan Maricle aka @Rhology is still sending out tweets defending the Braxton Cancer incident. That is inappropriate, IMHO.
My impression, after talking with Hall soon after the public confession, was that he would be stepping away from most of social media. At that time, he said he was under the direction of his elders. The question I wonder is are they aware of his online activity now, since the Braxton tragedy and public confession? Because, overseeing a new radio show, blogging, tweeting, having a daily radio show takes a lot of time and I’m not sure how one could be a full-time pastor at the same time.
LikeLiked by 2 people
I don’t think JD is responsible for Braxton’s suicide. I don’t see how one twitter conversation could be responsible for a young man taking his life. I think it would take a lot of pain to take one’s life and a long time of deep pain where death is more appealing than life.
I do not agree with much of what JD says, but I do think he has a right to say it. This is America, and the Southern Baptist Convention has a variety of views. I do believe JD has apologized for his role in the twitter conversation, and I do believe he went through a season of pain. But you cannot stop him anymore than he could stop you from writing and speaking your convictions and both have a right to speak or write those convictions. I can disagree with you and JD but I do not have the right to stop you from speaking.
I do think some in the Caner camp have used Braxton’s death as a means to an end and I think that is more unfortunate than what JD supposedly did.
LikeLike
Is this the guy with the “Pulpiteers” who’ll all but strap on suicide bomb-belts to go after any “heretic/apostate” the ManaGAWD points at?
LikeLiked by 1 person
Debbie, I’m not arguing against JD Hall’s right to freedom of speech or expression. I’m saying, for one who was vocally repentant and torn up by his own actions, it would seem reasonable to me to believe that such an event would cause a dramatic change to his twitter habits. “The15” twitter campaign does not seem to go along with that spirit of repentance. In fact, as Julie Anne said, it seems contentious. Do you not agree?
LikeLiked by 1 person
Personally, I think #the15 is just a group of guys attempting to garner a bit more attention. Too bad they have to use negative attention to gain that, but apparently it’s working (even if I think a small audience is paying attention). I am a bit annoyed that they’re calling Lifeway to “repent” because they carry certain authors. Really, it’s ridiculous.
I admit to being amused at NotJDHall’s tweets.
As far as the radio station goes….Gag! Like Swanson and Miano need more air time. BTW – Swanson should be back from sabbatical at some point. Wonder if he was refreshed and revived from his time off and ready to spew his words of wisdom.
LikeLiked by 1 person
I didnt know Swanson was on sabbatical. Wow, Kathi, you’re holding out on me. Lol
LikeLiked by 1 person
From Swanson’s October 28th blog post on Generations With a Vision:
“Over the last several months, several pastor friends have advised that I take a sabbatical. It has been 16 years of rather intense ministry life, and the 80-90 hour weeks can wear on you after awhile. So. . . we’re turning the mainframe off, and we shall be in hibernation for somewhere around 10 weeks. Some of you may see me in Colorado, Virginia, North Carolina, California, and parts unknown over the next weeks. But, technically I am on sabbatical beginning Wednesday of this week.”
Do you think he really works 80-90 hours a week?
LikeLike
Warning: scripture quote copied by a woman. Read at your own spiritual risk. 🙂
Sure, JD Hall has a “right” to say what he wants –even the questionable behavior of bullying a minor on Twitter whose father he has issues with. How mature was that? Those “rights” don’t necessarily reflect Christianity, though. (Unless you’re trying to reflect a jihadist sort of “Christianity.”)
“All things are lawful for me, but all things are not helpful: all things are lawful for me, but all things do not edify.” 1 Cor 10:23
LikeLiked by 2 people
To the idea of Swanson being “Faithful Theology:”
Bwahahahahaha!
LikeLiked by 3 people
Debbie Kaufman,
No one has the right in America to harass anyone. It wasn’t a conversation, it was harassment. That was not a free speech issue. It was a grown man harassing a child about his dad. No grown up has that right, or authority to harass a child about their parents. Americans have rights that people like JD Hall likes to violate. We have boundaries that no one is allowed to cross. Ethics. Common sense.
Ed
LikeLiked by 1 person
Having read JD’s “apology” from last year (not all of it, I could only stomach so much) he comes across as the typical narcissistic big-shot (self-appointed) “preacher”. He’s been out of the lime-light for a few months and is having ego withdrawals, and so he’s back. Bottom line: he’s just another fraud, no matter how “orthodox” he claims his doctrine to be. To be certain, there are NO nationally prominent ‘preachers’ worth a hoot, they are ALL compromised whether by doctrine or those with whom they associate (yes, there most definitely is ‘guilt by association’ see 2Cor. 6″11-18).
As for your research into Lifeway and the SBC I hope you come across all the documentation of their Masonic roots, their ecumenical “leaders”, not to mention the fact that there is absolutely no Scriptural mandate or authority for the SBC to even exist. The SBC is a fraud as well as most (all?) of it’s “pastors”. Their “bottom line” is the bottom line-it’s all about $ and power and they use the Gospel to that end ONLY despite the lies they teach to the contrary.
Darrel
LikeLiked by 1 person
The Bible says that pastors/elders are to be gentle with all and above reproach, to have good reputations among believers and unbelievers. I don’t believe that J.D.’s American ‘rights’ to say whatever he wants trump his obligations under Scripture to refrain from such speech.
LikeLiked by 2 people
gracealone1,
Darrel, well, when you put it that way, there is no scriptural mandate or authority for much of what Christendom does, however, I wouldn’t be so quick to condemn the Southern Baptists. In addition, I’m am not a fan of conspiracy theories, so I would not be apt to believe in a Masonic conspiracy.
LikeLike
Tony Miano should get a real job instead of asking for handouts.
He must be quite a tyrant at home (to the wife and kids).
His claims that a woman shouldn’t read a Bible verse aloud in mixed company are ridiculous. This is done all of the time, including by conservative Christians, in homes and Bible studies. Tony has too much free time on his hands. (Ray Comfort at Living Waters seems so much more mild-mannered than Tony, who used to work there before getting laid off.)
LikeLiked by 1 person
Perhpas MIano’s beef with Lifeway is that they don’t carry video or voice recorders for gospel street preaching.
LikeLike
Kathi, do you suppose it takes him 80-90 hrs a wk to come up with rhetoric like embedded fetuses?
LikeLike
BTDT – I LOLed at your warning – in a public restaurant.
LikeLike
@ Julie Anne:
Yeah, NLQ had a “Where’s Kevin?” counter up for a while but I didn’t see it last time I went over there.
LikeLike
“This new 24/7 streaming radio station will offer solid, Reformed Baptist preaching…”
John MacArthur is a hero of Reformed Baptists, but he isn’t a Baptist, Southern, Reformed, or otherwise. Same for Phil Johnson, Tony Miano, and Kevin Swanson.
Not that I care about their denominational affiliations, just funny to me that preachers mentioned as providing “solid, Reformed Baptist preaching” aren’t Baptists.
LikeLiked by 2 people
Hey, does JD Hall feed the hungry, clothe the naked, and visit prisoners?
Asking for a friend…Jesus.
LikeLiked by 3 people
chapmaned24,
Perhaps you should avail yourself of the study done by the SBC themselves as to the extent of the Masonic presence in their midst.
You are also quite right to state that much of what occurs in modern day Christendom has no Biblical authority for action or existence, because it doesn’t. Most, if not all of our current crop of “evangelicals” are charlatans, frauds, and angels of light sent by the wicked one, they preach another gospel as per Gal. 1:6-9 and are therefore accursed.
Darrel
LikeLiked by 1 person
Reformed seems to be a buzz word that a lot of people like. Maybe because it sounds old and legit. I think there’s something about men needing to wear a beard, too.
LikeLike
Darrel,
Sorry, but I cant get all warm and fuzzy about researching a Masonic presence in the SBC. I get SBC blog posts in my email on a daily basis, and have posted on their blog before. Haven’t seen any sign of it, not one bit. For someone like me, a former US Navy guy, I’ve never been one for conspiracy theories at all.
In addition, when I said that much of what Christendom does is not scriptural, I didn’t mean it the way that you came back at me with. Your original comment was about a mandate…scriptural mandate.
I do NOT believe that we are under any sort of “biblical mandate” to begin with. To me, mandate means RULES, and as far as I can see, Jesus gave us FREEDOM to worship him in a manner that our own conscience dictates, not by rules. We worship God in spirit and truth, not by rules. And, since God lives in us, we don’t need to go to any particular place to worship God. We can worship God anywhere, anytime, without restrictions, without a dress code, without LEGALISM.
Now, if you wish to put rules and regulation mandates on worship, that, to me, is not scriptural. And therefore, my statement that most of Christendom does not adhere to scriptural mandates is because, as far as I can see, there are none. Legalism kills worship.
Ed
LikeLike
Ed,
Praise God for the Gospel truth you just spoke. Alleluia!
Jesus said, “Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For My yoke is easy and My burden is light.” Matthew 11:28-30
Rather than approaching this subject entering from the back barn door, I’m going to walk right through the front gate here…..I used to be a regular listener of J.D. Hall, appreciating some of his material, not all of it. I was not familiar with Tony Miano until Julie Anne broached the subject, and after reading some of his quotes and listening to his interview, there is no doubt in my mind, that I personally, could not sit under this man’s teachings. Another Alleluia!
Jesus being our school Master, there are a few questions I have learned to ask when allowing men and women to lord over me, since the life of a born again Christian is filled with labor and “heavy ladens” of life at times. Jesus said,
1) Come to Me
2) I will give you rest
3) Take My yoke upon you
4) Learn from Me
5) I am gentle and lowly in heart
6) My yoke is easy
7) My burden is light
Wise council from our LORD of which no man can contradict. Please correct me if I am straying here folks, but it seems to me that many of these preachers and teachers are wrapping the halter around the sheep so tightly, suffocating any light that may abound in the average, ordinary, every day believer, with their own manifestos and magnificent agendas. Do these men in particular resemble Jesus in their preaching and teaching….Jesus said,
1) For I am gentle
2) and lowly in heart
And as a result, we will,
FIND REST FOR OUR SOULS.
Does the method of preaching and teaching by the men listed in this post exhibit the true characteristics and nature of our LORD Jesus Christ? Like I said, I used to listen to J.D. Hall……just can’t go there any longer for true repentance cuts at the heart……and ego.
LikeLiked by 2 people
Lifeway sells books and materials. I don’t think they stick with a particular denominations or doctrine. Christian Book Stores have everything from Catholic to Evangelical and everything in between. I have no problem with buying from either one, but watch what I am purchasing as I would do anywhere.
SBC is all over the map in their beliefs. They are probably due a division at some point. That will stop the money flowing into the top. Didn’t John Piper go to Lifeway? Now there is one of my top stay away from purchases.
I think these guys miss their 15 seconds of fame and the only way they get that is to cause trouble and turmoil. Maybe if we all ignore the fact they are there, they will just go away. I doubt it, but it’s worth a try.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Ed,
The greater problem here is your lack of understanding of the Gospel. Aside from the fact that you refuse to even consider the Masonic (demonic, satan worshipping presence in “evangelical” circles) that does mean that they are all too present in “churches” today.[Your labeling of this fact as a “conspiracy theory” shows that you are all too willing to give these satan worshippers a pass, which begs the question Ed, Are you a Mason?]
It is typical of all false prophets to cloud the real Gospel with the label of “legalism” when it comes to the rightful demands of the Lord Jesus placed on all who claim to follow Him.
Rule #1, you MUST repent AND believe on the Lord Jesus Christ. This is more than a mental ascent to the historical figure of the Lord Jesus Christ which is as far as most “preaching” goes today (no matter who is speaking). Mark 1:15; Matt. 4:17.
Rule #2, A believer MUST take up his own cross DAILY, deny himself (daily) in order to follow after Christ. Luke 9:23-26. If you refuse to obey this RULE you CANNOT be His disciple, Luke 14:26 & 27 (and yes, He is deadly serious about all of verse 26).
Rule #3, “If you love Me, keep My commandments” (John 14:15). But you Ed and Katy and others say that there are no commandments for a Christian to keep-to you it’s all about some (convoluted) form of misguided “love” that makes you feel safe and secure, not knowing that your soul hangs in the balance and that without real repentance toward God and real faith in the Lord Jesus Christ you will spend eternity in hell, with no reprieve, no pardon, no escape. By saying that it is “legalistic” for a Christian to have to obey the Lord Jesus Christ in the few items mentioned above is to call the Lord Jesus Christ a liar. Did He speak these COMMANDS or not? Yes, He did, it your refusal to bow before Him that will be your ultimate and eternal demise.
There are dozens more of these types commandments to be found throughout all of Scripture, but it is more convenient to declare the whole thing “legalism” and dismiss it out of hand (this is what fools do, not knowing when their soul will required of them). Ed, Katy, and others, you have believed a big lie, it is the lie of another gospel that is so easy to find in any “church” today. It is the “other gospel” that Paul spoke of in Gal. 1:6-9 and it is the messenger of this false gospel that will remain eternally accursed. Your soul is at stack, not the “winning” of an argument on the internet. One more pesky rule that does not exist in the “other gospel” that you seem to love is found in John 3:18-21. Will you love your sins or humble yourself before the King of kings and Lord of lords?
LikeLiked by 1 person
gracealone1 – Wow
You sound angry…
Has someone put starch in your underwear?
LikeLiked by 3 people
gracealone1
I’ve got some rules too.
Rule #1…
Never take seriously someone who has starch in their underwear. 😉
LikeLiked by 3 people
gracealone1
Rule #2
If someone, some church, has the word Grace in their name…
There is most likely NO Grace in them… 😉
LikeLiked by 4 people
A. Amos Love,
A blessed New Year to you.
Love your comment….and am sending lots of warm, fuzzy love your way 🙂
Man, the stuff people come up with….and now, I will go back to my regular life outside the internet.
LikeLiked by 3 people
Carmen
Thanks for your warm, fuzzy love… 🙂 🙂 🙂
And a blessed New Year to you.
LikeLike
gracealone1
Your blog name indicates that you believe that grace alone is the method of salvation. I find to those that add anything to the blood of Christ, grace becomes grace plus something else. The other gospel that Paul was talking about in the book of Galatians was what the Jews were trying to do to the Christians. The adding of the Jewish laws to the Gospel of Christ. I think one would have to agree that the gospel is the death, burial and the reselection of the Lord Jesus Christ. I think it has been made very clear that the Apostle Paul, fought for through out his’ epistles, that belief and faith plus nothing else was God’s methodology for salvation. It is a free gift and for one, I praise and thank God for that and that he made it so clear for us to understand.
Jim
LikeLiked by 4 people
Much Love to you A. Amos Love, I am with Carmen on wishing you a blessed New Year!
LikeLiked by 1 person
.
He that serves an angry, unmerciful, unforgiving, unloving, God…
Becomes an angry, unmerciful, unforgiving, unloving, Man…
LikeLiked by 4 people
Hi Gail
Nice to her from you.
And a blessed New Year to you also.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Amos is a breath of fresh air amist the stench of morning breath. Thank you for modeling love and grace, Amos.
LikeLiked by 2 people
I like the way you put that JA. Amos is a breath of fresh air amist the stench of morning breath. Amos have a blessed year.
LikeLiked by 1 person
The theme of JD Hall’s methodology is based on a “Law and Sin Center” ministry using the theme “unworthiness” rather than Christ Centered and Redemption through his blood.
He admitted to me that he proclaims to his congregation several times every single service reminding them of how unworthy they are.
He is simply going to admit his flaws as a way to explain his own unworthiness as a way to grow regain his exposure. (he is giving himself a free pass in my view) Also to continue to force feed his toxic methodology that lacks love on Christians.
JD’s view is he has repented “enough” so he can continue his crusade to attack others while in some cases being in the act of sin himself. (lacking identifiable Love being one of his Sins)
Interestingly, I mentioned to JD that with his abusive methodology, his congregation will never lose sight of how unworthy they even if he “reminds” them once a month. (and probably once a year)
He didn’t respond to me after I made that comment.
To be fair to JD, one of my biggest Sins is when I lack Love. Even now I find it difficult to see any identifiable Love in my comments directed at JD and his Puppets.
LikeLike
Mark,
Speaking truth is not lacking love. Confronting sin is not lacking love. Creating boundaries and consequences is not lacking love. It may be hard to do, but it is not lacking love.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Darrel,
It’s funny that you see rules in what you stated. I don’t see “pick up your cross” as a rule, or a mandate. We do that automatically. Under the New Test, there is a Law, and that Law is the Law of Faith. What is faith? Dissect Hebrews 11:1. When you do that, this is what it states: Faith is KNOWING that we are going to get what we are waiting for.
So, what is the law of faith? It’s living what you believe.
Now, under that law of faith, there is only two “commandments”. Love God, and Love people. How do we prove that we love God? By loving people. Hence, we only have ONE commandment, mandate. Love People.
James 1 and 2 shows us that love is an action word. So, as 1 Cor 13 states:
1. Knowing that we are going to get what we are waiting for (FAITH)
2. Expectation/Anticipation (HOPE)
3. Doing for others (LOVE)
But the greatest is Doing For Others.
Your legalistic mindset sets us up for failure to do God’s will. Our only mandate is to do for others, SHOWING our love for people. That is living out our faith, hence the term, faith without works is dead.
I don’t know where you got your knowledge from, but I would implore you to take another fresh look at the commandments, plural, which is a singular commandment. John talks about that in his epistles. Commandments (plural) is a singular commandment.
And no, I am not a Mason.
Ed
LikeLiked by 2 people
JD Hall cyber-stalked and cyber-bullied a fifteen year old boy. JD hall is embarrassing.
LikeLiked by 2 people
I wonder if JD Hall will also ask lifeway to remove any Answers in Genesis nonsense from the shelves as well. I mean dinosaurs living with human beings, being on the ark and being killed off by Knights and Kings in the middle ages. Or my favorite is some carnivores were actually herbivores before the fall or the flood depending on which rabbit trail one wishes to run down. Then they all magically became carnivores where their entire digestive tract changed.
What exactly is wrong with the Masons anyway?
LikeLiked by 1 person
Brenda R,
I don’t dispute the way you eloquently described a scenario in which has nothing to do with what Julie Anne is talking about regarding what JD is about.
The repetitive nature and cyber bullying he embraces destroys lives. Rather than simply pointing out sin and then trusting the Holy Spirit to remedy his concerns he continues to on an almost daily crusade to force feed his definition of repentance.
Then when he runs out of things to criticize about he’ll make a mockery of a name of his victim. For example “Canerize the Canerization”
Do you call that “Love”?
LikeLike
Dear Precious Gracealone1,
Thank-you for your response for it has given me reassurance this Sunday morning, for you confirmed any doubt that I have ever had in coming out of the last abusive church assembly that I sat under, so I can honestly praise our LORD for you this day. And I would love to take you out behind the woodshed, not for a whooping mind you, but to share my personal testimony in becoming a born again Christian and fully accepting our LORD Jesus Christ as my Savior through intense repentance for all of my past sins. Only His blood can cover my past, present, and future sins….yes, as born again believers and followers of Christ alone, we STILL SIN and will continue to SIN until we either see Jesus face to face, or perhaps we will witness His Great and Glorious Second Coming during our lifetime….(I do not know the time of His Second Coming and neither does Jesus, only our Father knows; Alleluia!)
Your words, “But you Ed and Katy and others say that there are no commandments for a Christian to keep-to you its about some (convoluted) form of misguided “love” that makes you feel safe and secure, not knowing your soul……”
May I ask you an honest question here Gracealone1? Where in the world did you get that idea? After having read the comments here, I don’t recall anyone ever saying those words for you to accuse us of such a lie. How do you know that we believe in some form of “convoluted” form of misguided love….did I ever say that? Now mind you Gracealone1, I came out of a horrific abusive church system with some very sick religious individuals at the helm of leadership, and some spiritually elite women surrounding me in a very suffocating environment. What amazes me it that leadership and religious elitists can break every single one of those commandments and those old 613 Mosaic Laws as well, yet show no form of public repentance in the form of tears nor apologies…..and keep on sinning all the while pointing out our sin and “making us pay” for our sins on a fleshly level. The double standards are an abomination to our LORD, no doubt.
This is another truth that came to my mind via God, the Holy Spirit, when I read Julie Anne’s post. I believe she makes a strong, valid point in addressing what may seem to be a form of hypocrisy in the life of a religious leader who publicly influence many. (And if we are truly honest before our Righteous and Holy God, we all must confess the same at times, for all have sinned and fall short of the Glory of God.)
The Truth from God’s Word….not mine, not Ed’s, not any other person, not you, but God’s…..and oh how I love Jesus for this…..
(with Julie Anne’s permission due to the length of His truth…. continued)
LikeLiked by 1 person
Mark,
If you are referring to me saying: Speaking truth is not lacking love. Confronting sin is not lacking love. Creating boundaries and consequences is not lacking love. It may be hard to do, but it is not lacking love.
That was regarding your saying: To be fair to JD, one of my biggest Sins is when I lack Love. Even now I find it difficult to see any identifiable Love in my comments directed at JD and his Puppets. I was saying that YOU ARE NOT being unloving in what you said about JD. I didn’t say there was anything loving about JD. I don’t believe there is.
I am not sure how this was turned any other way.
LikeLike
Heart and head knowledge in knowing who Jesus truly is….
Luke 7:36-50
“Then one of the Pharisees asked Him to eat with him. And He went to the Pharisee’s house, and sat down to eat. And behold, a woman in the city who was a sinner, when she knew that Jesus sat at the table in the Pharisee’s house, brought an alabaster flask of fragrant oil, and stood at His feet behind Him weeping, and she began to wash His feet with her tears, and wiped them with the hair of her head, and she kissed His feet and anointed them with the fragrant oil.
Now when the Pharisee who had invited Him saw this, he spoke to himself, saying, “This Man, if He were a prophet, would know who and what manner of woman this is who is touching Him, for she is a sinner.”
And Jesus answered and said to him, “Simon, I have something to say to you.” So, he said, “Teacher, say it.”
“There was a certain creditor who had two debtors. One owed five hundred denarii, and the other fifty. And when they had nothing with which to repay, he freely forgave them both. Tell me, therefore, which of them will love him more?”
Simon answered and said, “I suppose the one whom he forgave more.” And He said to him, “You have rightly judged.”
Then He turned to the woman and said to Simon, “Do you see this woman? I entered your house; you gave Me no water for My feet, but she has washed My feet with her tears and wiped them with the hair of her head.”
“You gave Me no kiss, but this woman has not ceased to kiss My feet since the time I came in.
“You did not anoint my head with oil, but this woman has anointed My feet with fragrant oil.
“Therefore I say to you, her sins, which are many, are forgiven, for she loved much. But to whom little is forgiven, the same loves little.”
Then He said to her, “Your sins are forgiven.” And those who sat at the table with Him began to say to themselves, “Who is this who even forgives sins?”
Then He said to the woman, “Your faith has saved you. Go in peace.”
(one more “continued” in bringing His harvest home here……Praise Jesus!)
LikeLiked by 1 person
Who cannot help, but be broken in reading and studying this truth about our Savior…for does not that woman of ill repute represent all of us before we came to know who Jesus really is in our lives? Who can boast or brag about the wonders of our Biblical knowledge when we understand the true meaning of the life our LORD?
Gracealone1, are not all of us deserving of a burning hell when we recognize the sin in our lives? Yes. Can any one individual follow and live God’s commandments perfectly each day? No. Do you believe in the “little god’s doctrine as preached by all health, wealth, and prosperity teachers….celebrity preachers as well as the small, local 501c. 3 church” where man becomes a sinless god of his own making?” Only you know the answer to this question. Have you ever seen true tears of repentance flowing from the eyes of the church and people leaving the church building in utter disgust of their own sins…..I have not witnessed one morsel of repentance from those who proclaim Christ in a church, no, not one ounce of it…..but I have had the privilege of witnessing and practicing genuine repentance in an assembly of a few….praise God.
This wicked, evil woman….this sinner whom the Pharisee called out….did what none of the self proclaimed righteous folks did….she loved on Jesus with every fiber of her being while the others watched.
This sinful woman honored her KING with everything that was in her. Do we do the same?
We can only imagine the utter disgust and the self righteous thoughts passing through the minds of those religious folks on that very day, and I often wonder when I read this amazing truth over and over again in my prayer and study with our LORD Jesus Christ, how did those pseudo righteous folks treat that woman prior to her entering this man’s house? Were they speaking truth in love to her so that she too, would one day be in heaven, worshiping Jesus eternally?
I wonder.
And at the end of the day, I would consider it a great honor to commune at the table with this disgusting, plain and simple woman of ill repute, this sinner whose sins were forgiven our Savior, and listen to her side of the story and ending with those eternal Words from Jesus Himself, “Your faith has saved you. Go in peace.”
So, “Go in peace.”
And thank-you Ed, for honoring all of us with your Navy service. I know it was a humbling experience for you, for we have a son in the military. And from this mother’s heart, I can personally testify that my prayer life increased by a hundred-fold, for then I had to believe and trust that everything belongs to our LORD. Praise God.
“Go in peace.”
LikeLiked by 2 people
Julie Anne
How did you ever come up with this repulsive comparison…
“amist the stench of morning breath”
I’ve been handed some breath mints more than once… 😉
But – As my mother always said…
Halitosis is better than NO breath at all.
LikeLike
Katy
Now that’s good preachin sistuh… 😉
LikeLiked by 1 person
Jimmydee
Thank you – Much agreement – It’s all about the blood of Christ….
“I find to those that add anything to the blood of Christ,
grace becomes grace plus something else.”
“…belief and faith plus nothing else was God’s methodology for salvation.”
“It is a free gift…”
Yes the blood – It is my victory…
B. L. O. O. D.
B.ountiful L.ove O.vercomes O.ur D.efects
by the precious BLOOD of Christ.
B.ountiful L.ove O.vercomes O.ur D.isobedience
by the precious BLOOD of Christ.
B.ountiful L.ove O.vercomes O.ur D.eceitfulness
by the precious BLOOD of Christ.
B.ountiful L.ove O.vercomes
Our Doubts – Our Dark Deed’s – Our Demons – Our Damnation – Our Defiance – Our Demands – Our Darkness – Our Delusions – Our Desires
by the precious BLOOD of Christ.
B.ountiful L.ove O.vercomes O.ur
Delusions – Distrust – Despair – Derision – Despising – Desolation – Difficulties – Disappointments – Deadness – Doublemindedness – Dryness – Distresses – Divisions
by the precious BLOOD of Christ.
Yes the blood – It is our victory…
LikeLiked by 1 person
Ed
Yup…
“Now, under that law of faith, there is only two “commandments”.
Love God, and Love people.
How do we prove that we love God? By loving people.
Hence, we only have ONE commandment, mandate.
Love People.”
LOVE is the greatest commandment…
Mat 22:36-40 KJV
Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt LOVE the Lord thy God
with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
This is the first and great commandment.
And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt LOVE thy neighbour as thyself.
On these two commandments hang ALL the LAW and the prophets.
LOVE is a NEW commandment…
John 13:34 KJV
A new commandment I give unto you,
That ye LOVE one another; as I have LOVED you,
that ye also LOVE one another.
And LOVE fulfills the Law…
Rom 13:8 KJV
Owe no man any thing, but to LOVE one another:
for **he that LOVETH** another hath **fulfilled the law.**
Rom 13:10 KJV
LOVE worketh no ill to his neighbour:
therefore LOVE is the fulfilling of the law.
Gal 5:14 KJV
For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this;
Thou shalt LOVE thy neighbour as thyself.
James 2:8 KJV
If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture,
Thou shalt LOVE thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
LikeLike
Rule #3 (repeat) “If you love Me, keep my commandments” and yet some are so willing to throw this out and have it redacted from their Bible and their mind in order to comfort themselves (in their sins) with the “warm and fuzzy love” they so relish. By refusing to acknowledge His demands on your life (and soul) you have called Him a liar. Actually, you are siding with that demon infested singer(?) John Lennon (all you need is love). This insane notion of your warm and fuzzy love IS the other gospel, it will be your demise-eternally.
Rule#4 “He who has My commandments and keeps them, it is he who loves Me” John14:21. You claim to love the Lord Jesus Christ and yet will have nothing to do with the commandments He has left for us to obey then you have deceived yourself, His love is not in you, you are still lost in your sins and doomed to hell-unless you repent (rule #1).
Rule #5 “If someone says, “I love God,” and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who does not love his brother whom he has seen, how can he love God whom he has not seen?” 1John 4:20. So you think you love God? Why then have you shown nothing but hatred and vitriol to those who point you to the truth of Scripture? Why do you call the Savior a liar? Why do you snicker and murmur under your breath at those who love you enough to tell you the truth?
Rule #6 “And this commandment we have from Him: that he who loves God MUST love his brother.” 1John 5:1. Even those whom you don’t like (hate) or disagree with. Telling someone the truth is the acid test of love. Warm and fuzzy is null and void in an instant if truth is bypassed.
Rule #7 “By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS. For this IS the love of God, that we KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS and His commandments are not burdensome.” 1John 5:2&3. So is it a pain to you to even consider that there are in fact other commandments to be kept and obeyed other than your favorite one: warm and fuzzy love for all? If that’s all there is to what you call salvation, then you are not saved, still in disobedience to His commands and bound for hell-unless you repent.
If a man thinks that he has somehow, of his own ability and volition, gained access to God and His salvation, then he has deceived himself, and is yet lost. Repentance is a gift from God, not something that lies dormant within all of us to be exercised at our whim. Faith is also a gift from God and is also not innate to lost human nature. Grace (that gift from God that some on this thread seem to despise) is an integral part of salvation for without GRACE no one would be saved. Eph.2:8&9 has much to say about this and should be read repeatedly until it’s full import soaks in. It is the shed blood of Christ on the cross that makes all of these gifts (repentance, faith, and grace) possible. To be sure: God the Father has no “warm and fuzzy” for those whom He has saved, rather He has done all that was necessary for our eternal salvation: the giving of His only begotten Son for the sins of those whom He has chosen for salvation.
LikeLike
When Jesus says to keep his commandments, what does that mean to you, gracealone1? I want to make sure we’re on the same page.
LikeLike
Some people use Scripture the way they want it to be used: like a weapon to control. They are the ones who lack love.
By the way, your tone is coming across as condescending and authoritarian, please bring it down a few notches.
The Management.
LikeLiked by 1 person
“Actually, you are siding with that demon infested singer(?) John Lennon (all you need is love).”
Whoa! Somebody has some issues. Demon infested?
Context is everything. A few months ago, a video went viral of a man singing Lennon’s “Blackbird” to his dying infant son who he had named Lennon James. The father, Chris Picco, had just lost his wife unexpectedly after a c-section. Days later he also lost his son.
LikeLiked by 2 people
Now listen to Chris sing “This Is My Father’s World” at the memorial for his wife and son. (Get your tissues ready.) I don’t get the impression that this man is a fan of someone “demon infested.”
LikeLiked by 1 person
“I don’t think JD is responsible for Braxton’s suicide. I don’t see how one twitter conversation could be responsible for a young man taking his life. I think it would take a lot of pain to take one’s life and a long time of deep pain where death is more appealing than life.”
As a pastor, how did JD’s exchange help a 15 year old? Why would a grown man who fancies himself a pastor have such an inappropiate exchange in the first place? Does that tell us something about his character?
Did JD not once think about how all the moves, his father’s fall, etc might have affected a kid his age?
JD is a cruel man. And many have helped him continue to be in the name of cheap grace and at the expense of the Caner family grief. Note how he had to enlist folks to help rehab his image so fast.
LikeLiked by 1 person
gracealone1
All of the rules you have listed seem to be intertwined and not separate rules/commandments at all. It is more scripture reinforcing that we are to 1. Love God 2. love each other as ourselves. You do sound angry. If there is one reading here that has not found Jesus as their Savior, anger is not the way to make Him sound like the One they would want to follow.
LikeLiked by 1 person
BTDT, and gracealone
Thank you for the tissue warning, they were needed. I agree that John Lennon did some crazy things, but demon possessed, I’m not so sure. He did state back in my teen years of reading Tiger Beat Magazine that the one person he did not want to meet was Jesus Christ. I remember that very well. I hid the magazine so my mother wouldn’t throw it out. I never felt good about his answer. I found it very sad. I am afraid that with his public view against any form of religion that he may have died without being prepared to meet Him. It is truly sad. He did put out some great songs, Blackbird being one of them.
I do have a “Christian”, psycho neighbor that might qualify as demon possessed. One day he grabs and hugs me saying how much he loves me while asking if he can carry my groceries, the next I ask him if he would mind carrying a pot roast to my car that I was taking to a dying cancer patient and her family. I have MS and tremors can get pretty bad some days. Spillage is inevitable while my hands and arms are all shaking. His response, “I’ve noticed that you get a lot of vacation time every holiday, hire a fed or state employee to champion your causes.” I pray for him every day and pray that he is not stalking me as he made it sound like he knows my schedule. (I don’t pay attention to his coming and going.) Exorcism or some really good antipsychotics are probably needed.
If you really want to criticize music, I heard a country song while having lunch at a restaurant yesterday. It was something about “my truck’s been washed in the mud, and has been born again”. I was thinking Jesus wasn’t real pleased with that one.
LikeLiked by 1 person
About that one post by gracealone1
I do to a point feel for what he’s saying under points 3, 4, and 7.
There are so many reasons I have been doubting the Christian faith, and one of them is, I’m not seeing many self professing Christians consistently live by the teachings of Christ. (Notice I said “consistent,” I didn’t say ‘perfection.’)
My mother was a Christian, and she did consistently live out the faith as best she could. I’ve seen a small number of believers on this blog and a few others who appear to me to be living out the faith, which is great. But my impression is that the majority of American Baptists, Reformed, and evangelicals aren’t even attempting to do so. (I tried sincerely living out the Christian faith over my life.)
gracealone said,
Also, I do cringe when I see Christians fall on to either side of the spectrum on this one.
You have some Christians who are way too legalistic, judgmental and harsh (gracealone1 is kind of coming across this way in this post).
Then at the other end, you do have the “warm and fuzzies” like what this poster was discussing.
One thing that troubles me about the Warm and Fuzzies is that they often teach other Christians that being a Christian means never having boundaries, which opens them up to being abused or taken advantage of.
gracealone1 said,
Is this in reference to J D Hall and or his fan club, the Pulpiteers?
Is JD Hall my brother? What if he is a wolf in sheep’s clothing?
Does being someone’s spiritual brother mean they (or their teachings) are immune from being examined or criticized? I don’t think so.
LikeLike
gracealone1 said,
This is a complaint about pelagianism or semi pelagianism?
The Bible does in fact present salvation as being a choice for each human being, not an irresistible call of the Holy Spirit, who forcefully makes one of the elect come to Christ.
A person choosing to accept Christ does not make them exercising said choice or the choice itself meritorious.
It’s God that put the rules into play to start with, so I’ve never understood the Calvinists or one Lutheran radio host who rant and rail about this and label it as being “pelagianism,” or who argue that choice becomes meritorious (it does not, it’s only your perspective of it that makes it so).
God gave you a free will, and you can either choose to accept Christ, or reject him. And if you choose him, you don’t get any credit for the choice, all glory still goes to Christ.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Brenda R.
Thank you! (for offering me some guidance)
Interestingly I pointed out to JD and his friends that by appearance their approach to challenging their Doctrinal Adversaries lacked “Love”.
I also indicated their repetitive and toxic methodology were nothing more than a relentless Crusade of taking matters into their own hands rather than relying and waiting on the Holy Spirit, exposing their lack of faith.
There response “there is such a thing as tough love”. I responded I saw no evidence of tough love either.
(in particular using the term “Canerize the Canerization” when they couldn’t think of anything else to write about)
Not long after I rebuked them (on Pulpit and Pen,,,its documented) and ask them to tone it down, (which they refuse to do)
Then they started judging me, for questioning their methodology.
They still continued with their relentless Crusades that simultaneously coincided with tragedy that struck the Caner family during the immediate time frame of JD’s infamous toxic chat with the young Caner boy.
JD if you are out there, this is what really happened.
LikeLike
Mark,
Your addressing this head on with these folks is a good thing and no sin at all on your part IMO. I don’t think that just anyone is suppose to be involved with tough love with anyone, especially someone else’s child. Even the Sr. Caner–I just don’t see how he was JD’s or anyone else’s problem other than their own public celebrity goals. As far as the young man, that is butting in where they don’t belong at any time. I know this mama bear’s claws would have been out there tearing up some folks. Not that tough love wasn’t needed at times in my home, but it was my place to do so, no one else’s. “Canerize the Canerization” sounds like a slogan for a wipe out of a civilization.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Grace alone plus rules,
I have no idea what problem you have with love. You are a very angry person. You have a major problem with the word love, by which you define as warm and fuzzy. When we give a thirsty person a drink of water, we are giving Jesus a drink of water. That is love.
I am going to dissect your rules to show you that you are in error.
Your first rule AS A CHRISTIAN.
1. Rule #1, you MUST repent AND believe on the Lord Jesus Christ.
That is not a rule as a Christian. That is a prerequisite to becoming a Christian.
2. Rule #2, A believer MUST take up his own cross DAILY, deny himself (daily) in order to follow after Christ.
I already explained this:
How do we deny your self? By doing for others (LOVE) before yourself. How do you follow Jesus without putting others before yourself? That is what taking up your cross is all about. DOING FOR OTHERS, WHICH IS LOVE. Love seems to be a word that you are most angry at.
That is NOT a rule. That is FAITH. It is living out your belief. Look at verse 24 below. As Romans Chapter 4 states, Abraham believed God, and it was belief only that justified his faith. His works SHOWED his faith. He wasn’t working FOR anything. He wasn’t working towards or for his salvation. His belief only is what saved him, and his works proved what he believed. Hence faith without works is dead. Love is the works as a result of believing, not a prerequisite to believing.
When you live out your faith, you are picking up your cross daily, denying yourself, because OTHERS come first before you. LOVE IS AN ACTION WORD. Loving people before yourself. Doing for others. LOVE.
Luke 9:22-24 (KJV)
22 Saying, The Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be slain, and be raised the third day.
23 And he said to them all, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.
24 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: but whosoever will lose his life for my sake, the same shall save it.
Next:
Rules number 3 thru 7 that you state, with a plural word, COMMANDMENTS, is just one commandment. A singular commandment.
LOVE.
You have a problem, as an angry man, with the word love.
Warm and fuzzy is not the definition of love, as love is an action word, but let me tell ya something, graceplusrules, if love as an emotion doesn’t make ya feel all warm and fuzzy doing things for others, putting them first before yourself, then you are in the wrong religion.
You are missing out on the emotional part of love, the warm and fuzzy.
Ed
LikeLiked by 2 people
Grace plus rules said:
“Repentance is a gift from God, not something that lies dormant within all of us to be exercised at our whim. Faith is also a gift from God”
No, repentence and faith are not gifts from God. Grace is the gift. Our part is to believe, and based on our part, God gives grace.
Well, I know what religion grace plus rules is. That’s a no brainer.
Ed
LikeLiked by 2 people
Ed, this was exactly the message at church today. There are some people who really make the meaning of love very complicated and angry.
LikeLiked by 2 people
Brenda,
You had said:
“His response, “I’ve noticed that you get a lot of vacation time every holiday, hire a fed or state employee to champion your causes.” ”
My response:
That shows me that this guy has no love for his neighbor. Is he a Christian, or just professing one?
1 John 3:17
But whoso hath this world’s good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?
Ed
LikeLiked by 1 person
Julie Anne,
Seems to be very appropriate for today’s comments. Holy Spirit working!!!
Remaining in 1 John 3
18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.
23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.
24 And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.
This shows that his plural commandments is just one commandment. Verse 23 uses a singular word to start, and end. Verse 24 shows it as plural. The plural is singular.
To the average English teacher, that makes no sense, but to God knows that we love people, not a person only. People is plural, Christ is singular. Loving a singular God is loving plural people.
Ed
LikeLike
That shows me that this guy has no love for his neighbor. Is he a Christian, or just professing one?
Ed, He goes to church on Sunday, plays Christian music and talks about handing out Bibles. During that last conversation that I had with him I made the statement that, “if his church stands behind the kind of behavior that I had seen from him, he would be wise to find a new one.” His response was to tell me that he didn’t care what I thought. There seems to be no real love or compassion in him.
Not wanting to judge is hard. If I go by the fruit I see, I would say he professes but does not possess. There have been other issues with this man over the past couple of months. The apartment manager said not to take it personally–he is moody. In October, while I was away for my daughter’s wedding, 2 new women moved in the building and he has been complaining to the office a lot about them. I’ve only met one of them and I thought she was nice. So I don’t know what the problem is. For over the first year I lived here he was always very nice and kind to me. He has lived here for over 10 years and when I mentioned something to the lady in the office her immediate response was–he’s moody. So she already knew there were issues along the way. I like to be friendly with everyone–but there has to be some boundaries.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Grace plus rules said:
“God the Father has no “warm and fuzzy” for those whom He has saved”
Yes, he does. What is lacking in your life, grace plus rules, is the warm and fuzzy emotion. God has that emotion. If you don’t think that God will hug us with a warm and fuzzy emotion, then you are in the wrong religion.
Ed
LikeLiked by 2 people
Brenda,
Well, I hope he has friends that can comfort him from being so bitter. He sounds like he doesn’t have many friends. He might just shove them away. There is an underlying reason that he is moody. But, only his friends/family would know. The only thing that you can do is to forgive him for being snotty to you, and to pray. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
Ed
LikeLiked by 1 person
In response to a much earlier comment made by someone named Anonymous2. JD’s church has a food bank that often out-gives the local government’s food bank (not that it’s a competition though). We also have an active prison ministry including a weekly Bible study, and frequently provide clothing and even shelter to those in our town in need.
I’m a busy guy, and don’t have time to read all that has been said in these comments, but as one of the many loved sheep in JD’s congregation, I would love to try and answer a few genuine and loving questions about the man if anyone has any.
LikeLike
Ed,
I pray for him everyday and have for a while. I have a couple of suspicions from things that have been said, but I’m not a psychologist. There’s nothing to forgive. I didn’t get angry with him and my feelings weren’t hurt. I already knew something was wrong. He has one brother, no other family that I know of. I think he needs to let go of whatever is buried inside and turn it over to the Lord, but first he needs to find Him.
LikeLike
My first and second question, Paul, would be:
1. Does he still justify his harassment of Ergun Canur’s son, and by justify, I also acknowledge that JD previously justified it, with a notation that he just went about it the wrong way. So, that brings me to my second question:
2. What would have been the right way?
My answers to my own questions are:
1. Yes,
2. Leave both Ergun and his son alone, and worry about his own congregants.
Ed
LikeLiked by 1 person
Paul Joseph,
The food bank, prison ministry and such are all worthy causes, but unloving people do these kind of things as well. They are in a works righteousness mindset.
Do you feel the confrontations that he has had with the Caner boy was warranted?
LikeLike
JA,
“When Jesus says to keep His commandments, what does that mean to you, gracealone1? I want to be sure we are on the same page.”
Answer: exactly what He has said, keep His commandments.
As for my “tone”, perhaps it is the hearer that wants to hear anger. I have presented the truth of Scripture and the Gospel. If I were to “tone it down” that would require a compromise of the Gospel to accommodate those who refuse to humble themselves before the Lord Jesus. Is that what is required of me?
LikeLike
No “warm and fuzzy”…Todd Friel, is that you?
LikeLiked by 4 people
Ed, I’m on my phone and your comment sure looks garbled. I’m on my way home from Pdx and will check it on my computer when I get home.
Gracealone, I’ll be stewing for a while about your comment. But in the meantime, what do you make of 1 corinthians 13 love verses? Is there no kindness and gentleness?
LikeLike
If faith is a gift from God then why does Jesus rebuke people for not having faith?
LikeLiked by 1 person
I sent my comment via my phone, which garbles the message from time to time. What I actually said was the following:
Graceless (which is gracealone1 plus rule #1-7), quoting scripture is fine, perception of what it means is another. You dont get it. We do.
Ed
Mod note: Thanks, Ed, I deleted the other one.
LikeLike
Now, if this graceless1 person is who Oasis perceives, or even if it isn’t, graceless1 states that God isn’t a warm and fuzzy kinda God. Todd Friel really is against the idea of an AFFECTIONATE God. I did some research on this. Todd seems to pick on the Beetles quite a bit, it seems. He doesn’t like Paul McCartney’s “silly love songs”, either, or contemporary Christian music that references love in an affectionate way. He thinks its a silly love song.
Reference: http://www.worldviewweekend.com/worldview-times/article.php?articleid=2749
And yet, the Bible declares that Jesus is affectionate.
John 13:23
Now there was leaning on Jesus’ bosom one of his disciples, whom Jesus loved.
Luke 7:38
And stood at his feet behind him weeping, and began to wash his feet with tears, and did wipe them with the hairs of her head, and kissed his feet, and anointed them with the ointment.
Luke 7:45
Thou gavest me no kiss: but this woman since the time I came in hath not ceased to kiss my feet.
Psalm 2:12
Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him.
Seems like Todd/Gracealone1 plus rules has no clue that God is affectionate in his love. Silly love songs, huh?
We have emotions because God has emotions. We are created in his likeness. If we have emotions, it is because God has emotions.
Gracealone1 has a lot to learn about warm and fuzzy. Maybe he ought to go back to being a comedian. Be sure to tip your waitresses, he’ll be here all week.
Ed
LikeLiked by 3 people
Gracealone said:
So are you saying that 100% of us who have problems with your tone have the primary problem and you have no responsibility in how you come across?
Do you not understand tone – that you can say the same sentence with the same words and have two different tones: rude vs kind?
You are quite arrogant to think that you can present the Gospel in whatever tone you want. Love is patient and kind. If you are not being kind in your presentation, I think you are compromising the Gospel.
LikeLike
Paul Joseph,
Welcome to the blog. Thanks for sharing the info about your church (JD Hall’s church). When I spoke to him by phone, he also mentioned some of the ministries your church is involved in. It sounds like it is a very active church offering some great outreach and practical helps to the community.
I’m curious to know if you were aware of his online activities before his public letter? I was under the impression that many of his congregants had no idea about his blog/Twittering, etc.
LikeLike
I personally don’t understand the concept of not wanting an affectionate God. Why would anyone embrace a cobra or scorpion? If we witness to those around us that God is a tyrant, how many do you think we would lead to Christ? He is the Way, the Truth and He is Life/Light.
Gracealone, I don’t know what your experience is with Christ, but He is so much more than a blunt object, a grinding stone. You have an obligation to answer for what you said here and an apology to Julie Anne. I don’t blame her for stewing. I have said things here that were misunderstood. It happened yesterday, but I went through and restated my comment and let that person know that I was behind his comment and not condemning him. You blame shifted to everyone here. You understand everything, we understand nothing. In your view, God has many laws and commandments for us even though we are not under the law, but are washed in the blood of Jesus Christ. I do get warm and fuzzy, because of who He is. Do you know Him? Have you found the Loving Living God? Hell fire and brimstone is not what brings people that are already broken to Christ.
LikeLike
Confession: Thank-you, thank-you, thank-you ecclesia, for the Bible study here. What wonderful Scriptures all of you have brought forth in reminding me of Who Christ truly is….I love that about all of you.
To Amos here….what a great, great piece of writing on the Blood of Jesus. When I first came to know who Jesus truly is in accepting Him as my Savior, a woman at a neighboring church came along side of me, which I so loved because I needed a good friend. She had cross stitched a small precious cross in pink and white thread on a gridded plastic mesh along with a matching case. I admired her handwork for it was perfect. When she gave this small piece of love to me, she instructed, “This is for you to carry around in your purse, so you will have it wherever you go.” I followed her instructions and a few days following, I was having a really bad day shopping, as it seemed that everyone that came across my path was so rude, unloving, and just plain hateful towards me……I felt worse than hardened manure in the back pen of the barn!
So I took out that lovely little cross out of its protected case and discovered a folded piece of paper inside. She had typed up a rich, meaningful prayer for me as well, which was so incredibly perfect for that very day. God’s love made perfect!
LOVING…….seeing a struggling grown woman standing on the sidewalk outside of a store holding that precious tiny cross, reading a prayer, and shedding tears…..yep, yep, yep, crying in public, people walking around me looking at me like I was a modified crazy woman and yet, very alone, and looking up to the heavens and praising our LORD JESUS CHRIST for the love He poured down on me that very day. O, what love our God have for us while we were still sinners! (…..and not one person, believer or unbeliever stopped from their busy day to ask if I was okay…..)
With that said, dear, dear Amos……your piece on the “Blood of Jesus” will accompany that prayer with my cross, in my purse wherever I go; my coming and my going, because I know that Jesus loves you and me.
The very first song I learned at home from my parents was “Jesus Loves Me”…”this I know”….”for the Bible tells me so.” John 3:16-17 ……first verses committed to memorization.
LikeLiked by 2 people
Katy,
Thank you for that beautiful confession/testimony. It brought tears of joy to my eyes. It is sad how people treat others and their lack of empathy, but this wonderful woman gave you a reminder of Jesus’ love to keep with you for that very moment when you needed it most. PTL for those he places intentionally in our path.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Julie and Brenda, I’ll try to address your questions since the indeed seem genuine and not extremely loaded.
Brenda,
I apologize if it seems like I was trying to justify myself or our church by our outreaches. That comment was in direct response to a question posed by Anonymous2 as to whether or not JD “feed[s] the hungry, clothe[s] the naked, and visit[s] prisoners”. We do it because we are loved, not to earn love.
Regarding JD’s comments. As soon as I saw them, I knew they were unwise and probably unwarranted, but I wouldn’t say that they were sinful. JD has admitted that he regrets making the tweets.
Julie,
You did indeed have the correct impression that extremely few of the congregants knew of JD’s online presence, which is why it seemed as though he talked a lot about himself in his letter to the church. He did so because the church knew nothing about it and he needed to give them a proper context. We aren’t an extremely tech-savvy area of the country and most of the congregation probably doesn’t even know what a podcast is. I am one of the very who does, and have followed JD’s online presence since I joined the church.
LikeLike
Paul
To be fair, Paul, my questions were indeed genuine, even though I answered my own questions, and very short, too, I might add.
Ed
LikeLike
“If I were to “tone it down” that would require a compromise of the Gospel to accommodate those who refuse to humble themselves before the Lord Jesus.”
=====Spiritual bully alert=====
Some here just “refuse to humble themselves before the Lord Jesus.” You know who you are. 🙂 gracealone1 has come to bring us the truth!! Open your ears!! Be reconciled to Christ!!
Can you tell I’ve heard it all before?
LikeLiked by 3 people
Paul Joseph
Thanks for stopping by and commenting.
You write…
“I would love to try and answer a few genuine and loving questions about the man if anyone has any.”
“and have followed JD’s online presence since I joined the church.”
Was wondering, since you seem to “Know” JD…
In your observation – Does JD live up to…
The tough qualifications for elder/overseer? 1 Tim 3:1-6, and Titus 1:5-9?
1Th 5:12 KJV
And we beseech you, brethren, to *know them (*perceive, notice, discern)
which labour among you, and are over you in the Lord, and admonish you;
And, if JD does NOT live up to these tough qualifcations…
What would “you” recommend JD to do?
Would you recommend JD to remove himself?
LikeLiked by 1 person
And Paul Joseph
Julie Anne says @ JANUARY 2, 2015 @ 5:02 AM
About the time she spoke with JD…
“At that time, he said he was under the direction of his elders.”
You say @ JANUARY 5, 2015 @ 6:47 AM, answering Julie Anne…
“extremely few of the congregants knew of JD’s online presence,”
Did the elders, who JD says he is under, know about his online presence?
If they did NOT know? – Why NOT?
If they did know? – Why did they allow that harshness to continue?
If they did try to warn JD? – Why did he NOT listen?
Was also wondering – Since the time you joined the church…
Do the elder/overseers, that JD says he is under, also qualify?
According to 1 Tim 3:1-6, and Titus 1:5-9?
Did you ever check out the elder/overseers? To see if they qualify?
Did you ever check out JD? To see if he qualifies?
Are you and elder/overseer?
Do you meet these tough qualifications?
LikeLiked by 1 person
JA,
“You do not understand tone-that you can say thee same sentence, with the same words and have two different tones: rude vs. kind.”
How is such a thing possible over the internet? Do you hear ‘anger’ or ‘arrogance’ or ‘lack of love’ by the tone of my physical voice? The “tone” argument is one of last resort for those who have no substantive Biblical argument with which to counter. It is much easier to accuse than to examine your own self, and by doing so you absolve yourself (at least in your own mind) of any guilt on any level and in essence shoot the messenger. The “tone” you have perceived is mild in comparison to the TONE of the Lord Jesus when he spoke to the self-righteous and deceived religious leaders of His day. [Before you jump my case again, I accuse no one of anything, NOR do I compare myself with Christ.] His tone then will be mild in comparison to what He has to say to those who will be cast into the Lake of Fire forever. See Matt 7:21-23 for a preview.
Someone stated that I had a “issue” with love. They are correct in that the way love has been portrayed by some here (the ‘warm and fuzzy’ crowd) I do indeed take great exception to. What a downgrade, an injury, an insult to the magnificent incomprehensible love of God as He has shown us in the giving of His Son so that we might have eternal life. The sloppy sentimentality of the warm and fuzzy crowd is disgusting because it takes the love of the Father, the sacrifice of the Son and tries to equate it with some human “feeling.” There are a few here who “get it” and probably more who may be afraid to speak up in fear of be bullied by those who accuse others of bullying. “Warm and fuzzy” even for the whole of humanity IS NOT salvation, it’s just warm and fuzzy. Neither is wishing salvation to be so just because hell is feared. “Be holy, for I am holy” 1 Peter 1:15 & 16.
If I have become your enemy because I tell you the truth, so be it.
Darrel
LikeLike
Amos,
All very good and pertinent questions.
LikeLike
A couple quick answers while I have a minute. I will try to answer more questions or in more detail during my lunch break.
I am not an elder or deacon of the church, but I can assure you that our all of our elders are very wise and Godly men who absolutely meet the qualifications thereof even if some of their online life (being a very minuscule part of it their life) may not always best reflect that. Being that the other elders have many more years of wisdom than either I or JD, none of them are quite tech-savvy enough to keep daily tabs on JD’s online presence, but they are both aware of it, and JD or others like myself let them know if there is anything that they should be instantly aware of.
Like I said, if I have some time later, I will try and answer more, but I must go for now.
LikeLike
Darrel,
How is being “warm and fuzzy” a downgrade? Why is it not an addition to the power, sacrifice and sufficiency of God? God is the Father/daddy Abba that I never had. I grew up with a tyrant child abuser as a male role model. I would prefer not to think of the Supreme roll model in that way. I think of Mary sitting at Jesus feet and I’m thinking she was pretty warm and fuzzy. How about the Samaritan woman–pretty warm and fuzzy thee. Zacchaeus…the list goes on. There are many sides to our God. He is both a lion and a lamb. Lambs are pretty warm and fuzzy. I think your version is very one-sides and God is anything but that.
I am well aware what Jesus did for me so that I might be saved and have eternal life and the good news fills me to overflowing at times that I feel I would burst if I didn’t tell someone about Him.
Your writing does seem angry. If you mean it another way, then you really need to think about explaining your views in another way so that you are clearer. You wouldn’t be watering down the gospel by telling it in a loving way rather than being hostile.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Graceless states:
“The sloppy sentimentality of the warm and fuzzy crowd is disgusting because it takes the love of the Father, the sacrifice of the Son and tries to equate it with some human “feeling.” ”
Wow. We are not allowed to have feeling of love? There is no love in this guy at all. Again, we have human feeling because God has feeling. You cannot say that human feeling comes from Satan. Created in God’s Image means that if we have, it’s because he has. Yes, Graceless, he has a warm and fuzzy.
Emotionless people regarding God is scary people. Maybe he didn’t get hugs from his parents as a child, huh?
Ed
LikeLiked by 1 person
Sorry, I notice several misspelled words.
LikeLike
“JA,
“When Jesus says to keep His commandments, what does that mean to you, gracealone1? I want to be sure we are on the same page.”
Answer: exactly what He has said, keep His commandments.”
What, in your view, are “His commandments”? Where would these be in the Bible?
LikeLike