SSB Sunday Gathering – December 14, 2014

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Spiritual Sounding Board – This is your place to gather and share in an open format.

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When the time came, Jesus and the apostles sat down together at the table.

Jesus said, “I have been very eager to eat this Passover meal with you before my suffering begins.

For I tell you now that I won’t eat this meal again until its meaning is fulfilled in the Kingdom of God.”

Then he took a cup of wine and gave thanks to God for it. Then he said, “Take this and share it among yourselves.

For I will not drink wine again until the Kingdom of God has come.”

He took some bread and gave thanks to God for it. Then he broke it in pieces and gave it to the disciples, saying, “This is my body, which is given for you. Do this to remember me.”

After supper he took another cup of wine and said, “This cup is the new covenant between God and his people—an agreement confirmed with my blood, which is poured out as a sacrifice for you.

Luke 22: 14-20

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Feel free to join the discussion.
You can share your church struggles and concerns.
Let’s also use it as a time to encourage one another spiritually.
What have you found spiritually encouraging lately?
Do you have any special Bible verses to share, any YouTube songs that you have found uplifting?

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photo credit: Hannah

h/t Joel for music recommendation

21 comments on “SSB Sunday Gathering – December 14, 2014

  1. Happy Sunday, everyone. 🙂 I have much to be thankful for this year, as I reflect back. My daughter gave me her old car last night, because she just bought herself a new SUV. And I’m so grateful that my mom beat her cancer and is healing from the surgery and radiation.

    Liked by 2 people

  2. waitingforthetrumpet2 on December 14, 2014 at 5:43 AM

    Rejoicing with you in all blessings you are enjoying! Thank the Lord, doctors, and your daughter for helping you and your mother in your need.

    Like

  3. 2 weeks ago my 17 year old asked if we could try church attendance again after our year of painful revelations and accepting our families spiritual abuse in the Gothard homeschool cult. Our children have various issues of stunted faith and as adults we are asking forgiveness and offering support and love.

    This child was sincere and I was shocked at her request. I suggest that church was not what was missing but a relationship with Jesus. She did research and came back to ask me again. She knew her Dad is still so upset that she wanted to discuss this topic with me first. Good call. She had researched several churches in the area, studied their statements if faith, listened to pod casts and selected 3 possibilities according to our beliefs. We talked pros and cons as she is a pragmatist. We č elected a safe sounding service, made plans and then invited Dad to join. This was done days ahead to give him time to process it all.

    Week one advent we attended with 2 daughters. Week 2 with one but no obvious issues. We lived the music and festive surroundings all after years if none of this allowed. We discussed light topics all week. Today she was exhausted from busy week of school and activities. She woke on time and then asked if she could sleep in. No problem with getting rest as another huge week if exams and activities loomed. She was shocked I didn’t quote scriptures at her but told her legalism was no longer our family friend. Her dad and I pray she will heal and make friends with Jesus and know His love. Enough for now. This is our Christmas miracle this year. Easter was a PTSD breakdown but we are free and healing. We are open to Gods plan either way.

    Did any see this recently? My 23 year old just sent it to me. We homeschooled with BJ curriculum and visited many times.

    Liked by 1 person

  4. She was shocked I didn’t quote scriptures at her but told her legalism was no longer our family friend. Her dad and I pray she will heal and make friends with Jesus and know His love. Enough for now. This is our Christmas miracle this year.

    Oh Deb, that is so encouraging to hear about your family’s recovery after spiritual abuse.

    Re: Bob Jones – if you are talking about the recent GRACE report, yes I have seen it. The Wartburg Watch has an excellent article summarizing the pdf report and commentary. I have at least one post in the works this week.

    Liked by 1 person

  5. Friends, this video was played at my church today. It really, really disturbed me, but when I tweeted the production company, they said (among other things) that “we are the abusers that have been radically saved.” https://shiftworship.com/product/your-gift/
    Would you all mind giving this a watch, & tweeting @shiftworship with your thoughts?

    Like

  6. Xianjaneway, I watched the video and know nothing about the company that produced it. I think the word abuse can be very triggering for many people along with neglect, manipulation, prejudice, trauma, bullying etc. On the flip side, how many of us have engaged in this behavior in some way in our own lives? Some of us abuse our own bodies with substances, food, and overwork. Some of us abuse our privilege of being upper-middle class and white.

    I know I can be focused so narrowly on the neglect and abuse (emotional) in my own life that I forget the ways I may have been hurtful to others. Until we see God face to face there are many questions about pain and suffering that we can’t understand. I understood the video to be focusing on how we as individuals have sinned, yet are still able to experience God’s love and forgiveness. I don’t think they were referring to victims of abuse needing to accept and have communion with their abusers. Nor saying that perpetrators should be exempt from lawful punishment.

    I am sorry that the video was personally hurtful to you. I am glad JA provides this forum to let us vent our frustrations and hurts. I want you to know that I believe anger is a good and healthy response to abuse. It helps those who have been hurt avoid manipulative people. However, even the worst of perpetrators will have to face God one day.

    Like

  7. XianJaneway

    I have watched the video several times. I am torn on how I feel about it. When I hear the words abuse and manipulation–I think the Lord rescued me from that last year when I divorced the X abusive manipulator. Then I think the video is right. None of us are deserving of the gift that Jesus gave us, but he gave it freely and it is there for all who are willing to believe and accept it. We celebrate Christmas because of our thankfulness that Jesus was willing to come as a baby, completely dependent on humans to care for Him. He cared so much for all of us–even abusive manipulators, thieves and murderers. If they would give their hearts and lives to Him, there would be change. They would not be those people any more. It is only by the grace of God, that we are not like them. He is working on us until completion. He would work on them too if they would only let Him.

    Like

  8. See, all of that is *true*. Jesus DID come to save sinners, and abusers, and manipulators! However, the context of this video is reconcilliation. I’m not okay with that. I’m not remotely okay with that.

    A solitary girl chooses not to knock on a door. She chooses to leave a building. She chooses to get into a public transport…and then, because of God’s amazing Gift, she chooses to go *back*, and into the building, and knock on the door.

    Is she an abuser/manipulator? Is she a victim? We don’t know. But what does the church’s track record tell us? Who is the church more *likely* to tell, “None of us deserve Grace, we’re all recipients of a gift that we didn’t deserve.”

    There’s no mention–not a single mention–of repentance in that video. No mention of a changed life.

    Just that girl, knocking, and who the heck knows what’s behind the door? Since none of us *deserve* God’s gift of grace, would what’s behind the door even be an issue to the makers of the video?

    Sorry, I’m not buying it. But my church did. And 500-700 people watched it.

    Like

  9. Often forgiveness and reconciliation should be done at a distance for the safety and well being of the victim. One can forgive but not renew an acid relationship.
    Jim

    Liked by 1 person

  10. XianJaneway,

    I didn’t grasp that, but you are right!! She was going back to make nice AKA reconcile with whomever was behind the door. I suppose that depends on the relationship. I’m certainly not going back to the X abusive husband no matter what changes he makes. You are right though, it was not clear what the relationship was or whether or not it was safe for her to make that attempt.

    Liked by 1 person

  11. I just hope that after seeing the video no one thinks they have to give their abuser a gift and that they’re not showing grace if they don’t.

    “There’s no mention–not a single mention–of repentance in that video. No mention of a changed life.” Exactly. I noticed that too, Jane.

    Like

  12. Xianjaneway, I also didn’t catch the idea that she didn’t knock the first time. That kind of changes it for me too. That unfortunately leaves the audience with the burden of projecting their own experiences onto the story, like a video Rorshchach Test. The girl returning to the door would not be the answer or even safe for many.
    Thanks for pointing that out. Christ knocking at the door would be one thing, but not some young girl. Especially if there is no repentance from the person behind the door, but possibly more abuse! Will you say anything to the church staff or would that be fruitless at your church? Thanks for your insight!

    Like

  13. One thought that I have about the BJU report is that, contrary to a lot of opinions, they’re not just “IFB.” Bob Sr. was a Methodist (immersed Methodist, but Methodist nonetheless), and Bob Jr. was both an ardent anti-Calvinist and good friend of (ardent Calvinist) Ian Paisley. Their theological training–and this from a friend of mine who was a graduate assistant there–actually deliberately avoids certain stands, such as the “Calvinist-Arminian” debate. So there is some cognitive dissonance and even some (fundamental style) ecumenism in the place, though certainly BJU is welcomed in many IFB churches.

    That said, hopefully the kind of openness and apparent repentance indicated in the response to the GRACE report becomes the norm for all churches, not just IFB, and hopefully BJU follows through on their commitments. it’s at least a good first step.

    Like

  14. Regarding the video, my take is that it’s muddled theology with mood music and mood setting. Muddled because, well, Christ died for all our sins, and what gift exactly is she bringing to that apartment?

    And mood music….well hopefully that’s obvious.

    Like

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