Compelling Evidence that Vision Forum Inc. is Closing, Liquidating and Doug Phillips “Show” of Repentance Revealed

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There is now overwhelming evidence that the for-profit arm of Vision Forum is indeed closing at the end of the year.  Also, there are public statements alluding Doug Phillips’ public statement of repentance was not genuine.

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To save some time, I will relay each new development and brief summary in no particular order.  At the end of the post, I will post a timeline so you can see how it all fits together.

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Compelling Evidence of the End-of-Year Closing of Vision Forum Business

The biggest news you may have heard is that T. W. Eston at Jen’s Gems is reporting that Vision Forum, Inc., the for-profit arm, will be closing effective December 31, 2013. I’ve asked Mr. Eston if he could provide source information and he has respectfully declined in order to preserve his sources’ anonymity.

Today there were two new comments confirming Eston’s assertions of Vision Forum, Inc., closing:

TnT Says:
November 29, 2013 at 1:32 pm

I have numerous friends who are employed by VFI and have been told they will no longer have a job as of Dec. 31st, 2013. Tis true indeed.

noturniptruck Says:
November 29, 2013 at 4:42 pm

ditto! I can also verify that!

This most recent comment is the most revealing, seemingly coming straight from Vision Forum:

mike race Says:
November 30, 2013 at 11:10 am

In an email my wife received this morning from Vision Forum it stated this near the bottom:
“By placing an order you will be participating in our inventory liquidation sale. This means great prices for you as we liquidate our entire remaining inventory. Due to the nature of this sale, all purchases are final and returns will no longer be accepted. This is your last opportunity to buy our books, CDs, DVDs, and toys for you and your family, so get them before they’re gone!”

Be sure to take a look at the post, because there is a lot of information – especially in the comments.  But please keep in mind that none of it is confirmed with identifiable sources.  I checked the Vision Forum site and the Vision Forum blog and there is no notice of this.  

Incidentally, SSB blog reader loveoneanother, left this comment Monday:

Home School Enrichment Magazine just sent me a Black Friday ad for Vision Forum’s Catalog. I could see Vision Forum sending it to me, but another homeschool company? Doesn’t that seem like an inappropriate endorsement given the circumstances? Maybe I am reading into it too much!

loveoneanother forwarded the e-mail to me and I took a screenshot of part of it:

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You can see similar ads on the Vision Forum, Inc., website.  I’ll keep you posted if I get more credible information.    (I guess it doesn’t bother this homeschool business to promote Vision Forum’s wares, even under the current circumstances.)

Today at the Vision Forum site they are announcing the last day of Black Friday sale with 50% off everything.  Maybe tomorrow will be 70% off everything?

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San Antonio Independent Christian Film Festival is Postponed for 2014

I’d like to bring your attention to another business venture (he’d probably say “ministry) of Phillips and Vision Forum.  In 2004, Doug Phillips founded the San Antonio Independent Christian Film Festival (SAICFF) which boasted of a competition with generous cash rewards (approximately $100,000).  Just 10 days before Phillips’ first public statement, the following announcement was posted on the SAICFF website and Facebook page:

Update Oct. 21, 2013: The Christian Filmmakers Academy and SAICFF for 2014 have been postponed. Due in part to financial concerns and for other reasons, the Board of Vision Forum Ministries is looking to bring greater accountability to our practices and events, and therefore is allowing more time before launching this significant event once again.  October 22

Did you catch the phrase, “financial concerns and for other reasons?”  Inquiring minds want to know what other reasons.

Some notable friends of Doug Phillips weighed in on the conversation on the Facebook page announcement as people expressed their sadness about the cancellation:

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Were these men privy to Phillips’ personal affair and troubles?  I wonder if we will ever find out.

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Voddie Baucham Reveals the Phillips Family Personal Damage Brought on by The “Esquire”


Voddie Baucham has revealed more information that I have not seen published elsewhere. (Baucham was the first to publicly confirm that Phillips was no longer teaching elder at Boerne Christian Assembly.)  A Facebook reader asked on Baucham’s Facebook page:

I am struggling with these questions as a homeschooling mom who has a huge amount of Vision Forum products in her home therefore has allowed my children to be taught by Doug Phillips. What do I tell them? That he was living a lie? Of course the Bible is the final authority on everything. Basically if you were to come forward with a similar confession what weight would all the books that you have written carry?


You can read the entire response here.  In the response, Baucham disclosed that Doug has lost his home due to the scandal:


Warn them about the cost of sin. Tell them how Doug has damaged his marriage, lost his home, collapsed his ministry, and devastated his family spiritually, emotionally, and financially. Tell them how the enemies of God are rejoicing right now; how people like you are in turmoil.


This was not any small home, but a 6,000 SF home.  Sadly, I predict a major lifestyle change for the Phillips family.

As of yet, no one has been willing to come forward and identify themselves publicly to share these kinds of details.   T.W. Eston (a pseudonym), who has recently begun submitting articles and responding to comments at Jen’s Gems blog, had this to say about the financial state that is to come upon the Phillips family.  Eston has been given this information by unnamed informants:

The board of directors has given until the end of the year for Doug and his family to move out of the ministry-owned house. The VFM board of directors will repossess (and may have already repossessed) any and all assets that Doug purchased with VFM monies for his personal use. This includes everything from automobiles, home furnishings, and perhaps even clothing. Some may view this as retaliatory on the part of the board (and perhaps it is to some degree), but the fact of the matter is they have a legal obligation to do everything they can to remedy any tax fraud and fiduciary malfeasance that Doug Phillips may have perpetrated.

The VFM board will be liquidating all VFM assets, including the house, home furnishings, office equipment and furnishings, all remaining inventory, and the Vision Forum office building at 4719 Blanco Road, San Antonio, starting January 1, 2014.

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Vision Forum YouTube Videos

On the Vision Forum’s YouTube page, there are quite a few new videos which were uploaded late September and early October, just about a month before Phillip’s announced he was stepping down from Vision Forum Ministries in his public statement.  This is a screenshot of the page in case it disappears, but presently, you can see the videos here.  The videos uploaded were part of the Vision Forum, Inc., for-profit arm and are advertisements for products in the Vision Forum catalog.  Why would someone make the effort to produce a bunch of videos if they thought their business ship was sinking?  This action convinces me that Phillips had full intentions of keeping his Vision Forum business afloat.

Narcissists think like that.  Just like the captain of the Titanic, they think they are invincible.

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In my snooping, I stumbled across something that could be part of the financial/business puzzle with regard to the Vision Forum business.  Vision Forum, Inc., had an affiliate program which was suspended late March of 2013.  This is what the website looked like before the program was suspended:    And this is what it looks like now:

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This may or may not be significant, but I haven’t seen anyone discuss it and the new change occurred the month following Phillips stepping down or being forced out of his teaching elder position at Boerne Christian Assembly in February of 2013.

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The Secret of Happiness in the Home

According to the FORGE (Families Obediently Restoring Godly Education) Ministries website, FORGE Ministries hosted a conference on September 5-7, 2013, in which Phillips spoke.   Phillips’ messages included:


Session 1: The Doctrine of Fatherhood From Genesis to Revelation, Doug Phillips

And get a load of this next title:

Session 7: The Secret of Happiness in the Home, Psalm 128. Doug Phillips


Do you think he canvassed his wife, Beall and his household to get a big “Amen” for that?

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Ancient Greece Tour

Vision Forum offered an Ancient Greece Tour and posted about it on their website.  Phillips was slated to teach on the tour, but ended up not teaching.   Did something come to light between the publishing of the trip itinerary and the actual trip that prevented Phillips from teaching?  Here is an excerpt from the website indicating Phillips would be teaching:

The Lord answered our prayers by granting us a top-of-the-line cruise ship, dedicated to our group. The tour will be 9-10 days beginning in Istanbul, Turkey and ending in Athens. Your teachers will be Dr. Joe Morecraft, Bill Potter, and myself.

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Public “Show” of Repentance by Doug Phillips

Last night, I posted an article, Doug Phillips: “Disowns” Former Vision Forum Executive Assistant to President, Peter Bradrick, Calls Him “Destroyer” When Confronted about Sins about Peter Bradrick coming out publicly on his Facebook page which he recently made public.  There is another revealing comment I found here from someone in the inner circle of Doug Phillips, Bob Renaud:

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This is more clear evidence that Phillips has not repented as he has led us to believe by his two public statements.

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Timeline Recap

February of 2013:   seems to be the month that most people agree that he stepped down from Boerne Christian Assembly where he was one of two teaching elders (pastors).

March 26, 2013:  The Vision Forum, Inc., affiliate program at Vision Forum, Inc., was suspended.

August 2013:  A blog article by Doug Phillips, True Repentance.  Was he really thinking about his own repentance when he wrote/posted this article?  Or was this to benefit someone else?

September 5-7, 2013:   Phillips spoke at the FORGE Ministries conference.

September 20-20, 2013:  Ancient Greece Tour in which Phillips was slated to teach, but did NOT.

September 2013:  Many Vision Forum advertising videos were uploaded to the Vision Forum YouTube account.

October 21, 2013:   Board of Vision Forum Ministries canceled the Christian Filmakers Academy and events connected with San Antonio Independent Christian Film Festival  (SAIFCC) (just 10 days before Phillips’ first public statement)

October 31, 2013:  Phillips issues first public statement

November 11, 2013:  Vision Forum Board announces the closing of Vision Forum Ministries.

November 14, 2013:  Doug Phillips issued “clarification” statement which only muddied the waters.

November 26-27, 2013:  Peter Bradrick comes forward publicly to share his involvement and pain.

November 28-29, 2013:   People coming out publicly on Peter Bradrick’s Facebook page insinuating that Doug Phillips profession of repentance may not be genuine.

November 30, 2013:  Notice on Vision Forum correspondence that they are liquidating inventory.

309 comments on “Compelling Evidence that Vision Forum Inc. is Closing, Liquidating and Doug Phillips “Show” of Repentance Revealed

  1. BTW, not at all impressed with the direction of that most recent blog post. They say they protect the victim – – they are NOT. The picture, the description of the victim, searchable words, nope, this is not protecting a victim. Trying to solicit “stories” – – nope – sounds like the Patriarchal Enquirer.


  2. It is important to protect the victimized , pray for true repentance for those who have been victimizers , I really pray that God convicts them , and reach out to those who need help dealing with the fallout and rejoice that God IS good. He uses these awful things to draw us closer to Him. It’s hard when bad things are done in the name of God . It’s so confusing , especially if it goes on for an extended period of time. I mean, from experience , if it goes on for long , especially for children , whoever is in control could tell you the sky is green and you REALLY actually believe it. Then when your eyes are finally opened , there’s a period of time where you are so confused by reality you don’t know who or what to believe . I’m afraid a lot of people are in that position right now . And it just grieves me. I want these people to know, there is hope and healing can happen and you CAN trust again- even in clergy . You will be changed , and you will be wary, but that’s ok. I’m just sick over this and I’ve said it before , the real healing can’t begin till this man is gone and marginalized, and never able to do these things again. Then we need to do what we can to stop this patriarchy movement altogether .period. It is NOT biblical . Period . I pray for the day this is gone , and maybe that won’t be till we reach Glory, so then please ,Come Soon Lord .


  3. JA,
    I do not know you, I do not know the people on the other blog but maybe everyone, including here should be careful what we say and write until we have all the fact. There is much speculation going on this blog post as well, not just over there. I like your blog so please do not take offence to this comment.

    I am on the outside and it is not hard to figure out who this girls is whether they posted her picture or not. If this girl is a victim, which we do not know (maybe she is and maybe she isn’t) then she should get a back bone, step up and tell the truth to prevent this from happening to other young girls who are caught in the middle of situation like this. she can not live in fear her whole life and hide, if that is what is going on. We are all trying to know and find the truth and not meaning to speculate either.

    I just think we should all be careful about speculation, even here. Just my 2 cents.


  4. Julie Anne
    December 13, 2013 @ 12:03 AM

    BTW, not at all impressed with the direction of that most recent blog post. They say they protect the victim – – they are NOT. The picture, the description of the victim, searchable words, nope, this is not protecting a victim. Trying to solicit “stories” – – nope – sounds like the Patriarchal Enquirer.

    No I agree to some extent about the “victim” in this case. BUT the video is widely known and has been being passed around, ALOT!! It’s a public video out there that anyone can access…..If anyone knows anything about this (Vision Forum or not), they would have seen it (although the ones that don’t/didn’t know who she is/was would be clueless what to look for etc).

    I still think that people that aren’t THAT connected with the situation don’t know who she is. But those that are, already knew who she was by talking about her “job description” without the photo. It was pretty easy to figure that out from there.


  5. “I am on the outside and it is not hard to figure out who this girls is whether they posted her picture or not. If this girl is a victim, which we do not know (maybe she is and maybe she isn’t) then she should get a back bone, step up and tell the truth to prevent this from happening to other young girls who are caught in the middle of situation like this. she can not live in fear her whole life and hide, if that is what is going on.”

    Even on their most recent post, he identifies her as a victim, so he knows she is. That is not a subject of debate. However, anyone who understands cults, dynamics of a hero leader – understands that she is 100% victim whether or not she was a minor. This man was in a position of authority and used it inappropriately so automatically she is a a victim without.

    Whether she tells her story or not is not for anyone else to decide. We have no right to tell her how she can live her life – even if she is in fear and wants to remain hidden. That is her call to make, not ours.


  6. No I agree to some extent about the “victim” in this case. BUT the video is widely known and has been being passed around, ALOT!! It’s a public video out there that anyone can access…..If anyone knows anything about this (Vision Forum or not), they would have seen it (although the ones that don’t/didn’t know who she is/was would be clueless what to look for etc).

    I don’t care if she’s the most well-known person in the States. It is inappropriate for
    “T.W. Eston” to spoon-feed information leading people to the identify of the victim. I am disgusted how he says the victim needs to be protected, yet is the one putting key identifying information out there. What do his actions show?


  7. Teresa N says, “maybe everyone, including here should be careful what we say and write until we have all the fact.” With all due respect, this comes across as just one more instance where there is an attempt to enforce the “do not talk” rule, a tactic employed by abusers everywhere. I am not saying Teresa is an abuser—far from it. However, I do suggest that the do not talk rule is so pervasively ingrained in evangelical church culture that abusers often do not have to apply the rule directly. Those they have influenced are conditioned to just automatically do the dirty work for them.

    Theresa N also says, “ If this girl is a victim, which we do not know (maybe she is and maybe she isn’t) then she should get a back bone, step up and tell the truth to prevent this from happening to other young girls who are caught in the middle of situation like this.” This statement is more troubling than her likely-unintended censorship. It is a prime illustration of the way abusers tend to blame and shame the victim. I am not intending to condemn Theresa for having done this. My hope is that she is simply doing something she has been conditioned to do.

    Maybe it all has to do with the all-too-many ways in which evangelical subculture diminishes women, to the point that all of us, including women who are themselves victims, can unconsciously begin to embrace the lies. I cannot say that this applies to Theresa. Only she can know if it does or does not apply. Still, I contend that it is self-evident that the abusive, misogynistic conditioning/mind control that is part and parcel of most streams of evangelicalism goes far to explain why misogynistic views are accepted as established dogma by well-meaning people.


  8. I agree Gary that this is what happens.. Ok sorry I just lost all my words. The ‘get a backbone ‘ comment is so distressing . The ‘IF she’s a victim’ sounds accusatory . I hope it wasn’t intended . People know this, when young people are conditioned for YEARS to accept dangerous abusive dogma , they buy it completely . It becomes a psychological conditioning that is as true as knowing their name . At some point they lose sight of reality and just start eating drinking and breathing and learning whatever is given out and accepting it. Backbones are broken and they take TIME to grow back . We don’t know what kinds of threats she may have been and continue to be given . She may have felt so isolated that she had been made to feel like nobody would believe her. There should be nothing but grief and pity for her just as much as we have grief and pity on his family and all those who have been harmed . I pray that people will start to understand that . This is time to build up and encourage and validate those who need it. It’s time to give grace like we have been given by God. I’m guilty of not giving enough grace to certain people and I am repenting for that. God , be with us, heal us, give is the ability to be empathetic and gracious and more like You every day. Guide us as we try to figure out all this mess so we can all move forward and advance your TRUE gospel . Wonderful Counselor, we need YOU.


  9. JA,
    I do agree that putting her picture up like that was not a very good idea. Hopefully, in the future we can all be careful what we write, what we speculate about, here, there and everywhere.

    No I am not being accusatory, I am sure in my heart that she is a victim. I am saying we do not have all the facts, none of us have walked in her shoe. We do not know the whole story of what really happened. We all can give all kinds of opinions as to what has happened but we may never know the whole truth.

    I am the youngest of 12 children, not quiverfull. Yes, I know what it is like to be a victim of sexual abuse, thinking I did something wrong, it was my fault. keeping secrets and so on.

    I also know what it is like to be trapped in the deception of Charismatic movement, dominion theology, kingdom theology, and living in fear of the false teachers, false prophets, false apostles.

    As far as saying she needs to get a back bone, forgive me for using those words. I am 50 years old and I wasted half my life running in fear of the past, blaming God and running from God. One day, I decided in my 30 to confront the family member’s that assaulted me starting at 3 years old and up. Finally, I took responsibility for what happened, I no longer blamed myself nor was I no longer the victim.

    I have at least 3 families in my church that follow Doug’s teaching to the letter and I know David Fry (deacon) amd his family at BCA in which I am very concerned about.

    I am not a good writter and sometimes do not express myself well but I try. I have said my peace and I will leave quietly………Thanks


  10. Teresa: To address the other part of your comment – – it sounds like you have indeed experienced a lot of abusive situations and even now with your family connected to “Doug’s teaching to the letter” which basically is false teachings.

    My thoughts and prayers are with you as Phillips’ influence in your life through your family is an ongoing situation. That must be very difficult.

    This place is for people who have been hurt by spiritual abuse. You are always welcome here. :)


  11. Teresa N – – There’s no need to leave.

    I’m just saying on this blog, “Cassandra” will be respected and her identify will not be revealed unless she chooses to. Even the secular media pays this kind of respect to victims. It seems that Christians should be setting the way for how victims are treated even more than unbelievers. That is why I’ve been so livid about so much leaked information from Christians who claim to protect victims. The proof is in the pudding. She is not being protected there, period.


  12. Teresa N,

    Thank you for letting us know where you are coming from. I wish I had been more careful to make points in a manner that did not seem so directed at you. While I do think we can all get caught up in ingrained or conditioned ways of thinking, you have shown us that you were speaking from hard won wisdom. I do hope you will hang around.


  13. JA,

    My family is not connected to Phillips, just my church family. I go to a Baptist church and I know 3 families in my church that follow his teachings and buys his stuff from vision forum. I personally know a family that are members of BCA right now, I am praying they leave.

    Like I said I come out of the wacky charismatic movement Word of Faith and New apostolic reformation. I am use to all kinds of scandals but this takes the cake. WOW!

    Sometimes I know my heart and my intentions,but it does not come out correctly.

    I hate this scandal because it is deceptive on many levels…..and many people are hurt by this all over the country….my heart breaks for Cassandra and I personally pray she tell the truth to expose Doug for the scum bag he is.

    Whom the Son sets free is free indeed, praise the LORD for that. I am free at last no more bondage.

    Gary, no worries.


  14. Ok, sorry, I misunderstood. You illustrate how powerful Phillips’ teaching is – – – that 3 families from your church have their own pastor, yet Phillips’ message is louder than their own pastor!! That is the message that needs to get out!


  15. I so appreciate your careful clarification Teresa. This is such a difficult subject rife with triggers and sticky bristles and just utter devastation. I will add to my list of prayers those families at your church, that they too will break free from their bondage. Thank you for sharing your story. Praise God that you got free!!! What an amazing Father in Heaven we have!


  16. well you guys got your wish. The photo of “Cassandra” was edited to ONLY show her hand with the ring and her face/head has been edited out. I agree with this decision and think it was for the best. But enough damage was done :(


  17. Please leave mrs Botkin alone. She is a sincerely modest unassuming woman who is at complete peace and Godly contentment. She is so busy being a “here you are” vs. A “here I am” person in her personal interactions than she neither seeks nor basks in glory. Every time we are together she is quietly interested in others and had not interest in being front and center. God’s word. Forbids out judging motives. I no longer want my picture taken for the simple reason i am so heavy now despite very careful eating habits and i just hate being photographed
    Please let us seek to use our time loving God and others. This black hole of drama seems to keep growing wider and deeper as we feed it. Let us pray for others and keep the confessing of sins and weaknesses to those in our own life.


  18. Seeking true humility–respectfully–i’m a bit confused…I’ve heard no negative mention of Mrs. Botkin in this thread. I’ve posted many times on this particular discussion thread so i looked back and maybe I have missed it, but I’m not sure what it is, that has you so upset. I don’t know the Botkins–so i know it hasn’t been part of any discussions I’ve been apart of–and in all the reading about this subject throughout this website,I cannot recall any negative comments directly mentioning her in a negative way.So please set your mind at ease about that. Now, most of us here are not in agreement or in support of her families’ outspoken and very public beliefs in Patriarchy and their support of Doug Phillips and Vision Forum Ministries and VF inc. Obviously by your show of concern and the words you use , you are a supporter and you are welcome to engage at any point, if you have something you’d like to refute. If I am correct, I would just like to say that i’m sad about that. I hope you continue to keep reading these threads and posts to see truth.I hope you can break free from the bondage of Patriarchy one day and that will be my sincere prayer for you. I’m not sure where your fear of being photographed comes into play..but no one will ask you to submit a photo of yourself on here. There can be anonymity found here and that’s safe. As to judging motives, I am gonna have to disagree that that is whats going on here. We are judging proven, verified, documented BEHAVIORS that are dangerous, destructive, abusive, and depending on who you talk to, illegal. We are called to hold each other accountable. I will never apologize for standing up for the Gospel truths and where i find things to be contrary, I will speak out. I don’t do this perfectly and if there is speculation and heresay,or sin on my part, I pray that we can find the right answers and that I will repent .I think we ARE ‘using our time loving God and others’ by protecting truth and revealing wolves in sheeps clothing to hopefully spare at least one Sheep . There are people in droves whose lives have been harmed and negatively altered by this man, I feel compelled to protect the victims and survivors of his type of tyranny and heresy. And it IS heresy. And I’m sorry that disagrees with what you want to hear, and my words aren’t meant to accuse you– they are with an earnest attempt to try and spare you years of heartache that many of us have endured or are enduring underneath the chains of Patriarchy. Spiritual leaders are held accountable by God for how they lead their flocks. Doug Phillips has alot of TRUE repenting to do. Others who have victimized and wounded people in the name of this movement and used their power to corrupt and destroy rather than lead to Christ, will have a lot of repenting to do. I feel no compulsion to water that down. Those who are blindly following, I pray and weep for. I’m begging God to free them, and information,knowledge, and not allowing predators to hide because we feel like the ‘Christian ‘ thing to do is to be sweet and not speak ill of others, is how we get people safe. I’m proud of that. My conscience will not be bound in this area. I wish you felt that free. Peace to you, Sister.


  19. well there ya go–the post makes a lot of sense now… well I am sorry if Mrs Botkins or ‘anyone’s’ feelings were harmed by someone saying something regarding personal appearance. It was a bit insensitive.. Seeking true Humility–i assure you if anyone saw me in current state–they would say much worse things about my appearance! hahaha as i type I’m in my hubbys sweat pants because my maternity pants are too tight, nerdy coke bottle glasses, t shirt with crumbs on my belly shelf… yeah ‘frumpy’ would be a compliment to me right now. There are some really very important issues at stake here and i encourage you to keep reading. Please don’t let a slight dig take away from what this article is about! keep reading and we can come up with some good names to call ME I assure you. I was thinking of changing my screen name to WomanforFreedomFromWaddling…ill start us off.;)


  20. Polygamy is a topic that is occasionally broached in connection with the fall of Doug Phillips in particular, and in connection with patriarchy in general. Typically, it seems, polygamy is mentioned with a surely-they-aren’t-going-there kind of attitude. Probably the current advocates of patriarchy will not go there. Evangelical culture is just too much against the practice of polygamy. However, it may be that the doors have been opened for more extreme “Christian” fundamentalists to begin to advocate for, and practice, Old Testament style patriarchy. If news reports can be believed, some federal judge has effectively made polygamy a constitutionally protected practice in Utah. See, e.g.


  21. WfF: of COURSE, your Cult-de-sac neighbors would never DREAM of name-calling or saying anything insensitive about someone’s appearance…sarcasm off. Seriously, keeping up appearances seems very important to patriarchs. Any Christmas lights or moving vans yet?


  22. hahha Dave AA well ya know, if you’re speaking to a heathen, apparently its ok because you have God on your side–didn’t you KNOOOOW that?? duh lol

    Man on the street update…;)… ok so, lots of ‘community’ vans and trucks and still the same one trailer. Still lots of boxes, ladders and things in front drive. It appears that whatever they are doing is during the night. This morning, a really big red camping tent was put in front yard…so… its got to be moving , but here’s the thing, these are local cars and small trailer so from appearances, that would indicate they are moving somewhere relatively close. No Rental companies seen. But it aint Christmas lights and nobody is being seen during the day. Thats the latest, brought to you live from the cult-de-sac at the Phillips Compound.. Now Back to Chuck with the weather…;)


  23. This morning, a really big red camping tent was put in front yard…so… its got to be moving , but here’s the thing, these are local cars and small trailer so from appearances, that would indicate they are moving somewhere relatively close.

    A really big red camping tent? In the middle of winter? What kind of weather are you having there? What do you suppose the tent is for. I have to laugh because my family used to be in the possession of a big honkin’ orange tent that my dad picked up at an auction – – not just any auction, but the Rajneeshee auction – – the government was selling off Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh property. That was the first thing I thought of.


  24. JA that was so funny about your tent! Lol ok let’s see if I can answer some questions…. Not sure about the tent but I’m assuming its a leftover from one of his hazardous journeys lol . Btw love the expression ‘big honkin’ tent –yet another term I would’ve thought was Texan lol. The weather here is funny. Yesterday we had 34-65 degree weather . But it changes from cold to hot in one afternoon here. But it’s nice out. I have no idea why they have it up but it can’t be an estate sale. Those are only allowed with permit you have to get , 4 times a year in our neighborhood/town-we are actually our own little town- so you even have to get a permit to get your trees trimmed or they ticket you. So they’re obviously clearing everything out and packing to move but they are doing it themselves so we get to put up with the mess as it takes forever to clear out an 8,000 sq ft home by yourselves . Looks like he only has help from 3-4 of the same families. He doesn’t have many supporters left down here . Certainly no one outside his community. What I find odd is the hiding during the day working at night bit.


  25. Ill ask one of the town police what they know bout tent and trailer cause you’re not supposed to have that kind of stuff out in your front yard. Hahahha we are a very very rule centered little city. No wonder dougie wanted to live here.


  26. Julie Anne–Thankfully Rajneeshees didn’t show up at the auction and poison your Dad’s salad bar! Takes me off on a tangent to remember that we used to live in a small town with a neighbor called “Ramtha”. He’s a 35,000 year old entity who enlightens folks with his wisdom via a woman named J Z Knight. Our first inkling was seeing an extravagant horse barn, complete with Crystal Channeliers, go up. Then hollywood celebrities started showing up. When her ex-husband sued her, he also sued Ramtha. Once we were in the car, and JZ was walking along the road, wearing shimmery robes which I could only describe as like those of Saruman the Many-Colored. Hide your eyes, Kids! Ramsters succeeded in taking over much of the town, like the Rajneeshees wanted to do to Antelope and VF’ers wanted to do to America.
    For comic relief:


  27. Dave AA:

    Funny story – on our first anniversary, we borrowed Dad’s tent and went camping on Mt. Hood. It was really windy which caused the zipper to make noise all night. We thought a bear was trying to get in the tent. Didn’t sleep too well that night – – along with racing thoughts about bears, I have to admit my mind did wonder about what exactly had gone on in this tent when it was with the Rajneeshees. We never borrowed that tent again.


  28. Pingback: No, I Didn’t Die | Created to be His

  29. I’m located near Deary and attend church there. I was going to say they might be in for a culture shock if they moved here! Although, I can’t say I’m keen on any cult group coming our direction!


  30. From what I know about this group, most likely the problems the group will face will be internally amongst the group. The women wear dresses and I’m pretty sure head coverings, so you may see them out shopping or doing business in town.


  31. Just going by appearance might be hard, but the town is so small that usually the residents know all about you before you even know your moving there! lol We have many groups in the county, including Anabaptist, Mennonite, and Hutterite, who where dresses all the time, but I don’t think we have any groups here yet that are wearing head coverings (besides the Mennonite caps). My daughter and myself wear dresses almost exclusively, although I want to make clear it is our own choice and preference and not because we’ve been told to do so. We are the only ones at our church that do and we do not judge those who don’t. We attend a wonderful little Bible church where Scripture is heavily taught (in context!). I think that anyone with cult inklings might feel a little uncomfortable! lol Newcomers may find this logging community to be kind of rough-and-ready. It is also very low income and can be a hard area. And if you are not used to real winters, it might be a shock. Deary hit -15° just a couple of weeks ago! There are a lot of wonderful people here, but I can’t say that all outside groups have been welcome.. It just depends on the attitude of the group. This area is full of tough people made that way be their environment and hard work. And most have a decent amount of common sense and practicality. If a cult was only intent on holding their group together, it might not be too bad for them, but if they want to grow their group this probably isn’t the most ideal place for that. Moscow on the other hand….


  32. Whinney Marie: Thanks for giving us a glimpse of that area. Evidently it’s just a few hours from me. I’m in Eastern WA in the desert and it sure was cold a few weeks ago. I don’t think we got below 0, but we were at single digits. I had to laugh at your “Moscow on the other hand . . . ” :)

    Welcome to SSB :)



  33. I saw that you were fairly close. :) Eastern Washington does have a bit of a different look than here! You do get a lot more wind than we do. Yes, Moscow is the little liberal island of Idaho with it’s fair share of religious groups that are, shall we say, a bit different. We call it little Eugene (as in Eugene, Oregon). There are some really great folks that live there and some great churches, but there is a bit more variety than what you might find in the outlying areas. Thank you for the warm welcome. I wish you and your family a very Merry Christmas! :)


  34. A question was asked earlier in this conversation thread about James Leininger, the benefactor to Vision Forum in its early days. Here’s something I read in a separate matter (Bill Gothard’s empire unraveling). This little blurb is not germane to the article, but was nestled in the middle of the article, which I think you all may find interesting.

    “ATI and Patrick Henry College (started and initially funded by HSLDA) also share a rich donor. Dr. James Leininger, a Texas physician, homeschooling parent, and part-owner of the San Antonio Spurs, has long bankrolled conservative Christian projects. He was a founding director of Vision Forum. He served on the Advisory Board for IBLP. And not only was he “one of the first and most significant contributors” to HSLDA’s Patrick Henry College, he also is currently on that college’s Board of Trustees.”

    I wish to give him the benefit of the doubt that he is charitable. His stepping down from the board of VF just might be an indicator that he realized that not all was well with VF. And now, he’s realizing not all is well with IBLP (Bill Gothard’s empire). I feel for him that that his philanthropy has been spurned. May God give him wisdom in his generosity.


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