Street evangelist Tony Miano was arrested again, this time in Scotland for breach of peace and “homophobic aggravation.” Is this modern-day persecution?
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I ask all who follow Cross Encounters Ministries and/or visit this website to pray not only for me, but for Christians around the world that are facing various forms of persecution, most far more serious than what I experienced in Scotland, as they lovingly and boldly proclaim the gospel to a lost and dying world. ~Tony Miano
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Did Tony Miano just say that he is being persecuted? Really? Well, I disagree with him and will show you why, using Miano’s own words. The sad part is that many people are so trusting of the title “street evangelist” and get hyped up when they read about Christians getting arrested. They assume that the story is about someone really being persecuted for sharing the Gospel.
Let me fill you in on what has happened last week in case you missed it.
Street evangelist Tony Miano was arrested last week. You may recall, last summer he was arrested in Wimbledon for “homophobic” speech, but later was released and charges dismissed. This time, he was arrested and held for approximately 28 hours in Dundee, Scotland:
Christian Legal Centre client, Tony Miano, was arrested this week after a woman complained that he had spoken about sexual sin.
The Christian street evangelist was remanded in custody overnight and later released on bail to appear before Dundee Sheriff’s Court on 22nd April.
Tony, who is a former Los Angeles Deputy Sheriff, was arrested on 8th January on a charge of alleged breach of peace with “homophobic” aggravation.
Some amazing saints are on the front lines of battle, but is Miano one of them?
Real persecution does not involve drawing attention to oneself by tweeting, asking for interviews, blasting social media with your arrest story that you could have prevented by being a decent human being and respecting your social surroundings, the political climate of your host country, and by speaking in a reasonable level of volume.
I’ve been watching Tony Miano from a distance for a while – especially because he has the same disturbing behavioral characteristics of others I am familiar with – people who are possibly doing more damage for Christ than good.
If you look back on Miano’s social media, you can see that he pretty much predicted his plight and chose it, all the while, pleading for donations to continue his “ministry.” The pleading for donations is not uncommon.
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Let me back up a bit and give you a chronological timeline.
In the previous tweet, we see the name Josh Williamson. Josh Williamson is the pastor with whom Miano just visited in Scotland. They’ve been friends for a while. Pastor Josh Williamson, also a street evangelist, tweeted about his buddy, Miano’s arrest.
August 2013 – Miano obviously had a good idea of the political climate in the country of Scotland when he tweeted this:
September 2013 – Miano’s friend, Pastor Josh Williamson, is arrested in Scotland, not once, but TWICE in one week. Again, Miano identifies the threat he knows he will encounter in Scotland.
I think it’s time for a Spurgeon intermission quote. I’m pretty sure these guys love Spurgeon. It’s a good quote:
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Never talk of what you have done, but go on to something else. An officer rode up to his general, and said, “Sir, we have taken two guns from the enemy.” “It is well,” said the general, “take two more.” ~C.H. Spurgeon
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Back to the timeline.
November 2013 – Ok, this is a bit odd – only two months before his arrest in Scotland, Miano penned an article entitled, “Hello Officer!” – Interacting with Law Enforcement and Security. Miano, shows his audience how to prepare in advance so you do not get arrested for street evangelism in new locations. It’s almost as if he a prophet predicting his upcoming arrest!
Here’s a snippet from the article:
Do Your Homework
. . . When open-air preaching, pick an area on public property upon which a gathered crowd will not impede the free flow of pedestrian and/or vehicle traffic. Check for local ordinances that may lawfully regulate aspects of free speech exercise (i.e. amplification, displays, etc). . . .
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January 2014: Tony goes to Scotland and teams up with his friend Pastor Josh Williamson of Craigie Reformed Baptist Church.
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It should come as no surprise that street evangelist Tony Miano was arrested.
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Again, Miano knew there was a good probability of an arrest, having widely reported his friend’s arrests in Scotland earlier. They are both cut of the same cloth as far as street preaching style goes: volume level, places to preach, etc. These kinds of persecution stories go viral on social media and it started immediately from Miano’s friends before the news media got the story. Miano’s volunteer sent this out notice out:
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The tweets start rolling in. I know how to tune a violin, please pass me a violin now so I may accompany as you read the following:
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Editor note: I removed a tweet here by request. The tweeter no longer supports Miano. 12/18/14
Valor? Courage in the face of danger? No, Miano created his own conflict and he knew that going in. This is no man of valor, this is a man addicted to public media attention and uses Christ to get that attention. Who is getting the glory here, Christ or Miano?
Ok, so now at Craigie Reformed Church, they have a little dilemma. Their guest is in prison. But their ministry was to do outreach with Miano this particular evening. What’s a Christian to do? I’ll let you read:
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My darn A string just broke. Does anyone have a spare violin string I can borrow? I wanted to accompany for the prison visit. I guess I can just play with three strings.
So let’s get this straight. Here is the purpose of the outreach straight from the Love Scotland website:
So Miano, knowing the political climate of Scotland and their free speech issues, of his own volition, without any coercion, asks for donations to be able to take this trip possible, is arrested for breach of peace, spends time in jail, and they CANCEL the outreach that evening??? As if Miano is the only one who can do the outreach?
“I, the persecuted street evangelist, was in prison, and you came to visit me,” JAS translation.
In the meantime, the media picked up the story. Those mean police in Scotland arrested Miano and the world is watched this violation of free speech, religious persecution, and intolerance. What is the world coming to?! Seriously!
Included are articles from the US, UK, and Canada:
Did you notice it says “he has been bailed.” Wait a minute. What’s that about? A bigger question is: who is paying the money for him to go back in April? Donors?
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Ok, well, it seems that now that Miano was bailed, things are back to normal. But what does normal mean to an evangelist? One might think it means drawing attention to Jesus and His work, right? Well, not so for Miano. His social media behavior shows otherwise. Now I don’t doubt that he had a time of preaching, but it’s important to take a look at what his social media behavior shows as a representative of Christ, too, right (on his donors’ dime)?
Meanwhile:
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I read there were 47 people in attendance. But then we get this report from Tony:
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For a guy who is “evangelizing” in a foreign country with the bill footed by donations, it’s astonishing to see the amount of time he spends telling his story instead of His Story. Are we supposed to feel sorry for the man who lost sleep because he chose to go to a country in which he knew there was a likelihood of him getting arrested if he talked about a controversial subject?
Does Gospel evangelism necessitate the discussing of controversial subjects? No!
If his ultimate goal is Gospel outreach, how is he going to win souls for Christ behind bars for crossing those controversial lines? This business about “I was just sharing about sin and was discussing sexual immorality” – – um, no, he was pushing the hot buttons that he knew already existed in his host country.
Drama, people, it’s all about the drama, and here is more of Tony to make sure you get the story – all of the story – from many sources – because we know that “his story” aka the Miano arrest story is the most important agenda on a gospel outreach trip, with a little sprinkling of: pray for me and the souls who will hear me and my story once I get out of prison for words that I chose to utter publicly in this host country. Spare me.
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But wait, there’s more. After losing a whole day that could have been spent in outreach, you’d think he’d want to make up for lost time, but instead of doing Gospel outreach, he spend time arguing with someone who called him homophobic on Twitter – – because that’s sharing the love of Christ, right?
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Another quick Spurgeon break:
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So much remains to be accomplished that we have no time to consider what has been done. ~C.H. Spurgeon
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While I was compiling the links to the news articles, I almost missed it, but there it was. Tony Miano was obviously spending time looking up his own story because I found two comments from him in a Canadian news article. Could it be that he made it part of his daily routine in Scotland to check out Canadian news? And then he just “happened” to find an article about himself on his way out the door to evangelize?
Well, here it is and take note that the first comment was 19 hours from my screenshot, but notice the second comment was from the time of the screen shot.
So, that means he came back to the article twice to defend his “persecuted” self. Yea, the man is pretty obsessed with himself and defending himself because that’s how persecuted Christians behave. :::yawn::::
I actually have more than twice the amount of screen shots and links than you see on this article, but I think the point has been made. We need to do our homework and look at the public behavior and discern ourselves, not just by the news media which loves to cover the popular Christian persecution slant, but by the evidence of their own words in their everyday dealings with people.
Note to Miano: Your social media trail is giving you away.
311 thoughts on “Street Evangelist Tony Miano Arrested Yet Again: Is it about his story or His story?”
Ummm. . .you might want to check out the credentials of the Canada Free Press – it’s been described as a ‘whacko newspaper’. . .(as a Canadian, I wouldn’t want anyone thinking people here take it seriously)
Also, I really think Miano should have another four-letter first name. . .D***. Sums up my attitude about him.
Mod note: Edited out the name in an attempt to keep this place G-rated 🙂
Read up on her, Julie Anne – you’ll soon see he’s probably got a receptive ear. Nuts, the pair of ’em!
I expect Teabilly Phil will be jumping into the fray soon, too.
Is it not obvious this is all about Tony all the time? He accuses people who disagree with him as “Christaphobic”? Seriously? If they weren’t,they will be now thanks to Tony misrepresenting Him. Sheesh!
Scotland, England? Hmmm. I suggest Tony be a real man and try this in say, Iran and experience REAL persecution.
On the island of Niue in the South Pacific I saw a New Zealand “outreach team” at work harassing a captive audience: the local outdoor market. At the time my faith in Jesus was merely on pilot-light, but the Lord was fanning it into a stronger flame. I was ashamed and embarrassed by their behavior. It was completely insensitive on so many levels. Not knowing anything about Tony, my first thought on reading your title was, “I wonder what he did to break the peace.” I wasn’t surprised to find that he brought it on himself.
See, I suggest Tony is imminently qualified for the designation of Manly Man of Valor award, on condition, of course, that he wear the regulation uniform to the awards ceremony:
“Is it not obvious this is all about Tony all the time? He accuses people who disagree with him as “Christaphobic”? Seriously? If they weren’t,they will be now thanks to Tony misrepresenting Him. Sheesh!”
He also accuses people who disagree with him as “may not b saved.”
Isn’t that interesting, Diane. I had a case this morning of someone lashing out at me and accusing me of lying without providing any kind of proof. Miano uses the same tactics. If he doesn’t like what you say, he will call you names (if you are a man, he will call you feminine, if you are a woman, he will call you manly), he is also really big on determining whether someone is saved or not. I thought only God could do that.
At the 2 min 37 second mark or so Miano is talking about his “retractors”. A retractor is a medical device used in surgery to hold organs apart…I have used one many a time….could he have meant DEtractors? Who knows.
He says, he has, “no time to give them any time. There are some who are simply looking for conflict, looking at any opportunity to make much of themselves and to try to cause disunity and disharmony within the Body of Christ. And, so, we’re giving them no quarter (?), we’re not responding to any of their comments but they’re out there.”
Disagree with Tony Miano = causing disharmony and disunity…so I guess we better not be doing that. lol He is sounding more like a cult leader as he progresses.
I have no doubt that Milano is using this situation to stir up his supporters. Jesus had a few things to say about how to act when being persecuted and toward persecutors, and He modelled that behavior. I do not see the model of Jesus in Milano’s actions.
That said, whether or not Milano’s arrest should be labeled persecution depends mostly on what he was arrested for and charged with. If he was being too loud, or blocking public access, etc., then I wouldn’t call it persecution. If he was arrested specifically because of the content of his message, and if that message was biblically true, then it is a form of persecution (albeit it mild compared to what people in other parts of the world experience).
“…he is also really big on determining whether someone is saved or not. I thought only God could do that.”
Oh no, evidently Miano can proclaim who is or is not a Christian. Remember this?
“Tony Miano @TonyMiano 10h
@billohno@DefendTheSheep Julie is not a Christian, Bill. She is a wolf, seeking to devour Christians. Sadly, that’s how she gets her kicks.”
9:12 PM – 4 Sep 13
My goodness….he sure seems to make many unkind tweets. I wonder — is that a fruit of the Spirit? Is that evidence of being a TRUE Christian (like he likes to declare people)?
That tweet shows that Miano can’t prove his accusations. For Miano, evidence and even the Scriptures don’t matter. CON is Miano’s buddy and in the right “camp”(MacArthurite Calvinistic Dispensational YEC Baptists) and you’re outside their “camp.” Therefore, CON must be telling the truth. It’s the same reason that Fred Butler tweeted Miano’s CON defense blogpost and video (where Miano claims you’re not a Christian), and declared his full agreement with it.
Interesting, Nick. And the whole reason I tweeted Miano in the very first place was to warn him about his involvement with CON – that CON and his reputation might hurt Miano’s ministry. I hadn’t followed Miano enough to understand his “ministry” as I do now.
Instead, MIano had CON write the foreword to his Should She Preach? book and then later we heard that Beaverton Grace Bible Church has designated Miano to be one of the missionaries they as a church will support $$. You pat my back and I’ll pat yours, I guess is how it works.
AnotherTom – – You would not believe the links/videos/tweets I had collected on this story. It became very daunting. But anyway, there is a video out there of Josh Williamson doing his street evangelizing. He is in the middle of a courtyard with stores on either side behind him. The acoustics would have been great for me to bring my high school choir – – in fact, I’d look for a spot like that for them to sing because there would be no need for any extra amplification.
When Josh was speaking – just as Miano does – he has a very loud voice and it carries very well. It surely would have been disruptive if you were trying to carry a conversation with someone in the vicinity. In the video, you can listen to him speak many levels louder than the people who were attempting to challenge him. Williamson’s voice simply overpowered theirs. Miano’s voice is the same (as is O’Neals). Remember, these guys go on and on about preaching with AUTHORITY. Yelling = authority to them, I guess.
He says something puzzling at the 8:15 min mark of his almost 40 min youtube of him describing his arrest.
(YouTube Love Scotland Tour- Tony’s Arrest in Dundee)
He says his family is his FIRST ministry. If that’s really true, why is why is he even in Scotland and why is 2014 such a heavily travel-packed year for him with several overseas and other trips?
He says he is going to do whatever he can “without compromising the mission” to get back to “Mahria and my girls.” Since he already compromised the “mission” with this arrest (they had to cancel/delay events and exchange preaching outreach time for “supporting” Miano’s court date), all while knowing that homospeak will probably get him arrested and he did it anyway, why is he now being “mindful of my circumstances” as he states in the video at the 7 min mark?
He says, “we are going to exercise due caution while we are out on the streets”, and if says he gets arrested again before he leaves, the sheriff would most likely command that he stay in Scotland pending trial and he would be staying IN JAIL the entire time. He doesn’t want that…too hard on the girls.
It’s ok to get arrested and spend an overnight in jail, or be detained for a few hours and released as he was in England, but I guess even Miano has a limit on how much persecution he is willing to suffer for Jesus. One day in jail- yes. Three months- no thanks, God. But what about the gospel and calling homosexuals to repent of their sin, like he did on that first day? It was important then….why not now? Why is he putting his being “mindful of his circumstances” before his gospel of calling out sin? I would think God might be a little miffed…coming in second place, and all. 🙂
David Robertson, a local Scottish pastor, has a good article at CT. His conclusion:
“Let’s not cry wolf until the wolf is actually at the door. And in future is it too much to ask that self-appointed evangelists and ‘ministries’ might actually have the humility and Christian courtesy to liaise with local Christian churches before they minister in our name to our people? Or are we simply to be those who are left to pick up the pieces and deal with the consequences of the inevitable train-wreck?” http://www.christiantoday.com/article/crying.wolf.is.free.speech.being.suppressed.in.the.uk/35363.htm
That is such an excellent article. Thanks much for posting it, Dave. I completely agree. Miano will disregard the whole thing, though, because he claims he did not use any amplification.
“If we seek to be faithful to Jesus Christ then we are to obey his words to be as wise as serpents and as harmless as doves. That means in a culture where homosexuality is seen as a ‘shibboleth’ issue and ‘homophobia’ is the sin against the Holy State, then you cannot stand on a street corner and shout out a sentence which includes homosexuality and sin in the same phrase, without expecting some kind of violent reaction. Did the Apostle Paul stand on the streets of Rome and yell out ‘Caesar is not Lord’?! Did he parade the streets with banners declaring ‘Down with the antichrist Emperor’?!
Being put in jail in Scotland for ‘preaching the Gospel’ will play well with the supporters back home and Christians in the UK who are desperate to jump on the persecution bandwagon. But in terms of communicating the Good News to the people of my city, it is not helpful. In fact, to be honest it does the church and the gospel, harm, both in the short and the long term. In the short term it reinforces the cultural stereotypes and ignorant prejudices of those who already think we are mad and bad.”
That part was good, Lydia. This really struck me as it is something that I can hear CON people like him say:
Of course the implied criticism is that those of us who are living and working here as Christians are not a) preaching the ‘full’ Gospel or b) getting out on to the streets communicating it.
I can easily see proud street evangelists saying something like this.
I’m very saddened to think that Miano, in his zeal for “his story” created such a ruckus in Scotland and around the world. Compare the heart of the message of Robertson who has spent 22 long years working hard for Christ in his beloved country of Scotland and all of the words coming from Miano via social media/interviews. Which one says “Christ?” And which one says “me?”
I think it’s important to look at the charges against Miano,
“(001) On 8th January 2014 at Murraygate, Dundee you ANTHONY MIANO did behave in a threatening or abusive manner which was likely to cause a reasonable person to suffer fear or alarm in that you did repeatedly shout and utter homophobic remarks;
CONTRARY to Section 38(1) of the Criminal Justice and Licensing (Scotland) Act 2010 and it will be proved in terms of Section 2 of the Offences (Aggravation by Prejudice) (Scotland) Act 2009 that the aforesaid offence was aggravated by prejudice relating to sexual orientation.”
So he deliberately draws attention to himself by shouting and pinpointing a sin that he KNOWS will get him arrested, and that is persecution?!?!
As for Williamson, I found this,
On Wednesday after addressing shoppers in the pedestrianised centre he was taken to Perth police station and issued with a warning after he refused to move on – from http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/local/perth-kinross/perth-preacher-may-face-charges-1.133762
So, Williamson refuses to move on, and Miano deliberately shouts and pinpoints a certain sin; and they label this persecution?!?! This is blatant disobedience to Christ! We are called to be meek and lowly, wise as serpents and innocent as doves. These men are in sin, blatant outright sin. They purposely seek to draw attention to ‘self’ and exalt ‘self’ over Christ. They live for the attention and their 15 minutes of fame; this is a disgrace and nothing more than prideful works of the flesh.
I want to share a comment left on my own blog concerning this fiasco….
“There can be no justifiable pity for Miano here. He continues to preach his gospel of hate, agitation, confrontation, and self-seeking ambitions. It is supposed that he thinks more money will come his way for yet another instance of “persecution” that was staged to that end. This man is an enemy of the cross of Christ, an evil worker, whose god is his own belly and should not be regarded as a “brother in Christ” for he speaks against the Savior at every opportunity.
Preaching the Gospel and being persecuted for doing so is one thing. But I have yet to find an example of real Gospel preaching coming from this man’s mouth. For those who would defend him know that you are complicit with the evil he projects, and are just as much an enemy of the cross of Jesus Christ as is Miano. Take care that you do not insult the Spirit of Grace by saying this man is doing God’s work, for he is not. ”
What’s even more shameful is that Miano is embraced by men like Phil Johnson, Paul Washer, Steve Lawson, and Chuck O’neal. I suppose birds of a feather do flock together don’t they? This is a PRIME example why we should NOT follow mortal men, celebrity pastors, etc. Miano does NOT have a ministry empowered by Christ, he has a scam going that enables him to plaster his mug all over the internet and the news, and he has a way to scam people out of money so he can ‘jet-set’ around the globe and pretend to be something he isn’t…important.
I hope Miano repents of his sin, and comes to faith in Christ, receiving the true Gospel. He, obviously, does not know what the Gospel is. He keeps claiming to having been persecuted for the Gospel; yet what we hear from him is not the Gospel, but “homosexuality is sin.” Well “Homosexuality is an abomination” is not the Gospel. (Why do we have to keep reminding some Calvinists what the Gospel actually is?) Evidently, he doesn’t know the true Gospel.
I was telling my dad about your post, and he quoted Luke 6:22: “Blessed are you when people hate you, and when they exclude you, revile you, and defame you on account of the Son of Man.” (NRSV) Dad said that Miano is being reviled for his own ignorance, and not for the sake of Christ. When Miano repents, preaches the true Gospel and then is genuinely persecuted, we’ll come to his aid — and not until then. (I have a great dad.) Excellent post: every word of it.
If you want to read a good biography on a street preacher from Scotland, read Robert Flockhart – http://www.amazon.com/Autobiography-Robert-Flockhart-Street-Preacher/dp/0801037131
This man was a true street preacher! Here is a very brief snippet…
“There I stationed myself on a wall by the wayside. Many of those who resorted thither for amusement, as well as for the purpose of drying and bleaching clothes, assembled to hear me, and the Lord gave me great liberty in declaring His word to perishing sinners. The work was the Lord’s, and He strengthened me to perform it. The late Dr. Simpson, of the Tron Church, was the only minister at that time who encouraged me in my labours. He came forward before the multitudes that stood around me, and shook me by the hand, at the same time wishing me “God speed !” He approved of the doctrines which I taught. Shortly afterwards he came to hear me, and brought Mrs. Simpson along with him. At the conclusion of the service, the little girl that accompanied them came up and presented me with some money, which I returned, saying I did not preach for money — I came not to seek theirs, but them. ”
This was told by a friend of Robert’s…
“On no point, perhaps, did I hear him speak oftener than on the sinfulness of ” restraining prayer,” — the weight of guilt lying in these days on the churches of Christ, and on individual Christians, for spending in idle visits, frivolous talk, and unprofitable reading, time that might be redeemed for prayer. One evening (and I believe it was one of the last on which he was able to take his accustomed place on the street) I happened to call upon him about an hour before his usual preaching hour. On reaching his door I found the room dark ; but remaining quite still, I could overhear him, in a deep under-tone, ” as a man talketh with his friend,” telling out to the Lord his griefs and fears, his designs and expectations, in regard to the work he was going to — ” Lord, dinna forsake Edinburgh ! dinna forsake Edinburgh ! Why should our preaching here be so powerless ? Consciences are not pricked, hearts are not broken, souls are not saved. The enemy is come in as a flood. Oh, pluck thy right hand out of thy bosom ! Lord, dinna forsake Edinburgh ! ” It was real pleading, real wrestling, ” crying out of the depths.”
Here is an example of a heart sold out to and for Christ, a heart that breaks over the lost souls all around it. THIS is what a true man of God looks like…..his Master.
Amazing Dave A A…they ALL have ‘each other’s back’ don’t they? J.D. Hall is a very rude, arrogant man; again, these birds of a feather all flock together. They verbally attack anybody who dares to disagree with them, they have their own ‘brand’ of Christianity that gives them some magical kind of authority over the rest of us. If you disagree, you aren’t saved! Amazing how they know this! God have mercy on them, they are all deceivers and do NOT represent the Christ of the Bible. They seek power, money, control; this is a mighty machine growing and picking up steam and Miano is trying to get on board, if he isn’t already. He does have some pretty ‘heavy hitters’ backing him. It’s all works of the flesh and will very soon be brought to nothing.
They all have the same tactic…launching verbal attacks, name-calling, insulting, and belittling. These are all very arrogant men who do NOT know the Christ of the Bible. May God shut the mouths of these deceivers.
Because I’m a huge First Amendment advocate, my first response was, “WHERE? What jurisdiction here in the USA has this on their books?” (Even if I find what Miano preaches to be obnoxious.) Come to find out, as we know, that this is in Scotland, which is, obviously (at least right now), part of the United Kingdom.
I’m actually surprised he was let back into the UK after the last time he was arrested. It wouldn’t surprise me if Her Majesty’s Government put Miano on a list of undesirable aliens (where he’d join the likes of the Westboro Baptist Church) after this latest stunt. Just because the US and the UK have a good relationship doesn’t mean they can’t keep out people deemed undesirable, and Miano may have hit that point.
I see this as a brilliant publicity stunt by an ego driven extremist. He will no doubt use it to raise a boat load of cash from naive Christians that don’t research this incident or his past incidents.
The first amendment isn’t portable when you leave the country. If tough guy Tony is really so hard up for publicity ( and the opportunity to show what a tough guy he is) maybe he should just go to Pakistan and publicly declare Mohammed a child molester,an adulterer and Allah a false god. Now that would be a youtube video worth watching.
Yelling at women outside an abortion clinic and harassing gay folks that need Christ may make for cheap publicity , but it’s totally antithetical to the true propagation of the gospel. Where did Christ harass people ? He just preached and performed Miracles. Now if Tony would just do something that is not publicity driven, that would be a miracle.
Oh for Pete’s sake, he has the Calgary Stampede pencilled in as tentative this year.
He’s as welcome as H1N1. Bet he is clueless about some of the outstanding churches in Calgary, as well as outreach groups. Check that, he doesn’t care, since it is about him.
Bet you a Tim Horton’s donut he’ll look up a guy named Artur Pawlowski. He is well known as an obsessed street preacher who likes jumping into Stampede festivities. http://tinyurl.com/lqzuxps
“Where did Christ harass people ? He just preached and performed Miracles. Now if Tony would just do something that is not publicity driven, that would be a miracle.”
Randy
I have wondered the same. Jesus seemed to always have some sort of following because of his powered being displayed — usually in the form of healing someone or raising the dead. He didn’t stand on the corners and yell at people who were going by trying to ignore him. He also interacted with men AND women on a personal basis. He didn’t treat women like they were lesser human beings.
Tony doesn’t seem to have a clue about anything but Tony.
The nit-picking, petty criticism here of Tony applies equally to the apostle Paul. Paul deliberately walked into a trap he clearly saw coming, as an act of political activism that attracted publicity, and changed him from church planter to lifelong political prisoner. This was God’s will for Paul, and it advanced the gospel immensely in the long run. See Acts 21:10-12.
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… a prophet named Agabus came down from Judea. Coming over to us, he took Paul’s belt, tied his own hands and feet with it and said, “The Holy Spirit says, ‘In this way the Jewish leaders in Jerusalem will bind the owner of this belt and will hand him over to the Gentiles.’”
When we heard this, we and the people there pleaded with Paul not to go up to Jerusalem. Then Paul answered, “Why are you weeping and breaking my heart? I am ready not only to be bound, but also to die in Jerusalem for the name of the Lord Jesus.” When he would not be dissuaded, we gave up and said, “The Lord’s will be done.”
After this, we started on our way up to Jerusalem.
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I will show you a biblical precedent for what is unfolding here in the UK, under our very noses, which Tony Miano and others are exposing, as a side-effect of their thoroughly conventional public evangelism. Our ruling class, like that in the USA, was once a pioneer of a glorious secular ethos known as “liberal democracy”. Proclaiming such freedom for the masses was a remarkable repentence, after centuries of subjugation of the common people. (For example, John Bunyan, author of Pilgrim’s Progress, was himself imprisoned for preaching in the open air.) Today’s ruling class in Britain is not content to leave in place the freedom it once granted to the common people. As a British saint, THAT is what concerns ME about this story, and I am offended at the callous indifference of some Americans to our plight here.
The biblical precedent of this latest twist and turn of our nation’s history is in Jeremiah 34:8-16.
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The word came to Jeremiah from the Lord after King Zedekiah had made a covenant with all the people in Jerusalem to proclaim freedom for the slaves. Everyone was to free their Hebrew slaves, both male and female; no one was to hold a fellow Hebrew in bondage. So all the officials and people who entered into this covenant agreed that they would free their male and female slaves and no longer hold them in bondage. They agreed, and set them free. But afterward they changed their minds and took back the slaves they had freed and enslaved them again.
Then the word of the Lord came to Jeremiah: “This is what the Lord, the God of Israel, says: I made a covenant with your ancestors … Recently you repented and did what is right in my sight: Each of you proclaimed freedom to your own people. You even made a covenant before me in the house that bears my Name. But now you have turned around and profaned my name; each of you has taken back the male and female slaves you had set free … You have forced them to become your slaves again.
Your worldview is troubling, I think. Miano, again, was not arrested for preaching the Gospel, not unless the Gospel has radically changed from its first-century biblical motif. Had Miano, or any other individual, preached the true Gospel in the open air, they would not have been arrested. He was not preaching Jesus and salvation but sexual ethics — sexual ethics is not the Gospel.
Nor can you force John Bunyan’s seventeenth-century context into our own by way of example. That’s just insulting and ignorant. The current state of affairs in the UK is not contextually relevant to Bunyan’s era and his open-air preaching. Mind you, Bunyan was preaching the Gospel, not Miano’s sexual ethics. The same can be said of the apostle Paul. He preached the Gospel, not sexual ethics.
But then you stretch all the way back to Jeremiah’s era and force his Israeli context to that of modern UK and the US. What on earth? Has God given Miano or anyone else a mandate for open-air preaching on sexual ethics? If he had stuck with preaching the Gospel, then we would have spoken up in his defense. That you have turned this situation on its head says way more about you than it does even Miano.
William – You raise a really good point. Both times he was arrested, in Wimbledon and Dundee, he was focusing on “sexual ethics” as you say. He must be following Hollywood’s motto of “Sex Sells.”
“The nit-picking, petty criticism here of Tony applies equally to the apostle Paul.”
Miano stated he did not deliberately attempt to stir up trouble, incite a reaction from the police, push the limits or test the authorities to see how far he could go before getting arrested. Did you watch the youtube?
Comparisons to Paul seem to be very popular. Miano did that very thing himself in his latest youtube when he compared himself to first Luther, then the apostle Paul and last but not least, Jesus …. all while saying…now…now…I am certainly no Luther, Paul or Jesus so please don’t think that…they are just my examples. Of course, he really is comparing himself to them.
In the almost 40 minute docudrama of himself talking about himself and his arrest, he stated something about “retractors” (which I assume means detractors). He made the point of saying how he would given them no quarter (?), pay them no attention nor respond to their comments.
I just counted seven tweets by him this morning doing that very thing. Responding to a re/detractor. I thought he wasn’t going to do that? He even insulted the re/detractor:
“Tony Miano @TonyMiano
No less than 11 Scottish denominations r publicly supporting me. Why would I worry about a flea?
4:37 AM – 14 Jan 14 from Highland, Highland”
“Tony Miano @TonyMiano
When worse persecution hits Scotland, real Christians can count on the Flee to side w/the enemy.
4:38 AM – 14 Jan 14”
I cannot help but notice Miano insults frequently.
Paul may have seen the trouble coming, but he didn’t go out of his way to make trouble for himself. In fact, when he arrived in Jerusalem, he followed the advice of the other apostles there, and did all he could to defuse tensions with the Jewish leaders there. It didn’t work out, but at least he didn’t go to Jerusalem to pick a fight.
I really don’t see how you can compare Tony Miano’s case to Paul’s. From where I sit, Miano seems to thrive on controversy and making trouble. And, as Julie Anne has pointed out, I think he has an unhealthy interest in seeing his face on the Internet and his name in print. He even recorded himself being interviewed on Fox News, and then posted it online! Sheesh…
In fact, I can’t think of any behaviour of Miano’s that even remotely resembles St. Paul. His approval of an abusive jerk like Chuck O’Neal… his chauvinistic and insulting treatment of Julie Anne (and just about anyone who disagrees with him)… his bullying tactics towards total strangers outside abortion clinics… his begging for handouts for his family, instead of working to feed them himself… They all strike me as being very un-Christlike. Or is that just more “nit-picking, petty criticism” on my part?
I have no idea what kind of plight Christians are suffering in Britain. But I also have no idea what Tony’s grandstanding could possibly accomplish to alleviate it. I can’t see why you’d want him as an ambassador for Christ in your country. I sure wouldn’t want him as one in mine.
“I, the persecuted street evangelist, was in prison, and you came to visit me,” JAS translation. LOL!!
Truth is that Miano has classic narcissistic personality disorder. From Psychology Today: “Individuals with narcissistic personality disorder generally believe that the world revolves around them. This condition is characterized by a lack of ability to empathize with others and a desire to keep the focus on themselves at all times.”
But…all in the name of Christ! If you don’t agree, you’re going to hell! Repent!
The faithful at BGBC have seen their hard earned money go toward paying off a lawsuit that their pastor initiated and now toward a man who not only is a law breaker, but one who seems to welcome breaking the law.
IMO, those who want to evangelize have to consider the audience. Who needs to be evangelized? The unbelievers, not the believers.
So, you need to get the unbelievers to see they need Jesus. Sexual immorality is not a good place to start, as that is mostly the one kind of sin of which the average unbeliever can say: “I harm nobody, the church is wrong about sex (homosexual acts/ sex out of wedlock/ whatever).”
If you want to convert, you’d want to talk about those things of which God is already starting to show them is wrong: Perhaps the bit of time they steal from an employer, the way they lie to make themselves look good and someone else look bad by comparison, etc. That way, you may get the listener to agree (s)he is a sinner and needs Jesus.
Homosexuality? Bring them to God and let Him work on convincing them. The place Tony started is not where I think God’s wisdom would lead an evangelist to start.
If you want to convert, you’d want to talk about those things of which God is already starting to show them is wrong: Perhaps the bit of time they steal from an employer, the way they lie to make themselves look good and someone else look bad by comparison, etc. That way, you may get the listener to agree (s)he is a sinner and needs Jesus.
This is excellent, Retha. Miano’s abrasiveness incites anger. Unfortunately, that doesn’t matter because he and those in his camp will say that the Word of God won’t return void. They think as long as they are preaching God’s word authoritatively (yelling), they are doing it the Biblical way.
Homosexuality? Bring them to God and let Him work on convincing them.
Exactly! As a believer, who is attracted to his own gender nonetheless, I came to Christ not by messages of how sinful my “homosexual behavior” was but by the mere fact that I had offended a holy God. People like Miano tend to think that homosexual sex is the totality of the homosexual’s sinful context. That is not only tragic but also unbiblical.
“I see this as a brilliant publicity stunt by an ego driven extremist. He will no doubt use it to raise a boat load of cash from naive Christians that don’t research this incident or his past incidents.
The first amendment isn’t portable when you leave the country. If tough guy Tony is really so hard up for publicity ( and the opportunity to show what a tough guy he is) maybe he should just go to Pakistan and publicly declare Mohammed a child molester,an adulterer and Allah a false god. Now that would be a youtube video worth watching.” Randy
“Tony doesn’t seem to have a clue about anything but Tony.” Bridget
Sorry to piggy-back off what Randy & Bridget said, but that seems to be what it boils down to, IMO.
Who needs to hear the gospel of Jesus more than the people of North Korea, for instance? Since Tony is the self-proclaimed & willing to be persecuted one, does his itinerary reflect the danger? How dangerous was England (to you as a Christian) the last time you were there? Too dangerous to go there yourself, so you’d rather finance Tony’s trip to England?
Let’s get real, folks. This is a how-to on traveling the world on someone else’s dime. Yet more fleecing of hard-earned cash with a little “persecution” & “gospel” thrown in for good measure. It seems in Tony’s mind tweets, videos, etc. are 100% necessary to update donors on how their hard-earned money is justifiably spent for his travels & trips. I expect the updates/communications about his trips to continue, since they are the other half of the transaction for the money he rakes in. He gets trips, you paid to get to hear about it. Is that how the gospel to England & Scotland works?
“Since Tony is the self-proclaimed & willing to be persecuted one, does his itinerary reflect the danger?”
Well, “willing to be persecuted” has its limits. One night in jail is a can do. Being actually charged, and having the possibility of a longer stint in jail if arrested again, required him to become “mindful of my circumstances” as he stated in his video, and exercising due caution for the rest of his time there.
IOW…no more willing to be persecuted in Scotland, since he said another arrest would likely get him extended jail time and a you may not return home to America to await your trial card. That would be hard for him and his fam. Sorry, God. No can do.
I think his” gospel” may have changed during his remaining days in Scotland….think today is his last day there.
“Well, “willing to be persecuted” has its limits. One night in jail is a can do. Being actually charged, and having the possibility of a longer stint in jail if arrested again, required him to become “mindful of my circumstances” as he stated in his video, and exercising due caution for the rest of his time there.
IOW…no more willing to be persecuted in Scotland, since he said another arrest would likely get him extended jail time and a you may not return home to America to await your trial card. That would be hard for him and his fam. Sorry, God. No can do.”
A far cry from missionaries & ordinary people (like Corrie Ten Boom’s sister) who have given their lives through the centuries.
It reminds me of reality tv celeb drama played out as real life for $$$. I fear for Tony. May God have mercy.
I really couldn’t care less about Tony Miano. Perhaps he is the obnoxious twerp (or “straw man”) many here are saying he is. So what? What Police Scotland did to this man, any police force in the UK can do to anybody, for saying anything at all, anywhere. Tony’s freedom is mine. If he didn’t have freedom of speech on this occasion, then nobody in the UK has freedom of speech on any occasion.
The freedom of expression Tony exercised before his arrest is exactly the same freedom of expression that others exercise on Gay Pride Parades, albeit expressing different ideas, different *content*. There is far more at stake in this (admittedly mild) persecution of Tony than irrelevancies such as whether Tony is polite to his critics when using Twitter, and other such irrelevancies.
I am British. I want back the freedom that the arrest of Tony demonstrates that we have *all* lost, throughout the UK. I disagree with the government of the day about all sorts of issues, and I was born with the right to say so free of criminal sanctions inflicted by the courts, or extra-judicial punishment by police officers such as 28 hours detention in a police cell. I shall die having lost that right. That is what I learn from this affair. That is something I care about. I do not care whether Tony Miano is polite to the same extent. He can be a complete and utter pig as far as I am concerned. I want him to be free when he is in my country, because I want everybody to be free when they bare in my country.
Unless we defend the freedoms even of those whom we dislike, we shall lose our freedoms, deservedly.
John Allman: if this is so very important to you, then why don’t you challenge the law rather than Tony? About the worst that could happen to Tony is that he’s tossed out of the country and not permitted to return. For a citizen, the consequences can be somewhat more catastrophic – from time at the station, to spending time in court or jail, fines, loss of job, loss of reputation, etc. How do I know this? There’s absolutely nothing like discovering your entire neighborhood has been plastered with flyers bearing your picture and the words RELIGIOUS BIGOT. Back in the day I used to picket the cult of Scientology, so I do know what it means to put my money where my mouth is.
I have been addressing the fleecing of the flock, true missions, & religious persecution.
Reminder, speaking to the public about sex in a public place isn’t exclusive nor does it define Christians. There are atheists & persons of other religions that believe the same as what Tony was saying about sex.
Freedom of speech is a different matter. I hold dear the laws which protect freedom of speech in my country. However, I understand laws in other countries are less supportive. That is a shame. I don’t claim to know off the top of my head what UK’s laws are on this matter. However, I do know as guest visiting another country I follow the law or run the risk of arrest while I’m there.
John Allman, To be clear, are you saying Tony’s arrest violates current UK law?
If Miano had framed his alleged “persecution” in terms of free speech, I could get on board with what you’re saying. He didn’t — he whines about being “persecuted” for preaching the Gospel, which is untrue, since he wasn’t preaching the Gospel.
I do, however, empathize with your overall complaint: people should be able to voice their opinion (their interpretation of certain biblical passages) that homosexual sex is a sin — that God will send people to hell for it — without being persecuted, jailed, fined, etc., for those expressions. But what about the tone of those expressions? What about the effect that negative tones inherent in some of those expressions have on those against whom he is yelling (I mean preaching)?
Street preachers like Miano convey a tone in their messages that is aggressive, intentionally offensive, and end up pissing people off instead of ornating the gospel of Christ (Titus 2:10) in such a manner as to inspire them toward faith and repentance. Meanwhile, when they meet opposition, they deceive themselves into thinking that they’re being persecuted for the sake of righteousness, and consider all opposition — even from other believers — as an honor and a trophy. Sad.
The Apostle Paul was ready to acknowledge that not all gospel preaching came from a good motive:
“It is true that some preach Christ out of envy and rivalry, but others out of goodwill…The former preach Christ out of selfish ambition, not sincerely, ” 1 Cor 1:15-17
Coming from the UK myself, I wonder what on Earth anyone is doing visiting us from a foreign country to preach on our streets! In our culture and in this age, it is probably the least effective form of evangelism. Even without the harsh overtones from Tony it is almost guaranteed to turn people away from the Truth.
Has Tony not done his research on what works best here? Or does he not care because his interest is not the salvation of souls, but his own selfish ambition–to be the boldest, most strident, most applauded, most notorious, most spoken of Christian ‘heavyweight’?
Someone pointed out that he would not dare try this in a country such as Iran. I suspect, with his background in law, he is well aware that the consequences for preaching in such a way in the UK are quite bearable, a very quick overnight spell in a cell. But it certainly looks good and gives him the credentials he wants as a persecuted saint.
I would be tempted to write that, with Paul, we should in good grace be thankful that the gospel is being preached, whatever the motive.
Except I don’t think this is the gospel.
Jesus’ message is not one, primarily, of judgement but of invitation:
“Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Matt 11:28
“Coming from the UK myself, I wonder what on Earth anyone is doing visiting us from a foreign country to preach on our streets! In our culture and in this age, it is probably the least effective form of evangelism. Even without the harsh overtones from Tony it is almost guaranteed to turn people away from the Truth. ”
Oh Chris, I so agree and am so embarrassed about this. Yes, it will turn off more people than anything else. With Tony’s track record, it is easy to see he is a narcissist and seeking attention. I am tempted to write the local Dundee paper and apologize on behalf of some of us American believers. I wish they were taking comments on the page where the arrest was reported but they aren’t.
I have close connections in the Lancashire area and they simply lump guys like Tony into the JW and Mormon categories, whack jobs who knock on doors. they would never take them seriously and they are not believers. That is the real shame.
This is about a deliberate act of rebellion, wording your speech in such a way as to offend and cause attention to be drawn to ‘self’, which led to his arrest. He KNEW NOT to use homosexual/homosexuality and yet, he did. The Gospel is NOT centered on homosexuality, Christ died for the ungodly – the adulterer, the idolator, the liar, the thief, the murderer, etc. The Gospel does NOT include us purposely pinpointing any sexual sin, for sexual immorality encompasses ALL sexual sin outside the marriage of a man and woman; adultery takes care of sexual sin within the marriage. This deliberate act of rebellion against the law is SIN, SIN on Miano’s part for deliberately disobeying the law he KNEW beforehand. This is not persecution at all…shame on those who call it such. Christianity in America is so superficial, many do NOT even know what persecution is, or how to spot a deceiver when you see one. Anybody that continually draws attention to themselves as Miano does only seeks to exalt ‘self’. Miano’s actions are of the flesh, and if you dare confront him, or Chris H., or Richard Story, or the numerous other members of his fan club, you will be insulted, belittled, and declared an unregenerate. Yes, this is just how our Lord operated isn’t it? NOT!
Diane pointed out something that is most excellent, how much ‘persecution’ Miano is willing to endure. That in and of itself tells you this man purposely brought on his arrest so he could be all over the media, and he could get bible illiterate people to give him their cash. Miano claims Joel Taylor of 5ptsalt may not be saved, and we are to believe Miano is saved? Here is a man who continually exalts himself, plasters videos of himself all over the internet, purposely gets arrested {twice}, quits his job, does not work, seeks donations while he spends his day shopping for bubble wrap, or eating chinese with one of his daughters {see his keek videos}, and people are supposed to support this? Only in America would this be classified as a ‘Christian ministry’. Everything Miano exhibits reeks of being ‘of the flesh’ and not of God. Miano is part of the problem with Christianity in this nation, and not part of the solution. He needs to heed Peter’s words, ” For what credit is there if, -when you sin and are harshly treated-, you endure it with patience? But if when you do what is right and suffer for it you patiently endure it, this finds favor with God. ” 1 Peter 2:20
“Once again, the worst persecutor of Christians is North Korea, where an estimated 50,000 to 70,000 followers of Jesus are suffering in prison camps for “crimes” such as owning a Bible, going to church, or sharing their faith. In November 2013, it was reported that 80 prisoners were publicly executed, many for possessing Bibles. Last year, North Korea sentenced an American missionary, Kenneth Bae to 15 years of hard labor in a prison camp. The U.S. State Department has lobbied unsuccessfully for his release.” – – – from this article.
Tony Miano, IF you truly want to reach the lost, go to North Korea, go to Iran, go to Irag, go to places like these where the Gospel is scarce. The UK is FILLED with preachers, Iran is not. Obviously, Mr. Miano goes where HE determines, not God. For if he were truly an evangelist, he would seek to go where the Gospel is seldom preached. However, he does NOT have a heart for the lost, nor does he desire to bring God glory.He does desire to continually film his every move and let the world know it, like anybody cares. He wants so-o bad to be a ‘celebrity preacher’; like America doesn’t have enough already.
Instead, he goes to ‘safe places’, sets himself up to be arrested, then claims he is being persecuted…what an insult to our brothers and sisters in Christ who are in prison camps!What an insult to those who’ve lost their lives because of their allegiance to Christ! Enough of this phony drama; may God bring Miano and all who support his fleshly ways to repentance.
1 Corinthians 2:1-2 And I, when I came to you, brothers, did not come proclaiming to you the testimony of God with lofty speech or wisdom. For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ and him crucified.
This verse came to mind while pondering Tony’s behavior on his trip to Scotland.
Ironically, Cals like Tony love this verse as one of their 5 Solas:
Christ alone…
Jesus + nothing = everything
So when “preaching” or “witnessing” this verse is irrelevant to Tony, IMO. Of course he rails against homosexuality. Make sense?
My view of this verse is much different from Tony’s but a simple one:
“proclaiming the testimony of God” = Jesus Christ crucified as Lord & Savior to rise again
I don’t think Tony would agree with my interpretation nor would he understand how proclaiming the testimony of God in this verse has to do with what he would street-preach. Interpretation informs behavior/action.
I adhere to the doctrines of grace, and I can say that is NOT why Miano does what he does. He is filled with sin, the sin of pride. That’s what motivates Tony…it isn’t doctrine, it’s pride.
I certainly pray this thread does NOT go off on a tangent against Calvin. We are to follow Christ, NOT mortal men. There is fault in every one of us, which is what makes grace and mercy so very precious. Calvin is NOT my ‘god’, Christ is. This is why I believe it is so dangerous to label ourselves, look what it leads to.
1 Corinthians 2:1-2 And I, when I came to you, brothers, did not come proclaiming to you the testimony of God with lofty speech or wisdom. For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ and him crucified.
I said, “My view of this verse is much different from Tony’s but a simple one:
“proclaiming the testimony of God” = Jesus Christ crucified as Lord & Savior to rise again
I don’t think Tony would agree with my interpretation nor would he understand how proclaiming the testimony of God in this verse has to do with what he would street-preach. Interpretation informs behavior/action.”
Sorry, lyn. I was referring to how I’ve heard this verse taught in a reformed church as well as at a Desiring God conference, if my mind serves me correctly….
I’d be delighted if Tony & I have the same interpretation of this verse & would gladly stand corrected if that’s the case. But I’m not banking on it.
62 comments? Wow. Outstanding. Tony must be popular here, he’s certainly not on my blog, lol.
Joel,
Welcome! Many times “popular” is a positive word. I’m not so sure in this case. Your posts on Miano are excellent. I look forward to being named with you on Miano’s tweets. haha! I’ll be watching and getting screenshots 🙂
I don’t know Tony from a bar of soap so I won’t comment on him however I do know Josh Williamson and I would like to say this about him based on personal experience rather than reading tweets, seeing him from afar, etc. Josh is a man who’s passion in life is to preach Christ and Him crucified, he loves his wife and son and is passionate about the care of his flock, sure he might rub people up the wrong way but I know the times I haven’t appreciated what he was saying was because I was being convicted of sin.
How long will folks keep defending rebellious acts? How long will we hold on to our ‘celebrity pastor’ mentality and stand behind men who need to be called to repentance for their deliberate words and actions? Isn’t this man in his twenties? It brings to mind 1 Timothy chapter 3:6 – ‘and not a new convert, so that he will not become conceited and fall into the condemnation incurred by the devil.’
JA, you know he’ll just call me manly and declare me unsaved.
Lyn, my point was not to glorify or even to defend Josh at all costs… He’s not a celebrity, he’s a brother, somebody I have broken bread with. I know his conversion story, his love for our saviour, he is a changed man from the man he was. My point is this, Josh is a sinner, as am I, he knows he is a sinner in need of the loving grace of Christ. He can stand with Paul and say ‘I, the chief of sinners” he knows how much he has been forgiven. Josh was saved because a pastor who had never preached a “hellfire and brimstone” sermon before did on the day he agreed to go to church on the undertaking that a relative wouldn’t ask him to do so again, he was convicted and humbled before God.
Josh has a number of things that he needs to work on, being more diplomatic is one of them, he is not a wolf and I pray that God will show him and convict him of those things in His perfect time.
In regards to your quote from Timothy, a) Josh is not a new convert, he has graduated from seminary and has been a pastor for a number of years and b) you’re quoting from the book named after Timothy, the very young fellow who was given the monumental task of properly establishing churches. “Don’t let anyone look down on you because you are young, but set an example for the believers in faith and life” I hope and pray that Josh has older men exhorting him as Paul did to Timothy.
Up North,
I love how we think men who’ve been to seminary are qualified to preach; I believe it is a calling by God. The disciples were unlearned and yet, they turned the world upside down.
I pray Josh would not pattern himself after Tony Miano, who is obnoxious, arrogant, and rude. I have watched Miano’s videos as he badgered the lost in front of abortion clinics, and I was appalled. Naturally, he has now removed them. If Josh is of God, he needs to take Miano aside and tell him of his fleshly ways. To defend Miano speaks volumes about Josh.
“Josh is a sinner, as am I, he knows he is a sinner in need of the loving grace of Christ. He can stand with Paul and say ‘I, the chief of sinners” he knows how much he has been forgiven.”
Well, Up North kind of clued us in. If Josh & Tony are street-preaching the gospel, don’t they realize they’ve been redeemed & are no longer looked upon by God as a sinner? If they are Christians, why is God’s grace not yet sufficient for them? Isn’t grace God’s gift upon salvation? I just don’t get this “I am the worst of the worst” teaching. I think it breeds the worst of the worst behavior (this case in point). I would never teach children they are the worst of the worst. How the heck does this derailed train of thought make sense?
“I pray that God will show him and convict him of those things in His perfect time.”
So it’s God’s fault that Josh and Tony are behaving this way? We are to know God is waiting for the perfect time, somewhere in the future, to let them know? In the meantime, it’s God’s perfect plan they behave this way? This behavior was meant to be? Again, I just don’t get the absolution of personal responsibility…. Is this what we teach our kids? Your bad behavior will continue until God’s perfect time? Yikes!
All I can say is Calvinists believe in the same “born that way, can’t do any better” excuse as homosexuals, so its kinda strange they don’t get along better. And that if Calvinists were in a position to put us in jail for saying anything against them, they would. They are the same as the homosexual maffia on two counts. So you’ll have to excuse me if I don’t shed a tear for Tony. On the brighter side, when Roger Pearse covered this story on his blog, he mentioned that the law that allows for these arrests is in the process of being repealed because there was an outlandish case of a student being arrested for asking a cop on horseback “Do you know your horse is gay?” I guess outlawing childish jokes was the straw that broke the camel’s back.
In the United States Josh and Tony can do exactly what they were arrested for in Perth and it’s protected by the 1st amendment . What people forget is there is no such thing as freedom of speach in the UK or Australia for that matter. You can get arrested for literally hurting someone’s feelings. Say anything about gays, transvestism or other assorted perverts and you may get charged with a hate crime. These clowns are welcome to do the same thing in San Francisco or other gay dominated areas with total protection of the Constitution, so why go do it in the UK ?
Randy, he does it in the UK because he gets the media attention for being a persecuted Christian. Today I saw at least 4 tweets in which he used the word persecution. I just listened to a video about 30 minutes long inwhich he discussed persecution. He wants to wear the Persecution crown.
But you see, this is a farce. He wrote an entire blog post (after he was arrested in Wimbledon and after Williamson was arrested twice) regarding doing your homework, understanding the laws before street evangelizing in a new area. He KNEW what he was getting into because Williamson paved the way. This is all for show and more donations. It’s a great business. Where else can you see the world on someone else’s dime?
In the U.S., we have freedom of speech under the First Amendment to the Constitution. However, there are limits that can be established by law, including reasonable time, place and manner limits. So you cannot put up a billboard just any place you choose. You cannot exercise your free speech rights by standing up in an auditorium of people there to listen to a particular speaker and shouting over him. And if a public park is not a place established as a public forum, but rather a place to listen to birds, then the volume of your speech can be limited to protect that purpose.
Limits can also be placed so that your free speech rights do not deny other people a right that they have so that they cannot exercise their right. Among those rights are the right to peaceably use their property, which is how many places limit the use of bullhorns where people reside and may be asleep.
So, one’s rights are not absolute, but must be used with consideration of the rights of others, especially in places that have not been established as a public forum. And there are always limits on content, including laws against defamation, causing a riot, etc.
I was not using the fact that Josh has been to sem as a validation for ministry… I’m a member of a denomination that has a habit of calling the trained rather than training the called… it’s one of my biggest bug bears. What I was trying to say is that Josh is not a new convert, he’s been a Christian for around ten years. The reference to sem was to say that he isn’t a man who was converted 6 months ago, it was not meant as a validation for ministry. I confess I did personally take exception to your comment about Josh’s age completely separately from the issue we’ve been discussing. As a young man myself I get sick and tired of hearing people say “you’re too young,” its an ad hominem fallacy, age has nothing to do with maturity,ability or capability.
A mom,
“If they are Christians, why is God’s grace not yet sufficient for them? Isn’t grace God’s gift upon salvation? I just don’t get this “I am the worst of the worst” teaching. I think it breeds the worst of the worst behavior (this case in point).”
One of my favourite saying is, “how can you know what you have been saved to, unless you know what you have been saved from.” The grace v law in Christian preaching is a tough one, often the pendulum can swing to far in either direction, we focus on the saving and love of God and neglect instruction on sanctification or we focus on the law and end up becoming Pharisaical. I have often thought on Paul’s comments in 1st Timothy regarding being the chief of sinners and I believe that in so doing he was showing great humility. I have discovered over the years, as I’m sure most have, that the general view of Christians is that we are hypocrites. I have found that when talking to people and they see the joy of a man set free of the bondage of sin and the law but a man also not afraid to admit to his weakness and sin that the shutters don’t come up anywhere near as quickly. In closing on this remark, I’m not sure what gave you the idea of the belief that grace isn’t held to be sufficient to them, again I can’t speak for Tony but I know for Josh it is, he does not believe that there is anything he can possible do to deserve his salvation, and isn’t that what is so amazing about grace? Unmerited favour.
” So it’s God’s fault that Josh and Tony are behaving this way? We are to know God is waiting for the perfect time, somewhere in the future, to let them know? In the meantime, it’s God’s perfect plan they behave this way? This behavior was meant to be? Again, I just don’t get the absolution of personal responsibility…. Is this what we teach our kids? Your bad behavior will continue until God’s perfect time? Yikes!”
I never said that, I said that I, as in me, personally, pray that God convicts Josh of the things he needs to be convicted of. That’s how sanctification works, we are new creations in Christ but this side of heaven we still face the continual pull of the flesh, pulling us away from Christ. The Holy Spirit, indwelling in all believers comforts us, convicts us and teaches us. When I say, “I pray that God will show him and convict him of those things in His perfect time.” I in no means meant or meant to imply that God is responsible for Josh’s sin, that would be heresy, I was saying that asides from the work of the Holy Spirit we cannot be convicted of our sin and made into the reflection of Christ. That is a process that continues from the day we are converted until we go to glory. Sin is not God’s doing but I do know this, He uses all things to ultimately bring glory to His name, that one day every tribe and tongue and nation may kneel in worship to him.
“These clowns are welcome to do the same thing in San Francisco or other gay dominated areas with total protection of the Constitution, so why go do it in the UK ?”
Is it possible he wanted to keep the persecution momentum going? His friend, Josh, had just been arrested in October (twice I believe) and there was some unfavorable criticism of that whole deal. Damage control?
If Miano were to say just what he needed to say to be arrested, then people who don’t investigate things for themselves as well as they should for whatever reason might think – wow and double wow – there really is persecution in the UK for Christian OA preachers…etc. Let’s get on the bandwagon and help them ASAP.
In the You Are Being Rebuked For Thinking I Would Not Go Back To Scotland For My Trial twenty minute rebuking sermon Miano youtubed the other day, he mentioned there is a possibility the charges may be dropped, or something might happen with his case and he would not have to return to Scotland. He said he had no definite information on this, but, being a former sheriff, he said he knows how courts work and that it was a possibility.
I HOPE we don’t see a *send Tony back to Scotland for the glory of God* request for donations fund set up by Miano or his supporters until it is a certainty that he will have to go back. Wouldn’t that be something? People giving their hard earned money to this donation request only to find that the trip will be cancelled.
“I in no means meant or meant to imply that God is responsible for Josh’s sin, that would be heresy, I was saying that asides from the work of the Holy Spirit we cannot be convicted of our sin and made into the reflection of Christ.”
Up North, The contradiction is in the same sentence. God is not responsible but apart from the Holy Spirit none can turn away from sin.
So you say it’s impossible for anyone to feel remorse & stop doing wrong unless they are Christian AND THEN first the Holy Spirit must notify them. Sorry your theology contradicts reality. I know nonChristians that know full well the difference between right & wrong. And I am certain you know some as well. There are nonChristians who may have commented on this topic on this blog who know what Tony & Josh are doing is wrong! Do they have more Holy Spirit than Christians? Please think about that a bit.
On being the worst of the worst, I disagree. It’s not an either I’m humble & worst or I’m perfect. You can be humble AND not be the worst of the worst. What’s hypocritical is when Christians consistently behave worse than nonChristians!
I do agree with you about age. Wisdom is not excluded from young people. There is usually a correlation between age maturity & wisdom, but not always. I’m sure you’ve observed old but not wise.
Actually, Up North, I would go further to say that all capable adults absolutely know the difference between right and wrong. And each person chooses what they say & do. Which is why penalties for wrongdoing are absolutely just & right for everyone, regardless of their religious beliefs. Do you agree?
Tony & Josh made their own decisions on what to do & say knowing what the consequences would be.
Up North, you said “…asides from the work of the Holy Spirit we cannot be convicted of our sin and made into the reflection of Christ.” Maybe they decided to ignore the Holy Spirit. But what they did isn’t because the Holy Spirit wasn’t working (was the Holy Spirit on vacation?).
They 100% decided what to do and say & are responsible for their actions, for good or bad & whether we do or don’t like UK law.
In regards to Miano, today I was asked this question: “If Jesus “did not seek to get arrested”, what was he doing in the garden of Gethsemane all night the day he was crucified? Duh!” I guess everyone just doesn’t understand.
Miano just put up a new blog post which included primarily these quotes:
“In those degenerate times when men were arrived at the acme and height of impudence, and dared to speak treason against heaven, then they that feared the Lord spake often one to another. When others were plaintiffs these were defendants; when others spoke against God, these spoke for God . . . The more outrageous others are in sin, the more courageous we should be for truth . . .
“To profess religion when the times favour it is no great matter. Almost all will court the Gospel Queen when she is hung with jewels. But to own the ways of God when they are decried and maligned, to love a persecuted truth, this evidences a vital principle of goodness. Dead fish swim down the stream, living fish swim against it. To swim against the common stream of evil shows grace to be alive” (p. 5, 6). http://t.co/l20MnH3PR3
You can see where is motivation comes from in these quotes.
How sad that Miano and his fan club attempt to justify a deliberate, rebellious act as persecution, how horrifying that they pull verses out of context, like our Lord wrestling in the garden, as if Miano EVEN comes CLOSE to what Christ endured. The garden of Gethsemane has NO relevance in what Miano pulled; Christ wrestled there, knowing He was about to face the wrath of God for sin. How in the world does that compare to Miano purposely pinpointing homosexuality so he could make the media circuit and get more money from his followers?! Good grief, doesn’t anybody read their bibles anymore?!? Celebrity pastors usurp God and His word, their fans follow them right into sin and defend it, thus, becoming partakers of sin themselves!!
This is a shameful act of sinful pride seeking to justify its actions. This man is a disgrace, and a stench in the nostrils of a thrice holy God who detests haughtiness.
As for his quote, it should read, ‘the more outrageous/deliberate acts Miano delves into, which are rooted in sin, the more courageous we should be in calling him out’. This is all very sick and twisted, stemming from a heart that is steeped in sin.
Concerning Josh, he deliberately refused an order by police to move on, as I showed you. He sinned, he did NOT suffer persecution, for his deliberate rebellious act proves such. Instead of defending him, you need to call him to repentance. He has NO business standing on street corners yelling at people, then refusing an order to move along. Be as wise as serpents and as innocent as doves, otherwise, stay home and quit bringing shame and reproach upon the holy name of God.
It’s interesting that these guys are so focused on Biblical law to point out sins in their attempt to evangelize, yet push the line when it comes to civil authority/law which is clearly ordained by God (Romans 13). They are big on “we were within our legal rights,” yet they are intentionally pushing the hot buttons, challenging authority, and consequently drawing attention to SELF, raising the PERSECUTION flag when THEY caused all of this ruckus.
Ok, seriously, who goes to a foreign country to evangelize on donor $$, spends 30 minutes sitting on the sofa of his guest recording a video of HIMself rebuking people who aired their opinion of him. He needs to take it like a man, humble himself, and let it roll off his back if comments annoy him. Good grief. He’s like a 2-yr old having a temper tantrum.
Up North: You “stuffed up?” Love the differences in our English 🙂 I have a friend from UK who makes a habit of “correcting” my American English on my Facebook statuses. We have fun with that. Got your e-mail, thanks!
I spoke/commented too soon–wow, that was fast.
Now he wants $upport for not only himself, but for his wife to fly to Scotland. He is also asking for monthly $upport, because some Christians do not agree with his methods and have, possibly, changed their minds about $upporting him…oops, I mean do not understand that there is a cost for following Jesus. Nice little insult…do they ever end–the insults from this professing Christian?
“Mahria and I Welcome Your Assistance
I plan to take Mahria with me when I return to Scotland. I want her by my side if I do stand trial. Needless to say, this will be an expensive return trip. Would you please consider supporting us? In addition to our day-to-day and ministry expenses, we will need to cover flight costs, which could run a few thousand dollars.
As with my last arrest in Wimbledon, sadly we anticipate losing some of our monthly support. Some Christian simply do not understand that there is a cost for following Jesus Christ. In addition to helping us cover costs for the return trip to Scotland, might you also please consider supporting us monthly?”
I believe that many things labelled “evangelism” are done for one of the following reasons:
1. To satisfy people’s consciences. The thought pattern seems to be “I’m a christian, so I have to evangelise, so I’ll go and preach on the streets”. The fact that this “evangelism” is at best a complete waste of time and at worse damaging to the gospel is conveniently ignored in favor of an easy way to tick off another box on the spiritual checklist. But hey, why bother taking the time to develop deep friendships with people when you can just street preach.
2. To make people or churches feel that they are better than others. I guess Tony Miano is from a fairly fundamentalist background, and such people generally believe that they are the true remnant church and everyone else is compromised or liberal. The fact that they go out and preach on the streets and others don’t proves this.
It’s worth pointing out that the Calvinist doctrine of irrestible grace is an important theological driver behind this type of activity. Calvinists believe that those people who God has chosen to become christians (the elect) will be irrestibly drawn to respond to the gospel when they hear it. So all you have to do is go and preach the gospel (eg on the streets) and people will respond.
If by chance you read these comments, I suggest you check out this website next time you are planning your street ministry and focus on those countries that have people groups that have never heard the Gospel. Your results may be the same or even worse, but at least it will be from people that have never heard the Gospel and not from those that have heard but choose not to follow. I think it says in the Bible, Matt: 10:14 If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, to leave that house or city and shake the dust off your feet. That means DON’T GO BACK. There are over 7,000 people groups that have never heard the Gospel, so it shouldn’t be hard to find new ground.
Well Raymond, to go where the Gospel is seldom heard MIGHT result in ACTUAL persecution, he might be arrested and NOT released…we can’t have that now can we? This is what a ‘staged’ type of Christianity looks like, which is unbiblical.
Diane posted his pleas for money, that didn’t take long did it? Why is it some would not DREAM of giving money to Benny Hinn, but they shell out money to an arrogant deceiver like Miano? He is no different than the WOF hucksters he condemns.
So, we just don’t understand there’s a ‘cost’ for following Christ? Oh really!!! Let me see… a few years back I was working in a job I’d had for over ten years. I proclaimed Christ to my boss on one Saturday morning…after that, she came after me. It took her two years, but she finally accomplished her goal…she fired me, after being with that company for 13 years. My parting words to her were ‘do unto others as you would have them do unto you’. God saw fit to remove her from her position with the company shortly after. I continue to pray for this woman, and I have no grudge against her. I did NOT post videos when this happened, I did NOT ‘blog’ about it incessantly. I did NOT seek financial support from others. God takes care of His own.
It is disgusting phony preachers like Tony Miano that should be counted as a disgrace. He brings shame and reproach on the name of our Lord with his fleshly actions. He should lose EVERY bit of support these people give, let him get a JOB and work with his hands, like he should; let him support his family instead of traveling to ‘cushy’ places to shout at people and make sure it ALL gets videotaped. Good grief, how ignorant are people? Can’t they see through this type of phoniess?
How dare he even solicit donations for himself, let alone his wife!! He purposely brought this on, and now he expects people to PAY for his return trip?! Get real.
It is past time for this man, his 15 minutes of fame are up. Get a haircut and get a real job Tony Miano; quit fleecing the flock and using the word of God for your own personal gain. May God bring this man low, may his ministry come to what it is…nothing.
“After the earthquake came a fire, but the LORD was not in the fire. And after the fire came a gentle whisper.” 1 Kings 19:12
It is not in noise that God usually reveals Himself in greatest power. He works silently, without noise.
Jesus was a still small voice in this world. He did not strive nor cry out; neither was His voice heard in the streets. He did not break a bruised reed, so gentle was He in His goings and in His workings. Yet that one sweet, quiet life, pouring forth its spirit of love and tenderness, wrought more than has been wrought by all the armies of conquerors since the world began!
In the same way, it is the silent things, the unconscious influences of our lives, which make the deepest and most lasting impressions–and not the things which get advertised in the papers, and are most talked about.
If we would be effective in our work, we must learn to work quietly.
The greatest preacher is the one who most deeply impresses men, in matters that affect their living and serving, inciting and inspiring them to worthy deeds and beautiful godly living. The best Christian workers are those who make the least noise. We never can do our best work if we have not learned to work quietly, for Christ glory, and not for our own exaltation.
“Most encouraging has been the response by churches in Scotland. Pastor Josh Williamson of Craigie Reformed Baptist Church has received either calls or emails of support from Christians in the following denominations:
Church of Scotland
Free Church of Scotland
Free Church of Scotland (Continuing)
Free Presbyterian Church of Scotland
Associated Presbyterian Churches
Reformed Presbyterians
Elim Pentecostals
Fellowship of Independent Evangelicals
Reformed Baptists
Brethren Churches
Non-Denominational Churches” http://us6.campaign-archive1.com/?u=93d7436b921a7ebd3d2ddbf42&id=6fdf4b89e6
Since Pastor Josh received calls/emails from these denominations, then these church groups can all chip in about 200 dollars each (cannot imagine they would not want to do that to support their “gospel” preaching brother in his time of need) and Miano can get an immediate $2200 for tickets for he and his wife (that he insists on bringing) to Scotland – should he have to return (which is not a certainty as he stated things could change between now and April)…but send your money to him- leaving the memo line on the check blank, of course. UNREAL.
Spiritual Sounding Board 
Ummm. . .you might want to check out the credentials of the Canada Free Press – it’s been described as a ‘whacko newspaper’. . .(as a Canadian, I wouldn’t want anyone thinking people here take it seriously)
Also, I really think Miano should have another four-letter first name. . .D***. Sums up my attitude about him.
Mod note: Edited out the name in an attempt to keep this place G-rated 🙂
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That’s interesting, carmen. That actually makes it worse – – that he’s debating with someone on a whacko newspaper site.
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Read up on her, Julie Anne – you’ll soon see he’s probably got a receptive ear. Nuts, the pair of ’em!
I expect Teabilly Phil will be jumping into the fray soon, too.
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Is it not obvious this is all about Tony all the time? He accuses people who disagree with him as “Christaphobic”? Seriously? If they weren’t,they will be now thanks to Tony misrepresenting Him. Sheesh!
Scotland, England? Hmmm. I suggest Tony be a real man and try this in say, Iran and experience REAL persecution.
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On the island of Niue in the South Pacific I saw a New Zealand “outreach team” at work harassing a captive audience: the local outdoor market. At the time my faith in Jesus was merely on pilot-light, but the Lord was fanning it into a stronger flame. I was ashamed and embarrassed by their behavior. It was completely insensitive on so many levels. Not knowing anything about Tony, my first thought on reading your title was, “I wonder what he did to break the peace.” I wasn’t surprised to find that he brought it on himself.
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See, I suggest Tony is imminently qualified for the designation of Manly Man of Valor award, on condition, of course, that he wear the regulation uniform to the awards ceremony:
(It’s the picture that keeps on giving)
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Oh, that’s cute, Gary. And so appropriate since he was in Scotland where real men wear kilts.
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“Is it not obvious this is all about Tony all the time? He accuses people who disagree with him as “Christaphobic”? Seriously? If they weren’t,they will be now thanks to Tony misrepresenting Him. Sheesh!”
He also accuses people who disagree with him as “may not b saved.”
He happened to tweet these in response to an article written by Joel Taylor (link below)
http://5ptsalt.com/2014/01/09/why-tony-miano-really-got-arrested-again/
“Tony Miano @TonyMiano 10 Jan
The blog author is the male version of Julie Smith. Truth and integrity aren’t important to either.”
“Tony Miano @TonyMiano 10 Jan
The author of the blog shouldn’t b taken seriously.He may not b saved. He seems 2 hate just bout everyone”
I’m thinking…..the author of the above tweets shouldn’t be taken seriously. He may not b saved.
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Isn’t that interesting, Diane. I had a case this morning of someone lashing out at me and accusing me of lying without providing any kind of proof. Miano uses the same tactics. If he doesn’t like what you say, he will call you names (if you are a man, he will call you feminine, if you are a woman, he will call you manly), he is also really big on determining whether someone is saved or not. I thought only God could do that.
https://twitter.com/TonyMiano/statuses/371495379633573888
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At the 2 min 37 second mark or so Miano is talking about his “retractors”. A retractor is a medical device used in surgery to hold organs apart…I have used one many a time….could he have meant DEtractors? Who knows.
He says, he has, “no time to give them any time. There are some who are simply looking for conflict, looking at any opportunity to make much of themselves and to try to cause disunity and disharmony within the Body of Christ. And, so, we’re giving them no quarter (?), we’re not responding to any of their comments but they’re out there.”
Disagree with Tony Miano = causing disharmony and disunity…so I guess we better not be doing that. lol He is sounding more like a cult leader as he progresses.
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I have no doubt that Milano is using this situation to stir up his supporters. Jesus had a few things to say about how to act when being persecuted and toward persecutors, and He modelled that behavior. I do not see the model of Jesus in Milano’s actions.
That said, whether or not Milano’s arrest should be labeled persecution depends mostly on what he was arrested for and charged with. If he was being too loud, or blocking public access, etc., then I wouldn’t call it persecution. If he was arrested specifically because of the content of his message, and if that message was biblically true, then it is a form of persecution (albeit it mild compared to what people in other parts of the world experience).
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JA~
“…he is also really big on determining whether someone is saved or not. I thought only God could do that.”
Oh no, evidently Miano can proclaim who is or is not a Christian. Remember this?
“Tony Miano @TonyMiano 10h
@billohno@DefendTheSheep Julie is not a Christian, Bill. She is a wolf, seeking to devour Christians. Sadly, that’s how she gets her kicks.”
9:12 PM – 4 Sep 13
My goodness….he sure seems to make many unkind tweets. I wonder — is that a fruit of the Spirit? Is that evidence of being a TRUE Christian (like he likes to declare people)?
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@Julie Anne
That tweet shows that Miano can’t prove his accusations. For Miano, evidence and even the Scriptures don’t matter. CON is Miano’s buddy and in the right “camp”(MacArthurite Calvinistic Dispensational YEC Baptists) and you’re outside their “camp.” Therefore, CON must be telling the truth. It’s the same reason that Fred Butler tweeted Miano’s CON defense blogpost and video (where Miano claims you’re not a Christian), and declared his full agreement with it.
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Interesting, Nick. And the whole reason I tweeted Miano in the very first place was to warn him about his involvement with CON – that CON and his reputation might hurt Miano’s ministry. I hadn’t followed Miano enough to understand his “ministry” as I do now.
Instead, MIano had CON write the foreword to his Should She Preach? book and then later we heard that Beaverton Grace Bible Church has designated Miano to be one of the missionaries they as a church will support $$. You pat my back and I’ll pat yours, I guess is how it works.
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AnotherTom – – You would not believe the links/videos/tweets I had collected on this story. It became very daunting. But anyway, there is a video out there of Josh Williamson doing his street evangelizing. He is in the middle of a courtyard with stores on either side behind him. The acoustics would have been great for me to bring my high school choir – – in fact, I’d look for a spot like that for them to sing because there would be no need for any extra amplification.
When Josh was speaking – just as Miano does – he has a very loud voice and it carries very well. It surely would have been disruptive if you were trying to carry a conversation with someone in the vicinity. In the video, you can listen to him speak many levels louder than the people who were attempting to challenge him. Williamson’s voice simply overpowered theirs. Miano’s voice is the same (as is O’Neals). Remember, these guys go on and on about preaching with AUTHORITY. Yelling = authority to them, I guess.
In reality, yelling shows weakness.
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He says something puzzling at the 8:15 min mark of his almost 40 min youtube of him describing his arrest.
(YouTube Love Scotland Tour- Tony’s Arrest in Dundee)
He says his family is his FIRST ministry. If that’s really true, why is why is he even in Scotland and why is 2014 such a heavily travel-packed year for him with several overseas and other trips?
He says he is going to do whatever he can “without compromising the mission” to get back to “Mahria and my girls.” Since he already compromised the “mission” with this arrest (they had to cancel/delay events and exchange preaching outreach time for “supporting” Miano’s court date), all while knowing that homospeak will probably get him arrested and he did it anyway, why is he now being “mindful of my circumstances” as he states in the video at the 7 min mark?
He says, “we are going to exercise due caution while we are out on the streets”, and if says he gets arrested again before he leaves, the sheriff would most likely command that he stay in Scotland pending trial and he would be staying IN JAIL the entire time. He doesn’t want that…too hard on the girls.
It’s ok to get arrested and spend an overnight in jail, or be detained for a few hours and released as he was in England, but I guess even Miano has a limit on how much persecution he is willing to suffer for Jesus. One day in jail- yes. Three months- no thanks, God. But what about the gospel and calling homosexuals to repent of their sin, like he did on that first day? It was important then….why not now? Why is he putting his being “mindful of his circumstances” before his gospel of calling out sin? I would think God might be a little miffed…coming in second place, and all. 🙂
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Diane: You are quite the observant one. Want to write up a guest post? 🙂
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This strikes me as a publicity stunt.
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David Robertson, a local Scottish pastor, has a good article at CT. His conclusion:
“Let’s not cry wolf until the wolf is actually at the door. And in future is it too much to ask that self-appointed evangelists and ‘ministries’ might actually have the humility and Christian courtesy to liaise with local Christian churches before they minister in our name to our people? Or are we simply to be those who are left to pick up the pieces and deal with the consequences of the inevitable train-wreck?”
http://www.christiantoday.com/article/crying.wolf.is.free.speech.being.suppressed.in.the.uk/35363.htm
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That is such an excellent article. Thanks much for posting it, Dave. I completely agree. Miano will disregard the whole thing, though, because he claims he did not use any amplification.
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Thanks Dave. More from that article:
“If we seek to be faithful to Jesus Christ then we are to obey his words to be as wise as serpents and as harmless as doves. That means in a culture where homosexuality is seen as a ‘shibboleth’ issue and ‘homophobia’ is the sin against the Holy State, then you cannot stand on a street corner and shout out a sentence which includes homosexuality and sin in the same phrase, without expecting some kind of violent reaction. Did the Apostle Paul stand on the streets of Rome and yell out ‘Caesar is not Lord’?! Did he parade the streets with banners declaring ‘Down with the antichrist Emperor’?!
Being put in jail in Scotland for ‘preaching the Gospel’ will play well with the supporters back home and Christians in the UK who are desperate to jump on the persecution bandwagon. But in terms of communicating the Good News to the people of my city, it is not helpful. In fact, to be honest it does the church and the gospel, harm, both in the short and the long term. In the short term it reinforces the cultural stereotypes and ignorant prejudices of those who already think we are mad and bad.”
I agree.
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That part was good, Lydia. This really struck me as it is something that I can hear CON people like him say:
I can easily see proud street evangelists saying something like this.
I’m very saddened to think that Miano, in his zeal for “his story” created such a ruckus in Scotland and around the world. Compare the heart of the message of Robertson who has spent 22 long years working hard for Christ in his beloved country of Scotland and all of the words coming from Miano via social media/interviews. Which one says “Christ?” And which one says “me?”
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Excellent job Julie Anne, well done.
I think it’s important to look at the charges against Miano,
“(001) On 8th January 2014 at Murraygate, Dundee you ANTHONY MIANO did behave in a threatening or abusive manner which was likely to cause a reasonable person to suffer fear or alarm in that you did repeatedly shout and utter homophobic remarks;
CONTRARY to Section 38(1) of the Criminal Justice and Licensing (Scotland) Act 2010 and it will be proved in terms of Section 2 of the Offences (Aggravation by Prejudice) (Scotland) Act 2009 that the aforesaid offence was aggravated by prejudice relating to sexual orientation.”
So he deliberately draws attention to himself by shouting and pinpointing a sin that he KNOWS will get him arrested, and that is persecution?!?!
As for Williamson, I found this,
On Wednesday after addressing shoppers in the pedestrianised centre he was taken to Perth police station and issued with a warning after he refused to move on – from http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/local/perth-kinross/perth-preacher-may-face-charges-1.133762
So, Williamson refuses to move on, and Miano deliberately shouts and pinpoints a certain sin; and they label this persecution?!?! This is blatant disobedience to Christ! We are called to be meek and lowly, wise as serpents and innocent as doves. These men are in sin, blatant outright sin. They purposely seek to draw attention to ‘self’ and exalt ‘self’ over Christ. They live for the attention and their 15 minutes of fame; this is a disgrace and nothing more than prideful works of the flesh.
I want to share a comment left on my own blog concerning this fiasco….
“There can be no justifiable pity for Miano here. He continues to preach his gospel of hate, agitation, confrontation, and self-seeking ambitions. It is supposed that he thinks more money will come his way for yet another instance of “persecution” that was staged to that end. This man is an enemy of the cross of Christ, an evil worker, whose god is his own belly and should not be regarded as a “brother in Christ” for he speaks against the Savior at every opportunity.
Preaching the Gospel and being persecuted for doing so is one thing. But I have yet to find an example of real Gospel preaching coming from this man’s mouth. For those who would defend him know that you are complicit with the evil he projects, and are just as much an enemy of the cross of Jesus Christ as is Miano. Take care that you do not insult the Spirit of Grace by saying this man is doing God’s work, for he is not. ”
What’s even more shameful is that Miano is embraced by men like Phil Johnson, Paul Washer, Steve Lawson, and Chuck O’neal. I suppose birds of a feather do flock together don’t they? This is a PRIME example why we should NOT follow mortal men, celebrity pastors, etc. Miano does NOT have a ministry empowered by Christ, he has a scam going that enables him to plaster his mug all over the internet and the news, and he has a way to scam people out of money so he can ‘jet-set’ around the globe and pretend to be something he isn’t…important.
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I hope Miano repents of his sin, and comes to faith in Christ, receiving the true Gospel. He, obviously, does not know what the Gospel is. He keeps claiming to having been persecuted for the Gospel; yet what we hear from him is not the Gospel, but “homosexuality is sin.” Well “Homosexuality is an abomination” is not the Gospel. (Why do we have to keep reminding some Calvinists what the Gospel actually is?) Evidently, he doesn’t know the true Gospel.
I was telling my dad about your post, and he quoted Luke 6:22: “Blessed are you when people hate you, and when they exclude you, revile you, and defame you on account of the Son of Man.” (NRSV) Dad said that Miano is being reviled for his own ignorance, and not for the sake of Christ. When Miano repents, preaches the true Gospel and then is genuinely persecuted, we’ll come to his aid — and not until then. (I have a great dad.) Excellent post: every word of it.
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Glad you liked the article. Another by Robertson last fall discusses the arrest of Williamson. http://theweeflea.wordpress.com/2013/10/04/persecuting-preachers-in-perth/
Notice who a couple of the commenters are.
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If you want to read a good biography on a street preacher from Scotland, read Robert Flockhart – http://www.amazon.com/Autobiography-Robert-Flockhart-Street-Preacher/dp/0801037131
This man was a true street preacher! Here is a very brief snippet…
“There I stationed myself on a wall by the wayside. Many of those who resorted thither for amusement, as well as for the purpose of drying and bleaching clothes, assembled to hear me, and the Lord gave me great liberty in declaring His word to perishing sinners. The work was the Lord’s, and He strengthened me to perform it. The late Dr. Simpson, of the Tron Church, was the only minister at that time who encouraged me in my labours. He came forward before the multitudes that stood around me, and shook me by the hand, at the same time wishing me “God speed !” He approved of the doctrines which I taught. Shortly afterwards he came to hear me, and brought Mrs. Simpson along with him. At the conclusion of the service, the little girl that accompanied them came up and presented me with some money, which I returned, saying I did not preach for money — I came not to seek theirs, but them. ”
This was told by a friend of Robert’s…
“On no point, perhaps, did I hear him speak oftener than on the sinfulness of ” restraining prayer,” — the weight of guilt lying in these days on the churches of Christ, and on individual Christians, for spending in idle visits, frivolous talk, and unprofitable reading, time that might be redeemed for prayer. One evening (and I believe it was one of the last on which he was able to take his accustomed place on the street) I happened to call upon him about an hour before his usual preaching hour. On reaching his door I found the room dark ; but remaining quite still, I could overhear him, in a deep under-tone, ” as a man talketh with his friend,” telling out to the Lord his griefs and fears, his designs and expectations, in regard to the work he was going to — ” Lord, dinna forsake Edinburgh ! dinna forsake Edinburgh ! Why should our preaching here be so powerless ? Consciences are not pricked, hearts are not broken, souls are not saved. The enemy is come in as a flood. Oh, pluck thy right hand out of thy bosom ! Lord, dinna forsake Edinburgh ! ” It was real pleading, real wrestling, ” crying out of the depths.”
Here is an example of a heart sold out to and for Christ, a heart that breaks over the lost souls all around it. THIS is what a true man of God looks like…..his Master.
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Amazing Dave A A…they ALL have ‘each other’s back’ don’t they? J.D. Hall is a very rude, arrogant man; again, these birds of a feather all flock together. They verbally attack anybody who dares to disagree with them, they have their own ‘brand’ of Christianity that gives them some magical kind of authority over the rest of us. If you disagree, you aren’t saved! Amazing how they know this! God have mercy on them, they are all deceivers and do NOT represent the Christ of the Bible. They seek power, money, control; this is a mighty machine growing and picking up steam and Miano is trying to get on board, if he isn’t already. He does have some pretty ‘heavy hitters’ backing him. It’s all works of the flesh and will very soon be brought to nothing.
They all have the same tactic…launching verbal attacks, name-calling, insulting, and belittling. These are all very arrogant men who do NOT know the Christ of the Bible. May God shut the mouths of these deceivers.
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Because I’m a huge First Amendment advocate, my first response was, “WHERE? What jurisdiction here in the USA has this on their books?” (Even if I find what Miano preaches to be obnoxious.) Come to find out, as we know, that this is in Scotland, which is, obviously (at least right now), part of the United Kingdom.
I’m actually surprised he was let back into the UK after the last time he was arrested. It wouldn’t surprise me if Her Majesty’s Government put Miano on a list of undesirable aliens (where he’d join the likes of the Westboro Baptist Church) after this latest stunt. Just because the US and the UK have a good relationship doesn’t mean they can’t keep out people deemed undesirable, and Miano may have hit that point.
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http://5ptsalt.com/2014/01/13/tony-miano-improve-results-of-evangelistic-services-by-getting-arrested/
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More like PUBLICITY STUNT.
With a special bonus of “Teh Fag Card” played off the bottom of the deck.
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“Another by Robertson last fall discusses the arrest of Williamson. http://theweeflea.wordpress.com/2013/10/04/persecuting-preachers-in-perth/
Notice who a couple of the commenters are.”
Dave AA-
Great article.
Very interesting comments starting on Oct. 5 at 12:13 am.
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I see this as a brilliant publicity stunt by an ego driven extremist. He will no doubt use it to raise a boat load of cash from naive Christians that don’t research this incident or his past incidents.
The first amendment isn’t portable when you leave the country. If tough guy Tony is really so hard up for publicity ( and the opportunity to show what a tough guy he is) maybe he should just go to Pakistan and publicly declare Mohammed a child molester,an adulterer and Allah a false god. Now that would be a youtube video worth watching.
Yelling at women outside an abortion clinic and harassing gay folks that need Christ may make for cheap publicity , but it’s totally antithetical to the true propagation of the gospel. Where did Christ harass people ? He just preached and performed Miracles. Now if Tony would just do something that is not publicity driven, that would be a miracle.
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Oh for Pete’s sake, he has the Calgary Stampede pencilled in as tentative this year.
He’s as welcome as H1N1. Bet he is clueless about some of the outstanding churches in Calgary, as well as outreach groups. Check that, he doesn’t care, since it is about him.
Bet you a Tim Horton’s donut he’ll look up a guy named Artur Pawlowski. He is well known as an obsessed street preacher who likes jumping into Stampede festivities. http://tinyurl.com/lqzuxps
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Randy
I have wondered the same. Jesus seemed to always have some sort of following because of his powered being displayed — usually in the form of healing someone or raising the dead. He didn’t stand on the corners and yell at people who were going by trying to ignore him. He also interacted with men AND women on a personal basis. He didn’t treat women like they were lesser human beings.
Tony doesn’t seem to have a clue about anything but Tony.
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The nit-picking, petty criticism here of Tony applies equally to the apostle Paul. Paul deliberately walked into a trap he clearly saw coming, as an act of political activism that attracted publicity, and changed him from church planter to lifelong political prisoner. This was God’s will for Paul, and it advanced the gospel immensely in the long run. See Acts 21:10-12.
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… a prophet named Agabus came down from Judea. Coming over to us, he took Paul’s belt, tied his own hands and feet with it and said, “The Holy Spirit says, ‘In this way the Jewish leaders in Jerusalem will bind the owner of this belt and will hand him over to the Gentiles.’”
When we heard this, we and the people there pleaded with Paul not to go up to Jerusalem. Then Paul answered, “Why are you weeping and breaking my heart? I am ready not only to be bound, but also to die in Jerusalem for the name of the Lord Jesus.” When he would not be dissuaded, we gave up and said, “The Lord’s will be done.”
After this, we started on our way up to Jerusalem.
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I will show you a biblical precedent for what is unfolding here in the UK, under our very noses, which Tony Miano and others are exposing, as a side-effect of their thoroughly conventional public evangelism. Our ruling class, like that in the USA, was once a pioneer of a glorious secular ethos known as “liberal democracy”. Proclaiming such freedom for the masses was a remarkable repentence, after centuries of subjugation of the common people. (For example, John Bunyan, author of Pilgrim’s Progress, was himself imprisoned for preaching in the open air.) Today’s ruling class in Britain is not content to leave in place the freedom it once granted to the common people. As a British saint, THAT is what concerns ME about this story, and I am offended at the callous indifference of some Americans to our plight here.
The biblical precedent of this latest twist and turn of our nation’s history is in Jeremiah 34:8-16.
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The word came to Jeremiah from the Lord after King Zedekiah had made a covenant with all the people in Jerusalem to proclaim freedom for the slaves. Everyone was to free their Hebrew slaves, both male and female; no one was to hold a fellow Hebrew in bondage. So all the officials and people who entered into this covenant agreed that they would free their male and female slaves and no longer hold them in bondage. They agreed, and set them free. But afterward they changed their minds and took back the slaves they had freed and enslaved them again.
Then the word of the Lord came to Jeremiah: “This is what the Lord, the God of Israel, says: I made a covenant with your ancestors … Recently you repented and did what is right in my sight: Each of you proclaimed freedom to your own people. You even made a covenant before me in the house that bears my Name. But now you have turned around and profaned my name; each of you has taken back the male and female slaves you had set free … You have forced them to become your slaves again.
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John Allman,
Your worldview is troubling, I think. Miano, again, was not arrested for preaching the Gospel, not unless the Gospel has radically changed from its first-century biblical motif. Had Miano, or any other individual, preached the true Gospel in the open air, they would not have been arrested. He was not preaching Jesus and salvation but sexual ethics — sexual ethics is not the Gospel.
Nor can you force John Bunyan’s seventeenth-century context into our own by way of example. That’s just insulting and ignorant. The current state of affairs in the UK is not contextually relevant to Bunyan’s era and his open-air preaching. Mind you, Bunyan was preaching the Gospel, not Miano’s sexual ethics. The same can be said of the apostle Paul. He preached the Gospel, not sexual ethics.
But then you stretch all the way back to Jeremiah’s era and force his Israeli context to that of modern UK and the US. What on earth? Has God given Miano or anyone else a mandate for open-air preaching on sexual ethics? If he had stuck with preaching the Gospel, then we would have spoken up in his defense. That you have turned this situation on its head says way more about you than it does even Miano.
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William – You raise a really good point. Both times he was arrested, in Wimbledon and Dundee, he was focusing on “sexual ethics” as you say. He must be following Hollywood’s motto of “Sex Sells.”
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“The nit-picking, petty criticism here of Tony applies equally to the apostle Paul.”
Miano stated he did not deliberately attempt to stir up trouble, incite a reaction from the police, push the limits or test the authorities to see how far he could go before getting arrested. Did you watch the youtube?
Comparisons to Paul seem to be very popular. Miano did that very thing himself in his latest youtube when he compared himself to first Luther, then the apostle Paul and last but not least, Jesus …. all while saying…now…now…I am certainly no Luther, Paul or Jesus so please don’t think that…they are just my examples. Of course, he really is comparing himself to them.
In the almost 40 minute docudrama of himself talking about himself and his arrest, he stated something about “retractors” (which I assume means detractors). He made the point of saying how he would given them no quarter (?), pay them no attention nor respond to their comments.
I just counted seven tweets by him this morning doing that very thing. Responding to a re/detractor. I thought he wasn’t going to do that? He even insulted the re/detractor:
“Tony Miano @TonyMiano
No less than 11 Scottish denominations r publicly supporting me. Why would I worry about a flea?
4:37 AM – 14 Jan 14 from Highland, Highland”
“Tony Miano @TonyMiano
When worse persecution hits Scotland, real Christians can count on the Flee to side w/the enemy.
4:38 AM – 14 Jan 14”
I cannot help but notice Miano insults frequently.
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To John Allman:
Paul may have seen the trouble coming, but he didn’t go out of his way to make trouble for himself. In fact, when he arrived in Jerusalem, he followed the advice of the other apostles there, and did all he could to defuse tensions with the Jewish leaders there. It didn’t work out, but at least he didn’t go to Jerusalem to pick a fight.
I really don’t see how you can compare Tony Miano’s case to Paul’s. From where I sit, Miano seems to thrive on controversy and making trouble. And, as Julie Anne has pointed out, I think he has an unhealthy interest in seeing his face on the Internet and his name in print. He even recorded himself being interviewed on Fox News, and then posted it online! Sheesh…
In fact, I can’t think of any behaviour of Miano’s that even remotely resembles St. Paul. His approval of an abusive jerk like Chuck O’Neal… his chauvinistic and insulting treatment of Julie Anne (and just about anyone who disagrees with him)… his bullying tactics towards total strangers outside abortion clinics… his begging for handouts for his family, instead of working to feed them himself… They all strike me as being very un-Christlike. Or is that just more “nit-picking, petty criticism” on my part?
I have no idea what kind of plight Christians are suffering in Britain. But I also have no idea what Tony’s grandstanding could possibly accomplish to alleviate it. I can’t see why you’d want him as an ambassador for Christ in your country. I sure wouldn’t want him as one in mine.
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Oh, Diane, you made me do it. I checked out his Twitter feed and he had 4 tweets in a row about persecution. Bring me my dang violin NOW.
https://twitter.com/DefendTheSheep/status/423125231889162241
I also tweeted this and tagged him. Maybe he can get a grip of what real persecution looks like:
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Wasn’t that the craziest thing ever? Who videotapes themselves watching tv and then posts it for others to see?
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Who videotapes themselves watching tv and then posts it for others to see?
A narcissist.
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Great summary Julie Anne.
“I, the persecuted street evangelist, was in prison, and you came to visit me,” JAS translation. LOL!!
Truth is that Miano has classic narcissistic personality disorder. From Psychology Today: “Individuals with narcissistic personality disorder generally believe that the world revolves around them. This condition is characterized by a lack of ability to empathize with others and a desire to keep the focus on themselves at all times.”
But…all in the name of Christ! If you don’t agree, you’re going to hell! Repent!
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I have the chorus from Cell Block Tango (Chicago) stuck in my head:
He had it coming
He had it coming
He only had himself to blame
If you’d had been there
If you’d had seen it
I betcha you would have done the same!
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The faithful at BGBC have seen their hard earned money go toward paying off a lawsuit that their pastor initiated and now toward a man who not only is a law breaker, but one who seems to welcome breaking the law.
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IMO, those who want to evangelize have to consider the audience. Who needs to be evangelized? The unbelievers, not the believers.
So, you need to get the unbelievers to see they need Jesus. Sexual immorality is not a good place to start, as that is mostly the one kind of sin of which the average unbeliever can say: “I harm nobody, the church is wrong about sex (homosexual acts/ sex out of wedlock/ whatever).”
If you want to convert, you’d want to talk about those things of which God is already starting to show them is wrong: Perhaps the bit of time they steal from an employer, the way they lie to make themselves look good and someone else look bad by comparison, etc. That way, you may get the listener to agree (s)he is a sinner and needs Jesus.
Homosexuality? Bring them to God and let Him work on convincing them. The place Tony started is not where I think God’s wisdom would lead an evangelist to start.
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This is excellent, Retha. Miano’s abrasiveness incites anger. Unfortunately, that doesn’t matter because he and those in his camp will say that the Word of God won’t return void. They think as long as they are preaching God’s word authoritatively (yelling), they are doing it the Biblical way.
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Retha,
Homosexuality? Bring them to God and let Him work on convincing them.
Exactly! As a believer, who is attracted to his own gender nonetheless, I came to Christ not by messages of how sinful my “homosexual behavior” was but by the mere fact that I had offended a holy God. People like Miano tend to think that homosexual sex is the totality of the homosexual’s sinful context. That is not only tragic but also unbiblical.
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“I see this as a brilliant publicity stunt by an ego driven extremist. He will no doubt use it to raise a boat load of cash from naive Christians that don’t research this incident or his past incidents.
The first amendment isn’t portable when you leave the country. If tough guy Tony is really so hard up for publicity ( and the opportunity to show what a tough guy he is) maybe he should just go to Pakistan and publicly declare Mohammed a child molester,an adulterer and Allah a false god. Now that would be a youtube video worth watching.” Randy
“Tony doesn’t seem to have a clue about anything but Tony.” Bridget
Sorry to piggy-back off what Randy & Bridget said, but that seems to be what it boils down to, IMO.
Who needs to hear the gospel of Jesus more than the people of North Korea, for instance? Since Tony is the self-proclaimed & willing to be persecuted one, does his itinerary reflect the danger? How dangerous was England (to you as a Christian) the last time you were there? Too dangerous to go there yourself, so you’d rather finance Tony’s trip to England?
Let’s get real, folks. This is a how-to on traveling the world on someone else’s dime. Yet more fleecing of hard-earned cash with a little “persecution” & “gospel” thrown in for good measure. It seems in Tony’s mind tweets, videos, etc. are 100% necessary to update donors on how their hard-earned money is justifiably spent for his travels & trips. I expect the updates/communications about his trips to continue, since they are the other half of the transaction for the money he rakes in. He gets trips, you paid to get to hear about it. Is that how the gospel to England & Scotland works?
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“Since Tony is the self-proclaimed & willing to be persecuted one, does his itinerary reflect the danger?”
Well, “willing to be persecuted” has its limits. One night in jail is a can do. Being actually charged, and having the possibility of a longer stint in jail if arrested again, required him to become “mindful of my circumstances” as he stated in his video, and exercising due caution for the rest of his time there.
IOW…no more willing to be persecuted in Scotland, since he said another arrest would likely get him extended jail time and a you may not return home to America to await your trial card. That would be hard for him and his fam. Sorry, God. No can do.
I think his” gospel” may have changed during his remaining days in Scotland….think today is his last day there.
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“Well, “willing to be persecuted” has its limits. One night in jail is a can do. Being actually charged, and having the possibility of a longer stint in jail if arrested again, required him to become “mindful of my circumstances” as he stated in his video, and exercising due caution for the rest of his time there.
IOW…no more willing to be persecuted in Scotland, since he said another arrest would likely get him extended jail time and a you may not return home to America to await your trial card. That would be hard for him and his fam. Sorry, God. No can do.”
A far cry from missionaries & ordinary people (like Corrie Ten Boom’s sister) who have given their lives through the centuries.
It reminds me of reality tv celeb drama played out as real life for $$$. I fear for Tony. May God have mercy.
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I really couldn’t care less about Tony Miano. Perhaps he is the obnoxious twerp (or “straw man”) many here are saying he is. So what? What Police Scotland did to this man, any police force in the UK can do to anybody, for saying anything at all, anywhere. Tony’s freedom is mine. If he didn’t have freedom of speech on this occasion, then nobody in the UK has freedom of speech on any occasion.
The freedom of expression Tony exercised before his arrest is exactly the same freedom of expression that others exercise on Gay Pride Parades, albeit expressing different ideas, different *content*. There is far more at stake in this (admittedly mild) persecution of Tony than irrelevancies such as whether Tony is polite to his critics when using Twitter, and other such irrelevancies.
I am British. I want back the freedom that the arrest of Tony demonstrates that we have *all* lost, throughout the UK. I disagree with the government of the day about all sorts of issues, and I was born with the right to say so free of criminal sanctions inflicted by the courts, or extra-judicial punishment by police officers such as 28 hours detention in a police cell. I shall die having lost that right. That is what I learn from this affair. That is something I care about. I do not care whether Tony Miano is polite to the same extent. He can be a complete and utter pig as far as I am concerned. I want him to be free when he is in my country, because I want everybody to be free when they bare in my country.
Unless we defend the freedoms even of those whom we dislike, we shall lose our freedoms, deservedly.
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John Allman: if this is so very important to you, then why don’t you challenge the law rather than Tony? About the worst that could happen to Tony is that he’s tossed out of the country and not permitted to return. For a citizen, the consequences can be somewhat more catastrophic – from time at the station, to spending time in court or jail, fines, loss of job, loss of reputation, etc. How do I know this? There’s absolutely nothing like discovering your entire neighborhood has been plastered with flyers bearing your picture and the words RELIGIOUS BIGOT. Back in the day I used to picket the cult of Scientology, so I do know what it means to put my money where my mouth is.
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I have been addressing the fleecing of the flock, true missions, & religious persecution.
Reminder, speaking to the public about sex in a public place isn’t exclusive nor does it define Christians. There are atheists & persons of other religions that believe the same as what Tony was saying about sex.
Freedom of speech is a different matter. I hold dear the laws which protect freedom of speech in my country. However, I understand laws in other countries are less supportive. That is a shame. I don’t claim to know off the top of my head what UK’s laws are on this matter. However, I do know as guest visiting another country I follow the law or run the risk of arrest while I’m there.
John Allman, To be clear, are you saying Tony’s arrest violates current UK law?
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John,
If Miano had framed his alleged “persecution” in terms of free speech, I could get on board with what you’re saying. He didn’t — he whines about being “persecuted” for preaching the Gospel, which is untrue, since he wasn’t preaching the Gospel.
I do, however, empathize with your overall complaint: people should be able to voice their opinion (their interpretation of certain biblical passages) that homosexual sex is a sin — that God will send people to hell for it — without being persecuted, jailed, fined, etc., for those expressions. But what about the tone of those expressions? What about the effect that negative tones inherent in some of those expressions have on those against whom he is yelling (I mean preaching)?
Street preachers like Miano convey a tone in their messages that is aggressive, intentionally offensive, and end up pissing people off instead of ornating the gospel of Christ (Titus 2:10) in such a manner as to inspire them toward faith and repentance. Meanwhile, when they meet opposition, they deceive themselves into thinking that they’re being persecuted for the sake of righteousness, and consider all opposition — even from other believers — as an honor and a trophy. Sad.
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The Apostle Paul was ready to acknowledge that not all gospel preaching came from a good motive:
“It is true that some preach Christ out of envy and rivalry, but others out of goodwill…The former preach Christ out of selfish ambition, not sincerely, ” 1 Cor 1:15-17
Coming from the UK myself, I wonder what on Earth anyone is doing visiting us from a foreign country to preach on our streets! In our culture and in this age, it is probably the least effective form of evangelism. Even without the harsh overtones from Tony it is almost guaranteed to turn people away from the Truth.
Has Tony not done his research on what works best here? Or does he not care because his interest is not the salvation of souls, but his own selfish ambition–to be the boldest, most strident, most applauded, most notorious, most spoken of Christian ‘heavyweight’?
Someone pointed out that he would not dare try this in a country such as Iran. I suspect, with his background in law, he is well aware that the consequences for preaching in such a way in the UK are quite bearable, a very quick overnight spell in a cell. But it certainly looks good and gives him the credentials he wants as a persecuted saint.
I would be tempted to write that, with Paul, we should in good grace be thankful that the gospel is being preached, whatever the motive.
Except I don’t think this is the gospel.
Jesus’ message is not one, primarily, of judgement but of invitation:
“Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Matt 11:28
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Chris,
EXCELLENT.
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“Coming from the UK myself, I wonder what on Earth anyone is doing visiting us from a foreign country to preach on our streets! In our culture and in this age, it is probably the least effective form of evangelism. Even without the harsh overtones from Tony it is almost guaranteed to turn people away from the Truth. ”
Oh Chris, I so agree and am so embarrassed about this. Yes, it will turn off more people than anything else. With Tony’s track record, it is easy to see he is a narcissist and seeking attention. I am tempted to write the local Dundee paper and apologize on behalf of some of us American believers. I wish they were taking comments on the page where the arrest was reported but they aren’t.
I have close connections in the Lancashire area and they simply lump guys like Tony into the JW and Mormon categories, whack jobs who knock on doors. they would never take them seriously and they are not believers. That is the real shame.
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“Unless we defend the freedoms even of those whom we dislike, we shall lose our freedoms, deservedly.”
I don’t think it will help to have a loud mouthed “ugly American” as your test case. :o)
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This is NOT about losing any ‘free speech’ as this link clearly states = http://www.christiantoday.com/article/crying.wolf.is.free.speech.being.suppressed.in.the.uk/35363.htm
This is about a deliberate act of rebellion, wording your speech in such a way as to offend and cause attention to be drawn to ‘self’, which led to his arrest. He KNEW NOT to use homosexual/homosexuality and yet, he did. The Gospel is NOT centered on homosexuality, Christ died for the ungodly – the adulterer, the idolator, the liar, the thief, the murderer, etc. The Gospel does NOT include us purposely pinpointing any sexual sin, for sexual immorality encompasses ALL sexual sin outside the marriage of a man and woman; adultery takes care of sexual sin within the marriage. This deliberate act of rebellion against the law is SIN, SIN on Miano’s part for deliberately disobeying the law he KNEW beforehand. This is not persecution at all…shame on those who call it such. Christianity in America is so superficial, many do NOT even know what persecution is, or how to spot a deceiver when you see one. Anybody that continually draws attention to themselves as Miano does only seeks to exalt ‘self’. Miano’s actions are of the flesh, and if you dare confront him, or Chris H., or Richard Story, or the numerous other members of his fan club, you will be insulted, belittled, and declared an unregenerate. Yes, this is just how our Lord operated isn’t it? NOT!
Diane pointed out something that is most excellent, how much ‘persecution’ Miano is willing to endure. That in and of itself tells you this man purposely brought on his arrest so he could be all over the media, and he could get bible illiterate people to give him their cash. Miano claims Joel Taylor of 5ptsalt may not be saved, and we are to believe Miano is saved? Here is a man who continually exalts himself, plasters videos of himself all over the internet, purposely gets arrested {twice}, quits his job, does not work, seeks donations while he spends his day shopping for bubble wrap, or eating chinese with one of his daughters {see his keek videos}, and people are supposed to support this? Only in America would this be classified as a ‘Christian ministry’. Everything Miano exhibits reeks of being ‘of the flesh’ and not of God. Miano is part of the problem with Christianity in this nation, and not part of the solution. He needs to heed Peter’s words, ” For what credit is there if, -when you sin and are harshly treated-, you endure it with patience? But if when you do what is right and suffer for it you patiently endure it, this finds favor with God. ” 1 Peter 2:20
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Tony Miano, you need to read this…
“Once again, the worst persecutor of Christians is North Korea, where an estimated 50,000 to 70,000 followers of Jesus are suffering in prison camps for “crimes” such as owning a Bible, going to church, or sharing their faith. In November 2013, it was reported that 80 prisoners were publicly executed, many for possessing Bibles. Last year, North Korea sentenced an American missionary, Kenneth Bae to 15 years of hard labor in a prison camp. The U.S. State Department has lobbied unsuccessfully for his release.” – – – from this article.
Tony Miano, IF you truly want to reach the lost, go to North Korea, go to Iran, go to Irag, go to places like these where the Gospel is scarce. The UK is FILLED with preachers, Iran is not. Obviously, Mr. Miano goes where HE determines, not God. For if he were truly an evangelist, he would seek to go where the Gospel is seldom preached. However, he does NOT have a heart for the lost, nor does he desire to bring God glory.He does desire to continually film his every move and let the world know it, like anybody cares. He wants so-o bad to be a ‘celebrity preacher’; like America doesn’t have enough already.
Instead, he goes to ‘safe places’, sets himself up to be arrested, then claims he is being persecuted…what an insult to our brothers and sisters in Christ who are in prison camps!What an insult to those who’ve lost their lives because of their allegiance to Christ! Enough of this phony drama; may God bring Miano and all who support his fleshly ways to repentance.
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1 Corinthians 2:1-2 And I, when I came to you, brothers, did not come proclaiming to you the testimony of God with lofty speech or wisdom. For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ and him crucified.
This verse came to mind while pondering Tony’s behavior on his trip to Scotland.
Ironically, Cals like Tony love this verse as one of their 5 Solas:
Christ alone…
Jesus + nothing = everything
So when “preaching” or “witnessing” this verse is irrelevant to Tony, IMO. Of course he rails against homosexuality. Make sense?
My view of this verse is much different from Tony’s but a simple one:
“proclaiming the testimony of God” = Jesus Christ crucified as Lord & Savior to rise again
I don’t think Tony would agree with my interpretation nor would he understand how proclaiming the testimony of God in this verse has to do with what he would street-preach. Interpretation informs behavior/action.
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I adhere to the doctrines of grace, and I can say that is NOT why Miano does what he does. He is filled with sin, the sin of pride. That’s what motivates Tony…it isn’t doctrine, it’s pride.
I certainly pray this thread does NOT go off on a tangent against Calvin. We are to follow Christ, NOT mortal men. There is fault in every one of us, which is what makes grace and mercy so very precious. Calvin is NOT my ‘god’, Christ is. This is why I believe it is so dangerous to label ourselves, look what it leads to.
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62 comments? Wow. Outstanding. Tony must be popular here, he’s certainly not on my blog, lol.
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1 Corinthians 2:1-2 And I, when I came to you, brothers, did not come proclaiming to you the testimony of God with lofty speech or wisdom. For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ and him crucified.
I said, “My view of this verse is much different from Tony’s but a simple one:
“proclaiming the testimony of God” = Jesus Christ crucified as Lord & Savior to rise again
I don’t think Tony would agree with my interpretation nor would he understand how proclaiming the testimony of God in this verse has to do with what he would street-preach. Interpretation informs behavior/action.”
Sorry, lyn. I was referring to how I’ve heard this verse taught in a reformed church as well as at a Desiring God conference, if my mind serves me correctly….
I’d be delighted if Tony & I have the same interpretation of this verse & would gladly stand corrected if that’s the case. But I’m not banking on it.
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I understand A mom, thank you for clarifying.
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Joel said:
Joel,
Welcome! Many times “popular” is a positive word. I’m not so sure in this case. Your posts on Miano are excellent. I look forward to being named with you on Miano’s tweets. haha! I’ll be watching and getting screenshots 🙂
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Lyn, I think I shall take a screenshot of your 4:58 pm comment and tweet it tagging Tony.
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Go for it Julie Anne
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I don’t know Tony from a bar of soap so I won’t comment on him however I do know Josh Williamson and I would like to say this about him based on personal experience rather than reading tweets, seeing him from afar, etc. Josh is a man who’s passion in life is to preach Christ and Him crucified, he loves his wife and son and is passionate about the care of his flock, sure he might rub people up the wrong way but I know the times I haven’t appreciated what he was saying was because I was being convicted of sin.
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So, when Josh Williamson DELIBERATELY disobeys a command by police to move on, it’s okay because he’s ‘passionate’? I think not – http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/local/perth-kinross/perth-preacher-may-face-charges-1.133762
How long will folks keep defending rebellious acts? How long will we hold on to our ‘celebrity pastor’ mentality and stand behind men who need to be called to repentance for their deliberate words and actions? Isn’t this man in his twenties? It brings to mind 1 Timothy chapter 3:6 – ‘and not a new convert, so that he will not become conceited and fall into the condemnation incurred by the devil.’
JA, you know he’ll just call me manly and declare me unsaved.
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I’m waiting, lyn. Screenshots are awesome. They speak for themselves.
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Lyn, my point was not to glorify or even to defend Josh at all costs… He’s not a celebrity, he’s a brother, somebody I have broken bread with. I know his conversion story, his love for our saviour, he is a changed man from the man he was. My point is this, Josh is a sinner, as am I, he knows he is a sinner in need of the loving grace of Christ. He can stand with Paul and say ‘I, the chief of sinners” he knows how much he has been forgiven. Josh was saved because a pastor who had never preached a “hellfire and brimstone” sermon before did on the day he agreed to go to church on the undertaking that a relative wouldn’t ask him to do so again, he was convicted and humbled before God.
Josh has a number of things that he needs to work on, being more diplomatic is one of them, he is not a wolf and I pray that God will show him and convict him of those things in His perfect time.
In regards to your quote from Timothy, a) Josh is not a new convert, he has graduated from seminary and has been a pastor for a number of years and b) you’re quoting from the book named after Timothy, the very young fellow who was given the monumental task of properly establishing churches. “Don’t let anyone look down on you because you are young, but set an example for the believers in faith and life” I hope and pray that Josh has older men exhorting him as Paul did to Timothy.
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Up North,
I love how we think men who’ve been to seminary are qualified to preach; I believe it is a calling by God. The disciples were unlearned and yet, they turned the world upside down.
I pray Josh would not pattern himself after Tony Miano, who is obnoxious, arrogant, and rude. I have watched Miano’s videos as he badgered the lost in front of abortion clinics, and I was appalled. Naturally, he has now removed them. If Josh is of God, he needs to take Miano aside and tell him of his fleshly ways. To defend Miano speaks volumes about Josh.
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“Josh is a sinner, as am I, he knows he is a sinner in need of the loving grace of Christ. He can stand with Paul and say ‘I, the chief of sinners” he knows how much he has been forgiven.”
Well, Up North kind of clued us in. If Josh & Tony are street-preaching the gospel, don’t they realize they’ve been redeemed & are no longer looked upon by God as a sinner? If they are Christians, why is God’s grace not yet sufficient for them? Isn’t grace God’s gift upon salvation? I just don’t get this “I am the worst of the worst” teaching. I think it breeds the worst of the worst behavior (this case in point). I would never teach children they are the worst of the worst. How the heck does this derailed train of thought make sense?
“I pray that God will show him and convict him of those things in His perfect time.”
So it’s God’s fault that Josh and Tony are behaving this way? We are to know God is waiting for the perfect time, somewhere in the future, to let them know? In the meantime, it’s God’s perfect plan they behave this way? This behavior was meant to be? Again, I just don’t get the absolution of personal responsibility…. Is this what we teach our kids? Your bad behavior will continue until God’s perfect time? Yikes!
I can’t agree with this nonsense teaching.
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All I can say is Calvinists believe in the same “born that way, can’t do any better” excuse as homosexuals, so its kinda strange they don’t get along better. And that if Calvinists were in a position to put us in jail for saying anything against them, they would. They are the same as the homosexual maffia on two counts. So you’ll have to excuse me if I don’t shed a tear for Tony. On the brighter side, when Roger Pearse covered this story on his blog, he mentioned that the law that allows for these arrests is in the process of being repealed because there was an outlandish case of a student being arrested for asking a cop on horseback “Do you know your horse is gay?” I guess outlawing childish jokes was the straw that broke the camel’s back.
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In the United States Josh and Tony can do exactly what they were arrested for in Perth and it’s protected by the 1st amendment . What people forget is there is no such thing as freedom of speach in the UK or Australia for that matter. You can get arrested for literally hurting someone’s feelings. Say anything about gays, transvestism or other assorted perverts and you may get charged with a hate crime. These clowns are welcome to do the same thing in San Francisco or other gay dominated areas with total protection of the Constitution, so why go do it in the UK ?
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Randy, he does it in the UK because he gets the media attention for being a persecuted Christian. Today I saw at least 4 tweets in which he used the word persecution. I just listened to a video about 30 minutes long inwhich he discussed persecution. He wants to wear the Persecution crown.
But you see, this is a farce. He wrote an entire blog post (after he was arrested in Wimbledon and after Williamson was arrested twice) regarding doing your homework, understanding the laws before street evangelizing in a new area. He KNEW what he was getting into because Williamson paved the way. This is all for show and more donations. It’s a great business. Where else can you see the world on someone else’s dime?
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In the U.S., we have freedom of speech under the First Amendment to the Constitution. However, there are limits that can be established by law, including reasonable time, place and manner limits. So you cannot put up a billboard just any place you choose. You cannot exercise your free speech rights by standing up in an auditorium of people there to listen to a particular speaker and shouting over him. And if a public park is not a place established as a public forum, but rather a place to listen to birds, then the volume of your speech can be limited to protect that purpose.
Limits can also be placed so that your free speech rights do not deny other people a right that they have so that they cannot exercise their right. Among those rights are the right to peaceably use their property, which is how many places limit the use of bullhorns where people reside and may be asleep.
So, one’s rights are not absolute, but must be used with consideration of the rights of others, especially in places that have not been established as a public forum. And there are always limits on content, including laws against defamation, causing a riot, etc.
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Hi Lyn,
I was not using the fact that Josh has been to sem as a validation for ministry… I’m a member of a denomination that has a habit of calling the trained rather than training the called… it’s one of my biggest bug bears. What I was trying to say is that Josh is not a new convert, he’s been a Christian for around ten years. The reference to sem was to say that he isn’t a man who was converted 6 months ago, it was not meant as a validation for ministry. I confess I did personally take exception to your comment about Josh’s age completely separately from the issue we’ve been discussing. As a young man myself I get sick and tired of hearing people say “you’re too young,” its an ad hominem fallacy, age has nothing to do with maturity,ability or capability.
A mom,
“If they are Christians, why is God’s grace not yet sufficient for them? Isn’t grace God’s gift upon salvation? I just don’t get this “I am the worst of the worst” teaching. I think it breeds the worst of the worst behavior (this case in point).”
One of my favourite saying is, “how can you know what you have been saved to, unless you know what you have been saved from.” The grace v law in Christian preaching is a tough one, often the pendulum can swing to far in either direction, we focus on the saving and love of God and neglect instruction on sanctification or we focus on the law and end up becoming Pharisaical. I have often thought on Paul’s comments in 1st Timothy regarding being the chief of sinners and I believe that in so doing he was showing great humility. I have discovered over the years, as I’m sure most have, that the general view of Christians is that we are hypocrites. I have found that when talking to people and they see the joy of a man set free of the bondage of sin and the law but a man also not afraid to admit to his weakness and sin that the shutters don’t come up anywhere near as quickly. In closing on this remark, I’m not sure what gave you the idea of the belief that grace isn’t held to be sufficient to them, again I can’t speak for Tony but I know for Josh it is, he does not believe that there is anything he can possible do to deserve his salvation, and isn’t that what is so amazing about grace? Unmerited favour.
” So it’s God’s fault that Josh and Tony are behaving this way? We are to know God is waiting for the perfect time, somewhere in the future, to let them know? In the meantime, it’s God’s perfect plan they behave this way? This behavior was meant to be? Again, I just don’t get the absolution of personal responsibility…. Is this what we teach our kids? Your bad behavior will continue until God’s perfect time? Yikes!”
I never said that, I said that I, as in me, personally, pray that God convicts Josh of the things he needs to be convicted of. That’s how sanctification works, we are new creations in Christ but this side of heaven we still face the continual pull of the flesh, pulling us away from Christ. The Holy Spirit, indwelling in all believers comforts us, convicts us and teaches us. When I say, “I pray that God will show him and convict him of those things in His perfect time.” I in no means meant or meant to imply that God is responsible for Josh’s sin, that would be heresy, I was saying that asides from the work of the Holy Spirit we cannot be convicted of our sin and made into the reflection of Christ. That is a process that continues from the day we are converted until we go to glory. Sin is not God’s doing but I do know this, He uses all things to ultimately bring glory to His name, that one day every tribe and tongue and nation may kneel in worship to him.
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“These clowns are welcome to do the same thing in San Francisco or other gay dominated areas with total protection of the Constitution, so why go do it in the UK ?”
Is it possible he wanted to keep the persecution momentum going? His friend, Josh, had just been arrested in October (twice I believe) and there was some unfavorable criticism of that whole deal. Damage control?
If Miano were to say just what he needed to say to be arrested, then people who don’t investigate things for themselves as well as they should for whatever reason might think – wow and double wow – there really is persecution in the UK for Christian OA preachers…etc. Let’s get on the bandwagon and help them ASAP.
In the You Are Being Rebuked For Thinking I Would Not Go Back To Scotland For My Trial twenty minute rebuking sermon Miano youtubed the other day, he mentioned there is a possibility the charges may be dropped, or something might happen with his case and he would not have to return to Scotland. He said he had no definite information on this, but, being a former sheriff, he said he knows how courts work and that it was a possibility.
I HOPE we don’t see a *send Tony back to Scotland for the glory of God* request for donations fund set up by Miano or his supporters until it is a certainty that he will have to go back. Wouldn’t that be something? People giving their hard earned money to this donation request only to find that the trip will be cancelled.
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“I in no means meant or meant to imply that God is responsible for Josh’s sin, that would be heresy, I was saying that asides from the work of the Holy Spirit we cannot be convicted of our sin and made into the reflection of Christ.”
Up North, The contradiction is in the same sentence. God is not responsible but apart from the Holy Spirit none can turn away from sin.
So you say it’s impossible for anyone to feel remorse & stop doing wrong unless they are Christian AND THEN first the Holy Spirit must notify them. Sorry your theology contradicts reality. I know nonChristians that know full well the difference between right & wrong. And I am certain you know some as well. There are nonChristians who may have commented on this topic on this blog who know what Tony & Josh are doing is wrong! Do they have more Holy Spirit than Christians? Please think about that a bit.
On being the worst of the worst, I disagree. It’s not an either I’m humble & worst or I’m perfect. You can be humble AND not be the worst of the worst. What’s hypocritical is when Christians consistently behave worse than nonChristians!
I do agree with you about age. Wisdom is not excluded from young people. There is usually a correlation between age maturity & wisdom, but not always. I’m sure you’ve observed old but not wise.
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Actually, Up North, I would go further to say that all capable adults absolutely know the difference between right and wrong. And each person chooses what they say & do. Which is why penalties for wrongdoing are absolutely just & right for everyone, regardless of their religious beliefs. Do you agree?
Tony & Josh made their own decisions on what to do & say knowing what the consequences would be.
Up North, you said “…asides from the work of the Holy Spirit we cannot be convicted of our sin and made into the reflection of Christ.” Maybe they decided to ignore the Holy Spirit. But what they did isn’t because the Holy Spirit wasn’t working (was the Holy Spirit on vacation?).
They 100% decided what to do and say & are responsible for their actions, for good or bad & whether we do or don’t like UK law.
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Up North,
Can you please contact me at spiritualsb@ gmail dot com?
I got an e-mail bounce back “550 Unknown user.”
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In regards to Miano, today I was asked this question: “If Jesus “did not seek to get arrested”, what was he doing in the garden of Gethsemane all night the day he was crucified? Duh!” I guess everyone just doesn’t understand.
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Miano is not Jesus, and our salvation does not depend upon his arrest!
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Miano just put up a new blog post which included primarily these quotes:
“In those degenerate times when men were arrived at the acme and height of impudence, and dared to speak treason against heaven, then they that feared the Lord spake often one to another. When others were plaintiffs these were defendants; when others spoke against God, these spoke for God . . . The more outrageous others are in sin, the more courageous we should be for truth . . .
“To profess religion when the times favour it is no great matter. Almost all will court the Gospel Queen when she is hung with jewels. But to own the ways of God when they are decried and maligned, to love a persecuted truth, this evidences a vital principle of goodness. Dead fish swim down the stream, living fish swim against it. To swim against the common stream of evil shows grace to be alive” (p. 5, 6). http://t.co/l20MnH3PR3
You can see where is motivation comes from in these quotes.
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How sad that Miano and his fan club attempt to justify a deliberate, rebellious act as persecution, how horrifying that they pull verses out of context, like our Lord wrestling in the garden, as if Miano EVEN comes CLOSE to what Christ endured. The garden of Gethsemane has NO relevance in what Miano pulled; Christ wrestled there, knowing He was about to face the wrath of God for sin. How in the world does that compare to Miano purposely pinpointing homosexuality so he could make the media circuit and get more money from his followers?! Good grief, doesn’t anybody read their bibles anymore?!? Celebrity pastors usurp God and His word, their fans follow them right into sin and defend it, thus, becoming partakers of sin themselves!!
This is a shameful act of sinful pride seeking to justify its actions. This man is a disgrace, and a stench in the nostrils of a thrice holy God who detests haughtiness.
As for his quote, it should read, ‘the more outrageous/deliberate acts Miano delves into, which are rooted in sin, the more courageous we should be in calling him out’. This is all very sick and twisted, stemming from a heart that is steeped in sin.
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Up North,
Concerning Josh, he deliberately refused an order by police to move on, as I showed you. He sinned, he did NOT suffer persecution, for his deliberate rebellious act proves such. Instead of defending him, you need to call him to repentance. He has NO business standing on street corners yelling at people, then refusing an order to move along. Be as wise as serpents and as innocent as doves, otherwise, stay home and quit bringing shame and reproach upon the holy name of God.
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Hi JA, check your inbox, I stuffed up the email address. JP
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Good point, lyn.
It’s interesting that these guys are so focused on Biblical law to point out sins in their attempt to evangelize, yet push the line when it comes to civil authority/law which is clearly ordained by God (Romans 13). They are big on “we were within our legal rights,” yet they are intentionally pushing the hot buttons, challenging authority, and consequently drawing attention to SELF, raising the PERSECUTION flag when THEY caused all of this ruckus.
Ok, seriously, who goes to a foreign country to evangelize on donor $$, spends 30 minutes sitting on the sofa of his guest recording a video of HIMself rebuking people who aired their opinion of him. He needs to take it like a man, humble himself, and let it roll off his back if comments annoy him. Good grief. He’s like a 2-yr old having a temper tantrum.
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Up North: You “stuffed up?” Love the differences in our English 🙂 I have a friend from UK who makes a habit of “correcting” my American English on my Facebook statuses. We have fun with that. Got your e-mail, thanks!
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I spoke/commented too soon–wow, that was fast.
Now he wants $upport for not only himself, but for his wife to fly to Scotland. He is also asking for monthly $upport, because some Christians do not agree with his methods and have, possibly, changed their minds about $upporting him…oops, I mean do not understand that there is a cost for following Jesus. Nice little insult…do they ever end–the insults from this professing Christian?
“Mahria and I Welcome Your Assistance
I plan to take Mahria with me when I return to Scotland. I want her by my side if I do stand trial. Needless to say, this will be an expensive return trip. Would you please consider supporting us? In addition to our day-to-day and ministry expenses, we will need to cover flight costs, which could run a few thousand dollars.
As with my last arrest in Wimbledon, sadly we anticipate losing some of our monthly support. Some Christian simply do not understand that there is a cost for following Jesus Christ. In addition to helping us cover costs for the return trip to Scotland, might you also please consider supporting us monthly?”
http://us6.campaign-archive1.com/?u=93d7436b921a7ebd3d2ddbf42&id=6fdf4b89e6
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I believe that many things labelled “evangelism” are done for one of the following reasons:
1. To satisfy people’s consciences. The thought pattern seems to be “I’m a christian, so I have to evangelise, so I’ll go and preach on the streets”. The fact that this “evangelism” is at best a complete waste of time and at worse damaging to the gospel is conveniently ignored in favor of an easy way to tick off another box on the spiritual checklist. But hey, why bother taking the time to develop deep friendships with people when you can just street preach.
2. To make people or churches feel that they are better than others. I guess Tony Miano is from a fairly fundamentalist background, and such people generally believe that they are the true remnant church and everyone else is compromised or liberal. The fact that they go out and preach on the streets and others don’t proves this.
It’s worth pointing out that the Calvinist doctrine of irrestible grace is an important theological driver behind this type of activity. Calvinists believe that those people who God has chosen to become christians (the elect) will be irrestibly drawn to respond to the gospel when they hear it. So all you have to do is go and preach the gospel (eg on the streets) and people will respond.
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You mean he’s leaving his 3 daughters at home when they could have a family vacation?
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Tony,
If by chance you read these comments, I suggest you check out this website next time you are planning your street ministry and focus on those countries that have people groups that have never heard the Gospel. Your results may be the same or even worse, but at least it will be from people that have never heard the Gospel and not from those that have heard but choose not to follow. I think it says in the Bible, Matt: 10:14 If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, to leave that house or city and shake the dust off your feet. That means DON’T GO BACK. There are over 7,000 people groups that have never heard the Gospel, so it shouldn’t be hard to find new ground.
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Well Raymond, to go where the Gospel is seldom heard MIGHT result in ACTUAL persecution, he might be arrested and NOT released…we can’t have that now can we? This is what a ‘staged’ type of Christianity looks like, which is unbiblical.
Diane posted his pleas for money, that didn’t take long did it? Why is it some would not DREAM of giving money to Benny Hinn, but they shell out money to an arrogant deceiver like Miano? He is no different than the WOF hucksters he condemns.
So, we just don’t understand there’s a ‘cost’ for following Christ? Oh really!!! Let me see… a few years back I was working in a job I’d had for over ten years. I proclaimed Christ to my boss on one Saturday morning…after that, she came after me. It took her two years, but she finally accomplished her goal…she fired me, after being with that company for 13 years. My parting words to her were ‘do unto others as you would have them do unto you’. God saw fit to remove her from her position with the company shortly after. I continue to pray for this woman, and I have no grudge against her. I did NOT post videos when this happened, I did NOT ‘blog’ about it incessantly. I did NOT seek financial support from others. God takes care of His own.
It is disgusting phony preachers like Tony Miano that should be counted as a disgrace. He brings shame and reproach on the name of our Lord with his fleshly actions. He should lose EVERY bit of support these people give, let him get a JOB and work with his hands, like he should; let him support his family instead of traveling to ‘cushy’ places to shout at people and make sure it ALL gets videotaped. Good grief, how ignorant are people? Can’t they see through this type of phoniess?
How dare he even solicit donations for himself, let alone his wife!! He purposely brought this on, and now he expects people to PAY for his return trip?! Get real.
It is past time for this man, his 15 minutes of fame are up. Get a haircut and get a real job Tony Miano; quit fleecing the flock and using the word of God for your own personal gain. May God bring this man low, may his ministry come to what it is…nothing.
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another gem from Joel Taylor – http://5ptsalt.com/2014/01/15/pastor-in-dundee-scotland-to-tony-miano-youre-not-helping-youre-harming-and-crying-wolf/
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“After the earthquake came a fire, but the LORD was not in the fire. And after the fire came a gentle whisper.” 1 Kings 19:12
It is not in noise that God usually reveals Himself in greatest power. He works silently, without noise.
Jesus was a still small voice in this world. He did not strive nor cry out; neither was His voice heard in the streets. He did not break a bruised reed, so gentle was He in His goings and in His workings. Yet that one sweet, quiet life, pouring forth its spirit of love and tenderness, wrought more than has been wrought by all the armies of conquerors since the world began!
In the same way, it is the silent things, the unconscious influences of our lives, which make the deepest and most lasting impressions–and not the things which get advertised in the papers, and are most talked about.
If we would be effective in our work, we must learn to work quietly.
The greatest preacher is the one who most deeply impresses men, in matters that affect their living and serving, inciting and inspiring them to worthy deeds and beautiful godly living. The best Christian workers are those who make the least noise. We never can do our best work if we have not learned to work quietly, for Christ glory, and not for our own exaltation.
~ J. R. Miller
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Here’s an idea…
“Most encouraging has been the response by churches in Scotland. Pastor Josh Williamson of Craigie Reformed Baptist Church has received either calls or emails of support from Christians in the following denominations:
Church of Scotland
Free Church of Scotland
Free Church of Scotland (Continuing)
Free Presbyterian Church of Scotland
Associated Presbyterian Churches
Reformed Presbyterians
Elim Pentecostals
Fellowship of Independent Evangelicals
Reformed Baptists
Brethren Churches
Non-Denominational Churches”
http://us6.campaign-archive1.com/?u=93d7436b921a7ebd3d2ddbf42&id=6fdf4b89e6
Since Pastor Josh received calls/emails from these denominations, then these church groups can all chip in about 200 dollars each (cannot imagine they would not want to do that to support their “gospel” preaching brother in his time of need) and Miano can get an immediate $2200 for tickets for he and his wife (that he insists on bringing) to Scotland – should he have to return (which is not a certainty as he stated things could change between now and April)…but send your money to him- leaving the memo line on the check blank, of course. UNREAL.
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