Tedd Tripp, Tom Chantry, Failure to Report, Mandatory Reporter, Spanking, Shepherding a Child’s Heart
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In the late 1990s, I attended a parenting seminar by Tedd Tripp. It may or may not be significant to note that the seminar was held at a Sovereign Grace Ministries church in Chesapeake, Virginia.
Shepherding a Child’s Heart
The seminar covered material from Tripp’s book, Shepherding a Child’s Heart (1995). Among my circle of friends, this book received high praises, after the Train Up a Child (1994) parenting book by Mike and Debi Pearl made its rounds. Yes, both books influenced our parenting, sadly.
At the time, we liked a lot of what Tedd Tripp had to say about parenting. Here are some of the good quotes from the book:
- All behavior is linked to attitudes of the heart. Therefore, discipline must address attitudes of the heart.
- The finest art of communication is not learning how to express your thoughts. It is learning how to draw out the thoughts of another.
- The most powerful way to keep your children from being attracted by the offers of camaraderie from the wicked is to make home an attractive place to be.
- God is concerned with the heart—the well-spring of life (Proverbs 4:23). Parents tend to focus on the externals of behavior rather than the internal overflow of the heart.
- You must regard parenting as one of your most important tasks while you have children at home. This is your calling. You must raise your children in the fear and admonition of the Lord. You cannot do so without investing yourself in a life of sensitive communication in which you help them understand life and God’s world.
Tripp’s focus on the child’s heart was an improvement from Mike and Debi Pearl’s teachings where greater emphasis was on spanking – even down to describing the tool used to implement discipline (a 1/4-inch flexible plumber’s line, intended to give a good painful sting, without leaving marks).
It wasn’t until many years later that I saw problem’s with Tripp’s teachings. While his emphasis was the child’s heart, he honed in on the sinfulness of cihldren, how they are born into sin, and spanking would remove the foolishness from a child’s heart:
- The child’s problem is not an information deficit. His problem is that he is a sinner. There are things within the heart of the sweetest little baby that, allowed to blossom and grow to fruition, will bring about eventual destruction.
- Your children’s souls are in danger of death—spiritual death. Your task is to rescue your children from death. Faithful and timely use of the rod is the means of rescue (106).
- God has ordained the rod of discipline for this condition. The spanking process drives foolishness from the heart of a child (106).
- God has commanded the use of the rod in discipline and correction of children. It is not the only thing you do, but it must be used. He has told you that there are needs within your children that require use of the rod. If you are going to rescue your children from death, if you are going to root out the folly that is bound up in their hearts, if you are going to impart wisdom, you must use the rod (108).
- I knew that failure to spank would be unfaithfulness to their souls (109).
- The use of the rod is an act of faith. God has mandated its use (109).
- The rod . . . is the parent, as God’s representative, undertaking on God’s behalf what God has called him to do. He is not on his own errand, but fulfilling God’s (109).
- When does a child need a spanking? When you have given a directive that he has heard and is within his capacity to understand and he has not obeyed without challenge, without excuse or without delay, he needs a spanking. If you fail to spank, you fail to take God’s Word seriously. You are saying you do not believe what the Bible teaches about the import of these issues. . . . If obedience is to be absolutely mandatory for him, you cannot tolerate disobedience (149).
Now, having researched people and books that influenced us over the years, I have come to similar conclusions as Anne Sokol, who wrote this review of Shepherding a Child’s Heart. If you were part of that wave of people who were reading Shepherding a Child’s Heart, I encourage you to read Anne’s review and see what you think.
If you are unfamiliar with Tripp’s teachings, I found a short YouTube video in which he discusses spanking:
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So-Called Biblical Parenting Leaders
We, as parents, seemed to follow trends that so many others did – especially in the Christian homeschool movement. Unfortunately, many of those trends ended up being more harmful than helpful, such as: Doug Phillips – Vision Forum, Mike and Debbie Pearl – Train Up a Child, Gary Ezzo – Growing Kids God’s Way). Perhaps Tedd Tripp should be added to this list, too.
Harmful Results
This brings us to the case of Tom Chantry:
Tom Chantry, who occasionally wrote with Phil Johnson at Pyromaniacs blog, is a former pastor with the Association of Reformed Baptist Churches of America (ARBCA), and has been in hot water in the past year or so:
Chantry, 47, was indicted in Yavapai County Superior Court on eight counts – five counts of child molestation and three of aggravated assault – for offenses committed in the late 1990s and early 2000s, when he worked at the Miller Valley Baptist Church. (Source)
What does Tom Chantry have to do with Tedd Tripp?
My friend and blogger, Todd Wilhelm, has been closely following this case, and it is the following information from an earlier blog post by Todd that got me interested in reporting on Tedd Tripp:
In April 2017 the ARBCA, feeling the heat from numerous bloggers (here, here, here and here), who presented credible evidence that they had covered-up the sexual abuse and physical assault of children by ARBCA pastor Thomas Chantry, published the document below. While ARBCA leadership clings to their false claim of no cover-up by the ARBCA, irrefutable evidence continues to mount which puts to flight the lies contained in their published document. (It should be noted that this document seems to have disappeared from the ARBCA website.)
You can read the document at Todd Wilhelm’s blog here, but notable quotes follow. Todd’s commentary is in green, the quoted document is indented and in italics:
“All parties agreed to the three men who would serve on the Council. Those who served in this capacity were men of integrity, elders in their respective churches, trusted in the association, and had considerable experience in the fields of law, counseling, and law enforcement.”
Who were these three men?
The three men who served on the Council were Mike McKnight, Pastor Tedd Tripp, and Pastor Richard Jensen. Yes, that Tedd Tripp, who at the time was the pastor of the Grace Fellowship Church in Hazelton, Pennsylvania.
Anyone with “considerable experience in the fields of law, counseling, and law enforcement” would know that they have a responsibility to report abuse cases to law enforcement. Evidently, this did not happen.
The document continues:
“Contrary to the recent false charges made by internet bloggers and others, from 1995 to this day there has never been a cover-up whatsoever by anyone in the Association with knowledge of these events.”
Now we’re back to Todd’s commentary:
I [Todd Wilhelm] attended an Evidentiary Hearing for the upcoming Thomas Chantry trial yesterday. One item that came out in the hearing was the fact that the ARBCA investigative three-man committee published a “sealed, confidential” report of their findings. This document was not meant for wide distribution but was intended for ARBCA leadership’s eyes only. This document stated that the spankings administered by Thomas Chantry to the victims were “punishing for the personal pleasure” of Thomas Chantry. The parents of the victims were never given this information. The prosecuting attorney, Susan Eazer said that every family stated that if they had been made aware of this information they would have reported Chantry to the Police. Instead of reporting this information to Law Enforcement, leaders of ARBCA chose to remain silent and instead attack the bloggers for “false charges.” [JA bolded]
“Everyone has been open, as far as discretion allows, and everyone with knowledge of these events has operated within the parameters of the laws of the land.”
I was recently provided with some information which proves that ARBCA leaders did not operate “within the parameters of the laws of the land.”
Cutting to the chase, Todd Wilhelm writes:
As you can read in the highlighted section of this motion filed on behalf of Thomas Chantry, the three-man panel of Mike McKnight, Pastor Tedd Tripp, and Pastor Richard Jensen were, (among others) under the law, mandatory reporters of abuse. Further, their failure to report Chantry’s abuse to Law Enforcement was a criminal act! Yet the ARBCA document claims “everyone with knowledge of these events has operated within the parameters of the laws of the land.” (Source)
Ok, that brings me back to Tedd Tripp. So, evidently Tedd Tripp failed to report abuse by then-pastor Tom Chantry. My brain has gone wild with questions about this.
- Why would this man fail to report child abuse when he knew it was abuse?
- Is it because he doesn’t fully believe it is abuse?
- Is he merely trying to protect a pastor?
- Is he thinking that if this pastor gets in legal trouble for spanking, then it will not look good for other Christians who spank children?
- Is he trying to protect a pastor who believes the same way he does about spanking: that it should be mandatory?
- Does he believe that his spiritual obligation to uphold the practice of “biblical” spanking exempts him from following the laws of the land?
- I wonder – has Tedd Tripp ever reported any cases of abuse (physical or sexual abuse) to authorities?
- What does Tedd Tripp believe about Romans 13 and obeying civil authorities?
Here’s what I think. I think Tedd Tripp is no different from the people who believe it is spiritually wrong to intervene medically when their children are sick. I think he is putting his legalistic viewpoint of spanking at a level that now leaves children (and parents/adults who follow his teachings) in harm’s way.
Another thought I had is this: remember how Neo-Calvinists defended Mark Driscoll and CJ Mahaney? Why was that? I believe it was because they didn’t want to cause harm to their doctrinal beliefs. For Mark Driscoll, it was to protect Neo-Calvinism. For CJ Mahaney, I have a hunch it was because his staunch teachings on complementarianism and he was a popular speaker at their conferences. Is that what’s happening here with Tom Chantry? Is it that Tedd Tripp et al didn’t want to report Chantry because of who he represents (friend of Phil Johnson et al) and what he represents (Calvinism, pro-spanking, etc)?
I’d be interested in reading your thoughts. Regardless of the reason, and we may never know why Tripp failed to report, but if this is how Tedd Tripp Shepherds a Child’s Heart, it is egregious! Imagine the spiritual and emotional pain these now-grown adults have experienced, knowing that Tripp apparently dismissed the abuse, and instead, defended/protected a man he knew was abusing children.
References: In addition to Todd Wilhelm’s blog, this site has also been keeping up with Tom Chantry’s criminal case.
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Spiritual Sounding Board 
The most interesting part is, Tripp says that Piper declared that if he was in, say, Sweden where spanking is illegal, and he had a child that did something spank-worthy, he’d spank anyway, and “suffer the consequences”. Would Tripp do that too? Or Lori Alexander, or any other spanking-advocate such as Michael Pearl? After all the hush-hush abuse that’s talked about, at least this brings it out in the open. I think if my parents were jailed for spanking me, I would’ve just said “good, I hope they learned their lesson” and rubbed it in their faces if they ever threatened to again. It may have eventually led to more openness of proper conflict resolution and less walking on eggshells, but we’ll never know.
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I was not aware that Piper said that.
Someone just sent this on Twitter.
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This is possibly a tiny bit off topic, but given the screen cap in the original post of the guy’s Twitter page…
Why do so many Christian men find it necessary to put in their Twitter bio something that looks like this:
Why do they always put all their relatives in their Twitter bios???
Do they think it makes them appear more godly or something?
Sorry to go a tad off topic, but this has been a Twitter pet peeve of mine for over a year now.
And why would any guy who is self-professing Christian put in his Twitter bio thing that he’s “husband of one wife,” is that some kind of dog whistle that he’s not a Mormon with five sister wives? That he’s never been divorced (so that makes him supposedly more godly than dudes who have more than one wife)? Or what?
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One of the difficulties of raising our children in christian communities is the idea that there are formulas for success in child rearing. We teach one another that this is a normal part of christian child rearing. We are so naïve.
Recently, looking with critical eye at the smug culture in a christian book store, I was sickened by the cult like culture. By that, I mean that certain top name authors get a lot of publicity. Shoppers trust publishers. Bottom line, we parents equate publisher’s promos as trustworthy. Ugh.
Decades ago, we followed certain organizations that have proven untrustworthy. I am not certain that the religious culture will ever admit to lies and cover-ups. There is too much at stake; money, publishing rights, legal fees, cult followings, power, etc.
These perverted men know nothing of a child’s heart. I am quite certain they know little of God’s heart.
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Daisy, I have no idea why people post their family info. I don’t care about that, I want to know about who they are and their interests.
What cracks me up is all of those who want to be sure to identify as Calvinist. They will say stuff like: sinner, saved by grace; wretched sinner; sola scriptura; 5 solas, etc. Their identity is Calvinism.
The ones who use that as a profile don’t really need to – their behavior usually gives them away, sadly.
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Ok you guys don’t know me from Adam or my history but that guys’ eyes give me an old familiar feeling of warning. Be what it may, if you are used to abuse, you generally have a good radar on who to avoid. And that guy is worth avoiding. Gross.
Aside from the major creep vibe I get, awhile back I did a study on the rod pertaining to ancient Jewish culture. In a very short synopsis, the rod as a rod was never used, but if I remember right it represented authority. Many different types, and some of the Hebrew words pertaining to using the rod meant ” come let us reason” a quote I think even Jesus used. Which would allow for a gentler way of discipline.
I would have to go find all the stuff I read but it was night and day difference to what this guy or the Pearls preach and advocate.
There was only one verse that spoke of beating with a rod and in the Hebrew it referred to an adult. Not a child.
Now if an unscholarly person like me can do a simplified search in Google , why can’t these so called Dr.s or authors.?
It’s quite the trade being responsible for misleading people in exchange for fame and money. These people will be awfully sad on judgement day when they find out they are in trouble.
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Your answers are correct. The root of this is their “theology of sin.” Depraved human beings, even as babies, who need their natural rebelliousness “spanked” out of them (not just once, but regularly for all of childhood). This is the same old tired story I saw at SGM (People of Destiny back in my day), when Larry Tomzcak wrote the absolutely terrible book (poorly written and really bad and irresponsible exegesis and hermeneutics of the Bible), “God, the Rod, and Your Child’s Bod.”
I’m ashamed now that my wife and I followed the advice of this book. It is sick theology that (1), makes the Bible into a family Rulebook to be taken absolutely literally (never mind original language, meaning, purpose, or parts of the Bible that contradict child depravity), (2), that ignores Jesus elevating children as naturally like God’s kingdom and the fact that he spoke not one word about, nor did he do anything remotely close to spanking or disciplining children through physical pain, and (3) that elevates obscure Bible verses to be idolized as unquestioned commands by God and ignores the grand lessons of love found in Jesus’ revelation.
The root of this is bad theology based on bad historical study and a dangerous way of interpreting and using the Bible. The reason these people “fail to report” is because they think they are obeying God, not man. They can’t think for themselves. They are stuck in some warped universe where one has to obey some Bible verse they think tells them their children are terrible, hell-bound people that must be rescued through physical pain and that God is commanding them to do this. And, anyone who disagrees is not a true believer and has a rebellious spirit.
I’m not surprised by any of this. We need to expose this dangerous type of theology. It’s not just a debate about Calvinism or Arminianism or inerrancy. The fruit of this dangerous for women, children, and all of society. Its root is idolatry. Bible worship.
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I’m horrified that I once had that book in my possession, and a congregant in my church knew Tom Chantry personally. Thankfully, we never followed the spanking protocol. My daughter is going to be a doctor, most of those kids went off the deep end. Who’s a bad parent now?
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I see a resemblance to Paul Tripp (cheesy mustache). Does anyone know if they’re related by any chance?
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Yes, they are brothers.
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Re:”Is it that Tedd Tripp et al didn’t want to report Chantry because of who he represents (friend of Phil Johnson et al) and what he represents (Calvinism, pro-spanking, etc)?”
I suggest that a reason Tripp et al did not report Tom Chantry is that his father is Walter Chantry, who is a very big deal in the ARBCA circle, an author and a pastor, and reportedly not someone to be crossed.
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It’s right at the end of that video, where Piper says that, or Tripp quotes him.
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This brings back terrible memories of the days when Tripp’s child abuse manual was taught in the Sunday School classes I attended for parents of young children. We also followed some of the home school gurus you mentioned, reading their books and attending conferences to hear them in person. In my opinion, though, Tripp is worse than Pearl and the others. Pearl’s abuse techniques are physical and emotional but Tripp was all about combining physical abuse with spiritual abuse.
I could only watch a minute or so of the above video, but he displays it clearly when he says that NOT spanking is disobeying God. Telling your child that you are commanded by God to beat him when he “sins” (i.e. when he inconveniences the parent) is one of the grossest misuses of authority I can possibly think of.
I would not be surprised in any way if Tripp is guilty of not reporting clear child abuse. He wrote “the” book on “godly” child abuse. How bad would the abuse have to be for it to register on his scale of right and wrong? Basically, he seems to see the child as a possession of his parent and apparently a possession of the pastor also! I haven’t followed the Chantry case, but in what universe, even the demented Calvinist universe, is it okay for a pastor to be hitting kids in the church?
The emotion in my comment doesn’t even convey a tenth of the disgust that I feel that this man’s ideas on child beating were ever given the light of day. Since very few people ever seem to reap any consequences from covering up child abuse, my best hope is that this will spark discussion of a shocking, antiquated, harmful child rearing technique.
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Much as I’d like to go off topic on this one… I think despite how much preaching is against it, Christians really believe that the ends justify the means. So, in Tripp’s case, the “end” of promoting spanking justifies the “means” of turning a blind eye to a mostly like-minded person who is abusive.
We saw the same thing with HSLDA. They provided legal protection for a homeschooling family that was horribly abusive. Whether they knew they were abusive or not, I don’t know, but they raised every legal barrier to the police and social workers checking in on the children, all in the name of protecting the rights of homeschooling families. They must have had to know because when a case is big enough, they publish a 2-3 page article on the family, complete with pictures and details of all the contacts and what the lawyers did.
I see this with church leaders ignoring the sins of the leaders because they are conservative or liberal or have this view or the other. Also see the same sorts of church leaders throwing church discipline rules out the window to go after someone that they strongly disagree with.
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Because… we are just following God’s example that, instead of showing mercy and grace and gently guiding us towards righteousness, he immediately and harshly punishes our each and every sin. Oh wait.
The quote I think is worse is the one where his two children are fighting over a toy. His “shepherding” approach is to spank BOTH of them. One for selfishly keeping the toy when the other wanted it and the other for using violence to get the toy.
Now, picture this. I’m stopped at a stoplight. A man comes up, pulls me out of my car and drives off with it. After the police track this man down, they arrest both of us. Him for carjacking, and me for selfishly owning a car when obviously this other man wanted it. It’s so backwards. Victim blaming, sin leveling, calling good evil and evil good, and not surprisingly, when a victim goes to the church, the shepherding pastor skillfully and cleverly turns it back onto the victim.
Now to the understanding of submission, spanking for lack of obedience without challenge, excuse and delay… is a precursor to submission. Submission is considered a step beyond this – obedience without challenge, excuse or delay, but without the need for a directive.
Not surprisingly, Tedd’s brother Paul has a similar approach – that the most important lesson in parenting is to teach the proper response to authority…
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Hope T said:
Yes – Tripp’s teachings went to a deeper level. This is the teaching where adults will brag about how sinful they are, “I’m the worst sinner I know,” yet when they see sin in their own children, they not only have to spank the sin away, but they also make sure their child knows how horribly sinful they are.
I’m not quite sure what they are celebrating on Easter Sunday, ya know?
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Aside from the question of spanking–I’ve personally seen Tripp’s teaching applied well beyond the Scriptures, FWIW, but not my question here–I’m not clear on the timeline. Tom Chantry was arrested in December of 2016, but the Reformed Baptist commission on Chantry’s alleged crimes was convened in 2017. I take it that the issue here is that (a) the commission found some things and (b) that was not provided to the prosecution. Am I reading that right?
One other thought that comes to mind is that in June 2017, an assistant football coach at Michigan State was arrested because he talked to indicted football players about the circumstances of the crime. So even doing a parallel investigation to that of prosecutors, whether or not data are shared, can be viewed extremely poorly by the police and prosecutors.
Legally culpable or not, it strikes me that Christian leaders need to get smarter about these things. For that matter, everybody. #MeToo is popping up all over academia and Hollywood.
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Psalm 23:4 (KJV)
Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death,
I will fear no evil: for thou art with me;
thy rod and thy staff they comfort me.
I’m not a bible expert and I don’t know any ancient languages. In my ordinary mind, when I think of the term “rod”, I think of the lovely, comforting Twenty-Third Psalm.
Jesus doesn’t beat, harm or humiliate His sheep and little lambs. He comforts, protects and gives them loving direction if they stray. He searches for them when they’re lost, He picks them up in His arms and rejoices.
His Shepherd’s rod, in relation to sheep, provides protection, a barrier, a gently guiding nudge into the safe pathway (not used as a weapon to hit, beat or cause fear). Does it make sense that parents should beat their children, when Jesus wouldn’t?
The only reason Jesus would forcefully strike out with His Shepherd’s rod would be to drive off the ravening wolves (false teachers & evil-minded predators) who menace the sheep. That’s what I believe anyway.
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For real, Mark??? Have these people never been around the kind of kids who only want what somebody else has, and are constantly trying to take it? I mean, that’s a common kid thing. Even the most giving generous and good at sharing kid will push back at that eventually, and it good for the other kid to have that pushback and learn that just because you want something doesn’t mean you are entitled to it. What terrible parenting advice!!!
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Okay, this is a bit confusing. PA law as of 1995 appears appears to say that a clergy member is a mandatory reporter. AZ law also seems to say the same thing.
So, based on the motion to dismiss, the elders who initially investigated in 2000 illegally failed to report (as would have been required by PA law) since, according to the motion, since “Both of them were considered ‘clergy’ at that time in that particular church”.
So, the ARBCA is… full of crap.
1) All these men were mandatory reporters, whether they were physically in PA or in AZ at the time.
2) Since it was an ARBCA committee and the ARBCA chose to “seal” the report rather than disclose the accusations against Chantry, it is clear that they were involved in covering up those actions.
3) Since the three-man committee were mandatory reporters and failed to report, they did not abide by the “law of the land”.
This can be easily documented by obtaining the court transcripts, even if the blog account is suspect.
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From the Amazon preview:
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I wonder if he realizes he’s a communist. My possession of a house and a car when someone else wants it is sinful selfishness. Of course, I wonder what he would say if he were in a situation of someone wanting something of his…
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BB, sorry wasn’t more clear. It appears that the ARBCA investigation in question was conducted in 2000, not 2017.
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Ugh, unfortunately his book and the Pearl’s were on my shelf.
I found that most in my circle, including me, followed these teachings because they really believed it was scriptural and used the Bible like an instruction manual.
We just didn’t see our kids, we just saw the “sin” and “rebellion”.
Not a lot of room for grace.
I’ve since asked forgiveness from my kids, who gave me grace, and my grandkids are not being raised with this kind of teaching.
A little shout out to Samuel Martin for his book, Thy Rod and Thy Staff; They comfort me.
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Or, possibly, the one who picked it up innocently after the other child stopped playing with it. Or the one who literally just got the toy for their birthday. Or any number of other scenarios that make total sense. This guy does not allow for any personal pleasure, if someone else wants to take it away from you, you have to give it up immediately! Apply this to adults in any fashion and it will drop away right quick.
LOL.
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So very sorry for all the victims of Tom Chantry and his defenders and supporters.
You all deserve justice. Hopefully, you speaking out will protect other children from his sick perversion.
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Lea, interesting he uses the word _ justice_ because one would think that justice includes the concept of sin. A Reformed author would think of justification where we are declared to be without sin. But, here being just is not enough, merely having the toy is an act of selfishness.
“Or, possibly, the one who picked it up innocently after the other child stopped playing with it.”
Yes, this – there are many completely innocent ways to get a toy, and what I’ve seen more often is that kid 1 picks up any toy in the room, and kid 2 instantly wants it. Where is the selfishness in that? Yet, Tripp is going to throw kid 1 under the bus for no reason. Even being “quicker on the draw” is not an excuse to punish a child.
But, as I said, this sets kid 1 up for a life of worthlessness. Whatever they have that is of value must be ceded simply because someone else desires it. Most certainly, this is taught to little girls, but it was taught to me growing up as well. “Peace” in the house was more the object than justice, and breaking the peace meant that both were punished.
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I know it’s a little off-topic, but since Piper was mentioned by Tripp, here’s the DG article (“Would Jesus Spank a Child?”) from 2009 where Piper says:
“It’s against the law in Sweden to spank a child. And it’s against the law, I think, in some states in America. I’m not sure.
“Well, I will go to jail over that issue!”
https://www.desiringgod.org/interviews/would-jesus-spank-a-child
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Thanks, Kathi. I believe you. I’ll let others go read it. I’m giving my brain cells self-care. 😉
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Lea wrote, “This guy does not allow for any personal pleasure”
Well, he allowed for Tom Chantry’s, apparently.
I think you are all being very charitable as to why they covered it up. My first instinct is, “birds of a feather flock together.”
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Growing up in the conservative Christian homeschooling movement I experienced much sadism. The man who sexually abused me did things that hurt and demeaned me but could not have given him physical pleasure. My father told me the pain I caused my mother when she gave birth to me pleasured him.
Many of these sexually sadistic men who are obsessed with their authority have a pornographic fetish with punishing, breaking, “THEIR” authority, women and children’s submission, his training of his wife as if she is not human and is a canine, and women and children’s discipline. I believe this sect of Christianity attracts sexual sadist who gets pleasure out of trapping, degrading, demeaning, physically, emotionally and sexually terrorizing children and women.
It is like sexually sadistic perverts know if they slap the word Christian own it they can almost always get away with anything. They have the right to do whatever they want to women and children and women and children do not have the right to wash their hands of the sickos.
It is gross to me that children and babies get physically and emotionally terrorized when their brains are not fully developed yet and live in hell and grow up in a nightmare. But grown men who have fully developed brains get coddled and babied when they sexually abuse a child or beat their wife. Men who beat their wives and sexually abuse children deserve whippings more that confused new little people.
When my sister and I were little we got whippings for things we did not do and we could not say we did not do them because that would be talking back. Our father like all of these arrogant know nothing men pretended he knew things he didn’t and acted like a thug on a childish power trip. Of course, he always looked like a dumb stupid jerk to all the children. He had things rigged in his favor that we all had to smile, use sweet voices, and kiss his butt so he never knew how stupid, ridiculous, and evil we all found him.
This group of men say women and children are safest with them and they protect women and children. No, they do not! They protect their own pervert sadistic selfish selves and other men like them. Growing up with these men is hell. That is the reason for so much brainwashing and isolation.
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Exactly, Mark. Anyone who has spent time around kids has seen this scenario, and the point where a kid actually needs to draw those boundaries and say no, and the parents/guardians need to enforce it. Why teach kid 2 that selfishness is rewarded??? Why not teach them not to covet, because that’s definitely biblical. Sheesh. This person was writing books on children and he clearly doesn’t understand them at all!!
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Oooh. shudders But yes.
I can’t disagree with you on this. More and more, it seems like that’s the only answer that makes sense for a lot of these people. Why cover things up? Because you want people to do the same for you. And it works.
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Monique: THANK YOU very much for your recommendation of the book by Samuel Martin, Thy Rod and Thy Staff; They comfort me. I was able to download it for free and it is fascinating! Wish I’d had that information when my kids were little.
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“we got whippings for things we did not do and we could not say we did not do them because that would be talking back”
ChristianityHurts, thank you for sharing that. Those are things I was hoping could be talked of more openly to prevent all this fear-based mentalities. I had a manager who accused me of “back talk” when I was answering a question they asked, that was why I did what I did. After that I asked for a definition of back talk, and was told “you don’t need a definition of what back talk is”.
Thankfully those days are over, and I remember trying to ask my parents why they called it “talking back” because when someone talks to you it’s rude not to say anything.
Keep on learning what authority should and shouldn’t be, but using one’s authority to one’s advantage is typically where abuse starts, right?
I’ve heard all of the lines; “I was spanked as a child and it did me good so I would do that to my children too if they need”.
“I was spanked as a child and I’m scarred for life and still am scared to get too deep with my parents”(that was me for years, but my parents and I have re-built bridges since. And if ATI/IBLP/Vision Forum/Classical Conversations had existed then I may have been told how thankful I should be that they didn’t subsrcribe to that)
“I wasn’t spanked, at least not that I can remember and I always had a good relationship with my parents”
but never any form of “I wasn’t spanked but I wish I had been”
And this is one reason I’m thankful I didn’t have children. I have also heard of those who were abused who, for one reason or another did not have their own children and conclude that that was good because they believe they would’ve been abusive.
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Mary27 you’re welcome! I know, I wish I had known it too. People can choose to spank/whip/beat their kids, just don’t call it “biblical”, “scriptural”, or “God’s Way”.
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What this, Christian Domestic Discipline for Kids?
Creepy.
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http://thewartburgwatch.com/2018/07/29/todd-wilhelm-reports-on-day-4-of-the-tom-chantry-trial/
More information on the evil, sick-abuse, and perversion these poor kids had to endure.
It is so sad for them. So sick of parents picking the church/Christian big shot over their suffering kids.
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“Regardless of the reason, and we may never know why Tripp failed to report, but if this is how Tedd Tripp Shepherds a Child’s Heart, it is egregious!”
Yes, it is egregious.
Thanks for putting together this post.
How can this Tripp guy brag about his parenting, his grandparenting, his kids and grandkids right up front, and then not protect someone else’s children?
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https://thouarttheman.org/2018/08/01/day-five-of-the-thomas-chantry-trial/
Quote from the article.
“Chantry frequently told Victim 3 that disobeying him was like disobeying God. He told him if he told his parents about anything he would not get into heaven. Sometimes Chantry spanked him for disobedience and sometimes for acts not yet committed.”
Other things Christian sexual abusers tell children.
“If you tell anyone Jesus will not bless you.”
“If you tell anyone Jesus will cry.”
“If you tell anyone God will be mad at you.”
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I remember for sure when “Shepherding a Child’s Heart” was all the rage, even though for some reason I didn’t read it. Back then I suppose I would have agreed with all the tenets you listed in your “good quotes” section, but now, dealing with many people who were traumatized as children, my own shepherded heart cries “No!” at the very first one, viz., “All behavior is linked to attitudes of the heart. Therefore, discipline must address attitudes of the heart.”
I’ve come face to face with the way trauma (primarily I’m thinking of sexual trauma) works itself out in the behavior of small children, with unexplained tears, stomping the feet, inability to be still, and other “acting out” behaviors. When in the past I called certain behavior childhood rebellion in need of more punishment, I now know to look for signs of trauma. I feel ashamed of who I was and what I did and promoted in those days, but want to do my part now to help others who suffered under this ignorant covering of abuse.
It’s truly shameful the way Tedd Tripp covered for Chantry, and I appreciate this article.
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Naughty children of all ages need their bottoms bared and turned up on the lap of adult authority for measured and methodical warming and reddening. Such spanking is a perfectly natural form of educative correction. The fact that my childhood was denied the spankings I deserved made it that much harder for me to learn the critical lesson of Actions & Consequences.
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Reynard, I’m not going to beat around the bush. Your comment is disgusting. It is not natural or appropriate to intentionally inflict physical harm on smaller, younger human beings in our care.
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“The fact that my childhood was denied the spankings I deserved made it that much harder for me to learn the critical lesson of Actions & Consequences.”
And therein lies the problem. We don’t get to try out our childhood multiple times to test every theory. I was spanked and public schooled. If you can believe it, public school was the place where I could be “real” and home/church was the place where I had to perform a role to avoid the threat of discipline. I thought spanking and homeschooling were the way to go, but pretty early on realized that we are failing our children. Our most well-adjusted child was the one who was spanked the least and never homeschooled.
And, that was my theory, too. Actions and consequences, but I eventually realized that spanking isn’t a good proxy for cause and effect early on, and by the time kids figure out that spanking is an effect, there are many other ways to demonstrate the effect without causing physical hurt. For example, the kid who throws his food on the floor can be made to clean it up. The kid who draws on the wall can scrub it out. Those are much more “cause and effect” than physical punishment. And, often, kids came up with more appropriate punishments when we said something like, that was a very mean thing you did to your brother. What do you think an appropriate consequence should be.
Also, I found that spanking misses the opportunity for restitution and reconciliation. I break my brother’s toy, and I get a spanking. Okay, so I’ve “paid in full”, but my brother still is missing the toy and he still is angry with me because my spanking was about making my parents feel good, not about bringing resolution. But that’s what it was growing up. My brother would yell at me or hit me and he would get a spanking. That didn’t help him or me. It just helped him figure out more deceit and evil. Like… what happens if he gets me angry enough to yell or hit and then goes and tells my parents?
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