Patriarchy, Purity Pledge, Hymen, “Let’s Make Jesus Famous” Virginity, Abstinence
So much ado about a little flap of skin. For realz, people?
The idea of this just disgusts me. Read the bottom of the Instagram picture:
I like what this author wrote in, The Sexist Patriarchy of a Certificate of Purity:
If you grew up anywhere near a church, you know sex before marriage as a Christian is a big no-no, and you’ve likely also heard of teen and pre-teen girls being given chastity belts, purity rings, and the like as a pledge to remain pure until they walk down the aisle. It’s like a literal manifestation of Ephesians’ call to put on the full armor of God, and given the Christian call to keep others on the straight and narrow, one should give young sojourners all the tools they need to do so. However two things about this practice have always rubbed me wrong:
- The exclusion of the young boys waiting to deflower these girls from these purity pledges
- The pledging of a girl’s virginity to her father
Though the story in the Bowman’s case is that both the bride and groom were virgins when they jumped the broom, as far as one can tell from social media Tim didn’t present a certificate of purity to anyone. Sure, there’s no way to prove his virginity, medically speaking, the way his new bride did, but if she’s making her declaration so public, why should he not do the same? (Source)
Beyond all of the above, I believe this is like hymen worship.Most people know that a girl’s hymen can be broken by playing sports, riding a bike, horseback riding, using a tampon, or a young girl may never have had a hymen to begin with. Virginity has to do with sexual intercourse, not a flap of skin. I am disgusted that this young lady felt the need to go to a doctor to get a note from him to prove her virginity. Would her father not take her at her word?
The other issue that comes to mind is rape and sexual abuse. What happens when a girl is raped before marriage? What kind of shame she must feel when she feels she is damaged goods!
I know of a Patriarchal father who did not allow his daughters to wear tampons because he wanted to make sure his daughters’ hymens were intact for their future husbands. What about girls with a heavy flow and must wear tampons and pads? So they aren’t “proven” virgins anymore? Nonsense! This is absolutely ridiculous and Christians need to put the hymen test to rest.
On Bowman’s (brefree) honeymoon, she posted another Instagram photo. Seems she thinks this is going to make Jesus famous:nbsp;
brefreeStill enjoying my amazing honeymoon, but just saw this! Only the beginning! Thanks for all your support on social media over the last couple of days! We will continue to push & celebrate our decision. Thank you for helping us push a positive message! If one person has made a decision to wait until marriage or decide to stop & wait we have done our job! Let’s make Jesus famous! -Mrs. B #meetthebowmans#purity #livingmybestdays
https://twitter.com/April_Kelsey/status/656638047879086084
Here are a few more interesting articles on hymens. I am not responsible for any medical condition you may suffer when reading:
WHAT DO “CERTIFICATES OF PURITY” COMMUNICATE TO SEXUAL ASSAULT SURVIVORS?
Women Have Surgery to ‘Restore’ Virginity
MRA Group Searches For ‘Beautiful Virgin’ Brides With Intact Hymens
The hymen remains an evolutionary mystery – and the focus of the oppression of women’s sexuality
Spiritual Sounding Board 
This is, seriously, the dumbest thing I have ever heard of.
LikeLiked by 2 people
I want to comment but I am lost for words. How in the world does this make Jesus famous all it is doing is making her famous.
LikeLiked by 5 people
Well Dash I remember someone during a bible study on the Book of revelation that 4 billion people would die during the tribulation and that I should be grateful its not me, because I was “saved” ™ at the time. They said it so matter of fact and with a bit of a glint in their eye like, well you know, oh boy. Um that was probably the dumbest thing I ever heard but this does rank up there.
LikeLike
Let me also suggest the work that Richard Beck has done with respect to “Purity”. Beck is a professor and psychologist and has written a book on the subject. Here is one of his blog posts.
http://experimentaltheology.blogspot.com/2013/02/the-psychology-of-christian-purity.html
In the post, he writes:
“…I’d like to add to this conversation some observations about the psychology of purity and why this psychology makes purity culture so toxic. This analysis will be familiar to those of you who have read Unclean and have thus become the resident experts in your churches about the negative effects of purity psychology on the life and actions of the church.
But for those who have not read Unclean, why is the Christian purity culture so toxic and shaming?
It has to do with the psychology of purity. At root, purity is a food-attribution system, a suite of psychological processes that help us make judgments about whether or not it is safe or healthy to eat something. …”
Another thought is another aspect of where the purity concept has roots. In some of the world today and until the last hundred years or so in our culture, women were more like property than equals. To be frank, a woman who is a virgin at marriage is worth more than one who is not. Purity becomes an economic factor at that point.
LikeLike
This is out and out stupid. What if her hymen didn’t break?? Does that mean she is still a virgin?? Seriously, her first love is her dad?? What happened to Jesus?? Shouldn’t HE be her first love?? This doesn’t do a thing to glorify Christ. It glorifies the people involved and nothing more and takes us back a few thousand years when a rag was brought out of the marriage chambers to prove that by the blood on it the bride was a virgin so the husband couldn’t bring her back.
I am glad it was brought up that the male can’t prove his virginity. Why is it so important for the woman to prove hers? Could it possibly be because patriarchy encourages young men to sow their wild oats while demeaning and making a young girl or woman to feel like damaged good that these men would feel beneath their standards. Perhaps they are from the other side of the tracks, so to speak.
I know several of us who post here were sexually abused as children. I did feel like damaged goods until the last few years and after no longer being married. I finally feel that I am a whole woman in spite of the past. If a man thinks I am “less than” because I was assaulted or previously abused in “marriage” and/or as a child, shame on him!!! It is not my shame to bear.
LikeLiked by 6 people
Research shows that young people who take purity pledges are no less likely to be sexually active before marriage than those who don’t. Those who become sexually active just engage in other sexual acts than intercourse. This is not an improvement.
LikeLiked by 4 people
I am getting this clanging disconnect in my brain about a (Christian) woman bragging publicly about her intact hymen, tweeting, instagramming and publicizing details about her genitalia. Bragging about anything is prideful, and framing it as glorifying God is the kind of thing that makes Christians look like kooks, and rightly so. I guess it is possible to sacrifice modesty for purity. And I’m sure it goes without saying that she has never masturbated, given that Matthew 5:28 pretty much describes the rest of us as less than pure.
LikeLiked by 5 people
I’m wondering if the low cut wedding dress showing cleavage considered modest or pure.
LikeLiked by 5 people
The purity culture has come a long way baby! No longer do we see humility displayed amongst those who attend churches, we are now obsessed with sex, sex, and more sex. It’s like having a pastor lord over you condemning homosexuality, all the while seeking sexual favors from his women congregants.
And where is Jesus Christ in all of this, pray tell?
LikeLiked by 3 people
This is disturbing on many levels.
From a medical perspective, an intact hymen is not proof positive of *no sex.* Some hymens can stay intact during sex. In fact, on rare occasions a hymen needs to be cut to deliver a baby And a torn hymen is not proof positive of sexual activity. Any girl who is active, riding bikes, gymnastics, martial arts, etc. can tear a hymen.
Banging my head against the wall…the pug dogs appear concerned.
LikeLiked by 4 people
Here’s a fun homeschool study lesson: the myth of the hymen. (Dee beat me to it.) I just learned about this a few weeks ago after reading a news article on Muslim parents in Sweden requiring unwanted “virginity tests” on their daughters. Some commenters talked about the myth of the hymen. This was news to me, so I googled it.
Can leaders in the Purity Movement please educate themselves before spreading more false information? I’m certainly not against someone being a virgin at marriage. I was. But giving my father a Certificate of Virginity? Ewww. My father would have been creeped out. That’s TMI. What about the other women who are virgins but whose hymens have worn away from non-intercourse reasons by the time they marry? Should we stone them? Maybe we should just shame them?
Education, people. It’s a good thing.
LikeLiked by 3 people
“The hymen’s a delicate membrane that separates girls from women,” said Dr. Robert Stubbs, who runs the Cosmetic Surgicentre in Toronto, where, in a simple, half-hour operation, he turns sexually experienced women into surgical virgins.
Sheesh. This guy is trafficking in the myth that sexual experience is what makes a person an adult. So a bride is not a real woman until she has been deflowered by her new husband.
LikeLiked by 1 person
My mother wouldn’t let me wear them for the same reason. Do you know how embarrassing it is to sit out swimming classes during PE because you have your cycle? I was the only one. My mother was a nurse, too. You’d think she would have known better.
LikeLike
One thing that creeped me out was a brief mention of chastity belts. Seriously, is this making a comeback, right along with purity rings and father/daughter balls? The virginity certificate is bad enough, and something I can just see taking off among the patriarchal/christian ‘movement homeschoolers’.
Maybe somebody could do a parody of this with reference to the “Everlast” from Robin Hood: Men In Tights.
LikeLiked by 1 person
I keep thinking back to my teen days when my flow was so heavy and required both tampon and pads. I can’t imagine having to go to the bathroom every hour to “change.” I already had enough accidents (seriously, we’re not talking peeing accidents, we’re talking blood accidents that show through the clothes vibrantly) that required me to have extra clothes in my locker. This would have made double the effort, 7 days every single month until I got married – – – – – just for the husband to say he penetrated (thanks DW) the hymen in ONE NIGHT???? No, thanks!
LikeLiked by 2 people
Voddie Baucham wrote “Quite simply, our jobs as fathers is to present our daughters to their husbands as virgin brides.” (Voddie Baucham and the Bayly Brothers Have Weird Ideas About Marriage.) He seems to think that the father has to make sure a daughter is worthy of her husband. He ignores the fact that, by the time she’s marrying someone, she’s an adult and responsible for her own self.
LikeLiked by 3 people
And as for putting the burden on young men in their purity, John Piper recently told one guy that since he wasn’t a virgin he’d have a lot of apologizing to do with his fiancé.
LikeLike
So now within the church culture, we are slaves to signed contracts and covenants? And these contracts are proudly displayed for all to see?
So how should the ‘sinful’ woman who came into the home of the Pharisees to anoint Jesus with expensive perfume be treated as opposed to the purity by contract culture? And what happens if these young ladies break their contracts and have to lie to their parents for safety’s sake as well as appearing holy within the context of a highly volatile religious church where shame by leadership is the name of the religious game?
Is this practice slated in the above article something Jesus would be in agreement with or promote? I used to be in awe of these people, and yes, they surround me as well, until the secrets of their own sexual sins were and still are being exposed to the light of Christ. Double standards sure are abundant within our churches regarding sexual issues.
LikeLike
I was just getting over the creepy images of the father/daughter purity ball portraits.
I wonder when she presented this certificate to her father. Can you imagine being a guest at the wedding and she makes a formal presentation? How uncomfortable would that be?
I think it’s wonderful that she and her husband waited for sex before marriage. I think that’s a healthy thing, but I also would not look down upon someone who may not have had that choice due to sexual assault, or even if they did make the choice to have sex before marriage. That person is just as important to the person who has decided to live a life with them as someone who waited for sex before marriage. And then we can’t even dive into the fact that a man cannot physically prove to his father-in-law that he is a virgin. Jesus can be made “famous” in the way we love.
If a father has that much influence and control over his daughter I have to wonder how much influence he will have once she is married. I know the father’s goal is to keep his daughter pure and hand her off to another man, but if a daughter is relying so much upon her father to control her life, she’s not going to let go of him that easy. Good luck to you new husband!
LikeLiked by 3 people
I’m still laughing at “Hype about Her Hymen!” That’s good, Julie Anne!
LikeLiked by 4 people
It seems that Baucham and others are not presenting their daughters. They are presenting the hymen. Where is the daughter in this? How is she cherished? It’s all about treating women as objects for man’s sexual pleasure. You are not hearing about loving relationship, but conquering the virgin bride, the prize. What a way to start the marriage.
LikeLiked by 6 people
@Marsha:
“Technical Virginity” = keeping the cherry unpopped/melon unbroken. Maintained by using other orifices.
Some years ago, an online slang dictionary defined “Christian Side Hug” as “oral/anal sex, done to preserve Technical Virginity.” Note that this is associated with Christians.
And there is this extremely NSFW song on YouTube — “Loophole” by Garfunkel & Oates — on exactly the same subject.
LikeLiked by 2 people
@JulieAnne:
As the Jerk in the Kirk puts it:
“PENETRATE! COLONIZE! CONQUER! PLANT!”
LikeLiked by 2 people
@Kathi:
Since my roomie got me hooked on Game of Thrones, the reaction I have to any of that is two words long:
CRASTER’S KEEP.
http://gameofthrones.wikia.com/wiki/Craster
LikeLiked by 1 person
@NJ:
Just like a lot of gyno-surgeons in the richer Islamic countries.
He’s far from the only one to do so.
On both sides of the divide — I remember being pressured to get laid by a relative whose entire definition of “growing up” was “becoming sexually active”. This is just a Christianese coat of paint on “Adult = Sexually Active”. With the addition of a ring and a date.
LikeLike
@jkvarin:
I’m surprised she didn’t Twitter pics of the bloody bedsheets from her wedding night.
It’s in the Bible!
LikeLiked by 1 person
This is creepy on so many levels. So. Many. Levels.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Other than a plaque to be handed to the lucky dad, how can a young virgin female (and possibly male) celebrate their chastity? I believe that every church should have a “Wall of Purity” with the portrait of every child, age 8 and up, hanging. When one sins and loses their virginity, a black veil can be draped over the frame until such time the person either leaves the church or gets married.
Why don’t we just fast forward to the end result: make “impure” women wear scarlet ‘A’s for the duration of their adult lives.
That’s where this is headed, in my opinion.
LikeLiked by 3 people
How about we stone them at the public square if a bride can not prove her virginity?
That will make Jesus famous for fur sure…
LikeLiked by 2 people
Taking my tongue out of my cheek for a second, virginity at marriage does not guarantee anything about the quality of the future relationship.
Yes, being a virgin means that there is not a complicated sexual history to deal with, but it does not mean that your future bride or husband will be kind, patient, a good listener, or even sexually faithful in the future.
Everybody raise your hand if you know anyone who was a virgin when they married and ended up abused, divorced, or both….
This obsession with sexual purity often times over promises what it means for a marriage relationship-and I think it’s time people challenged this notion.
LikeLiked by 5 people
Since many Muslims view the hymen the same way, this could just as easily be “Let’s make Mohammed famous.” (Except I read an article by a Muslim woman who had the same concerns as many expressed here. Go figure.)
LikeLiked by 1 person
“It seems that Baucham and others are not presenting their daughters. They are presenting the hymen.”
LOL Bingo!
” Where is the daughter in this? How is she cherished? It’s all about treating women as objects for man’s sexual pleasure. You are not hearing about loving relationship, but conquering the virgin bride, the prize. What a way to start the marriage.”
Well, Julie Anne, I do seem to recall David Bayly once saying something about the wedding ceremony being the groom’s victory song over the bride and her parents…
LikeLiked by 1 person
HUG:
Some years ago, an online slang dictionary defined “Christian Side Hug” as “oral/anal sex, done to preserve Technical Virginity.” Note that this is associated with Christians.
Yikes. I am totally out of it. I had always assumed that phrase referred to what the Duggars make their grown kids do in courtship, as in a literal side hug. I had no idea it was code for certain practices amounting to “everything but”.
And I’m sorry to hear about that relative of yours. I’m kind of hoping you more or less told him(?) to sod off.
LikeLike
You know, if Christians like these folks continue this sort of oneupmanship, the next thing we’ll hear about will be copying the practice of some Orthodox Jews where the couple immediately after the wedding ceremony but before the rowdy reception, heads off to some prepared room to consummate the marriage before rejoining their guests.
Or they could do what Martin and Katie Luther did, and revive this ancient German custom of heading for the bridal chamber with at least one good friend in tow to observe the, er, proceedings.
LikeLike
“Make” Jesus famous???
Jesus is the most famous character ever. Nobody can count the amount of books, artworks and songs referencing him.
He is known about by at least some people in every country.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Like the Gloriavale cult in New Zealand:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2989160/The-family-14-fled-secretive-Christian-cult-promises-protect-followers-evils-outside-world-history-sexual-abuse-refuses-use-birth-control.html
LikeLike
Brenda,
Way up there in the comment section, you mentioned the modesty of the bride’s gown in showing her cleavage. In agreement with you whole heartedly, for her gown is very immodest in showing us too much skin thank-you very much. A higher jewel or v-neckline would have been more appropriate for a purity bride in the fact that she may cause another man to lust because of her low cut strapless. Shame on this bride for her father should have stopped her buying such a revealing gown and this should have been in the contract as well.
In purity cultures, isn’t it the woman’s fault if a man lusts after her with his eyes, his mind, and his bodily reactions because it all falls onto the woman’s choice of apparel? Does this wedding gown fall into that category?
I agree, remaining a virgin until the wedding night is the very best for our sons and daughters alike for our bodies are the temples of God, the Holy Spirit, and should be treated as such. When our children are married as virgins, we, as parents delight in the LORD without the worldly concept of contracts, purity rings, purity balls, and vast amounts of praise and adoration from men and women who love the limelight for themselves.
This whole charade in the article does nothing to honor Jesus Christ our LORD for He does not need any of these worldly ways to make Him famous.
LikeLike
@NJ:
It’s “code for certain practices” in mainstream street slang — at least as of several years ago. Not inside the Christian bubble. But indicative of how outsiders can view things. And begging the question of the origin of the term. (Around 10 years ago, there was a viral video of some church youth group performance called “Give Me that Christian Side Hug” which probably predated the slang term and might have been its origin. The video (and “hip” lyrics) were said to be very painful to watch.
And in the words of one of the Whole Earth Catalogs, “People are people, and the world is full of tricks and twistiness yet undreamed of.”
It was a her, and she died several years ago.
And she was the type you don’t dare tell to sod off.
Perpetual chip on her shoulder plus a hair trigger; with my social retardation, I could never tell what would set her off until it was too late.
LikeLike
NJ,
Is that true about Martin Luther and his wife Katie having a witness in their bedroom?
Man sure does come up with some doozies!
LikeLike
I can try some googling on that, but I first came across it in some Reformed source (either a blog post or an article) which escapes me at the moment. I forget the guy’s name now, but he was some good friend of Martin’s. And btw, thanks to his very pious past, Luther was the forty-something year old virgin as well as Katie. Supposedly this guy watched them do it for the first time ever, and wound up shedding a few tears over how beautiful the whole thing was…
LikeLike
BTDT,
Wow. Looks like NZ’s got their own hybrid of the Amish and the FLDS. From that one photo, it looks like the couple may not even be waiting to get to a room. 😀
LikeLiked by 1 person
Katy,
In purity cultures, isn’t it the woman’s fault if a man lusts after her with his eyes, his mind, and his bodily reactions because it all falls onto the woman’s choice of apparel? Does this wedding gown fall into that category?
It surely could. In some cultures, you don’t want your ankle to show. If could cause a man to lust and even rape a woman. She, of course, would be stoned for that. It was obviously her fault. NOT. I can’t imagine this dress would have been allowed in a church wedding in the purity culture, at least not without a jacket or a cape to cover what she’s showing off. It’s weird though, people are opposed to breast feeding in public but it’s ok for anyone taller than you to look right down at a woman’s breasts during a wedding.
You are correct. Jesus has been the name above all names for a very, very long time. He didn’t need these folks for that.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Just another three cents here. This whole thing just reeks of double standards for while holding up her virginity certificate as if it were a high school diploma, her breasts are oozing out of her too tight bridal gown which is very unbecoming to her as a woman.
I have sat in churches and read blogs where the women are blamed for the man’s lusting because of what she is wearing with absolutely NO responsibility or blame placed on the man’s behavioral reactions. It is the woman’s fault for every sexual deviance from the standard religious sexual practices within the church systems, and yet I have yet to see what genuine godly repentance looks like where the man’s sexual sin is concerned.
This whole thing kind of reminds me of Jesus saying, “He who is without sin among you, let him throw a stone at her first.” John 8:7
Which leads me into asking here, why the emphasis on our daughter’s virginity? Do we not expect the same character trait from our sons as well? Where are the young men holding up there certificates of celibacy in making a jesus famous?
LikeLike
While the Biblical concept of sexual purity before marriage seems fine in theory, it is rife with problems.
*For those who are sexually abused before marriage, something they couldn’t control, they are treated like damaged goods as Utah kidnapping and rape victim Elizabeth Smart points out. She was raised in the purity culture of conservative, Mormon, Utah. One of her teachers described people who have sex as being like a piece of chewed up gum. Who would want that? When virginal Elizabeth was kidnapped, held hostage, and raped…it was a soul shattering experience because she said it meant she had no value, because that was the message she had been taught. Elizabeth Smart has correctly pointed out that we should teach children that they will always have value, no matter what happens. (She also advocates for sex trafficking victims who stay, because they too think they have no value because they have been sexually degraded.)
*Duggar Family. Look at what they “advertised” about their family – sexual purity – but that they didn’t live out. They lied. They lied about the sexual abuse going on in their family. They lied about Josh’s predatory sexual behavior. They practiced bizarre rules like having the girls use the code word “Nike” to tell the men in the family to avoid their eyes because an inappropriately dressed woman was walking by. They lied to Anna and led her in to marriage with Josh. And now she’s got a husband who had sex with other women, hook ups, an Ashley Madison account for meeting people for extramarital sex, and reports that according to several porn stars that he had sex with them. So much for the *purity culture*.
*Patriarchy. These bizarre rules have a dark underbelly: Rife with incest and sexual abuse.
*Divorce rate. The Southern Baptists have the highest divorce rate, higher than atheists according to researchers, despite their rabid focus on purity, patriarchy, and a wife’s submission to her husband. So much for all of those legalistic, authoritarian controlling rules delivering a picture perfect, happy life.
LikeLiked by 1 person
“John Piper recently told one guy that since he wasn’t a virgin he’d have a lot of apologizing to do with his fiancé.”
_____________________________________________
That’s what I call irony: John Piper telling anyone that they’re going to have a “lot of apologizing to do”.
LikeLiked by 2 people
“BUT THEY DO THEIR DEEDS TO BE NOTICED BY MEN; for they broaden their phylacteries, and lengthen the tassels of their garments.”
You could just plus in “hymens” for phylacteries” and “tassels”, kind of works.
LikeLiked by 4 people
Why is it that the pastors that espouse patriarchy (and purity) like Voddie Baucham and Mark Driscoll — had lousy relationships with their own fathers? They are grasping at straws about how to be men because their own fathers were either abusive or non-existent. (That includes my former abusive, spiritually abusive, authoritarian NeoCal pastor.) These guys seem to overcompensate and make it up as they go because they didn’t have a good father role model a loving man for them.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Here are a few links about Luther and the consummation of his marriage which included a witness:
http://www.laboringinthelord.com/luthers-wedding-night/
http://inspiredbylifeandfiction.com/the-strangest-tradition-of-all-witnessing-a-marriage-consummation/
https://reformationnow.wordpress.com/category/family-issues/
LikeLike
Katy,
Girls may show it off, but the guys don’t have to look. I read a book written by a not so famous 4th string Lakers Basketball player from the 70’s. Right Now I can’t find the book or recall his name. He used to tell the boys on college campus if they saw a girl in a mini skirt to think about pink elephants. When their minds were completely on pink elephants think about some other outrageous thing. That way their minds would be focused on something rather than lust for the girls. Sounds almost insane enough to work.
On top of the John 8:7 passage being about tempting Jesus, I think the whole point is “where is the man?” You aren’t going to bring him here to be stoned. She didn’t commit adultery by herself, if she indeed did at all.
I believe it best, if at all possible, for both parties to be virgins. Perhaps that would take away some of the expectations of both people and please our Father God.
Don’t underestimate yourself, Katy. That was definitely worth at least a dollar!!
LikeLike
Why is it that the pastors that espouse patriarchy (and purity) like Voddie Baucham and Mark Driscoll — had lousy relationships with their own fathers? They are grasping at straws about how to be men because their own fathers were either abusive or non-existent. (That includes my former abusive, spiritually abusive, authoritarian NeoCal pastor.) These guys seem to overcompensate and make it up as they go because they didn’t have a good father role model a loving man for them.
_______________________________________________
This is almost a cliche: the patriarchal/authoritarian/pseudo-Christian cult leader or drooling true believer having had a horrific relationship with the father. It leaves a deep scar that sometimes results in a severely personality disordered adult who is drawn to power: either the desire to be abused by it or to use it to abuse. My personal experience with the neocalvinist strain of the pseudo-Christian cult leaders and followers was evidence of this phenomenon–almost to a man, virtually without exception, they’d been abused or neglected by sadistic or selfish fathers.
LikeLike
“I read a book written by a not so famous 4th string Lakers Basketball player from the 70’s…”
__________________________________________
That sounds like Jay Carty, known ironically as “Golden Wheels” because he was so slow-footed.
LikeLike
Truth Detector
That’s him!!!!! It was a very interesting book. I wish I had read it before all my kids were grown. I haven’t found it, so it must have gone to the church library donation box.
LikeLike
I’m all for purity and I too was a virgin when I married. I’m fairly certain my hymen wasn’t in tact though since I was also a gymnast for years.
This story shouldn’t surprise me, but oh my goodness! I’m still horrified by it. Very disturbing.
What would have happened if her hymen wasn’t in tact? I can’t imagine.
LikeLike
—Buzz Dixon (former Penthouse editor, now theology blogger), from Calling a Digging Implement a Digging Implement
LikeLiked by 1 person
“He used to tell the boys on college campus if they saw a girl in a mini skirt to think about pink elephants. When their minds were completely on pink elephants think about some other outrageous thing. That way their minds would be focused on something rather than lust for the girls. Sounds almost insane enough to work. ” – Brenda R
Or the alternative strategy could be, “Lord, thank you for making women. You did a great job and aren’t they beautiful?”
I remember seeing some famous man designer (perhaps Italian) being interviewed on some talk show years ago. He was asked what the best design was that he had ever seen. He replied, “A woman’s breast. It’s beautiful and it keeps the product warm.”
LikeLike
You know this is just too weird & sick on so many levels, The “men’s ” group advocating NO Hymen / NO RING are over the top with their obnoxious self righteousness. I wonder if it ever crosses their minds that perhaps they aren’t exactly ” every woman’s DREAM BOY”. Perhaps in their self angulation they have overrated themselves ?
The bride celebrating her intact hymen with a doctor signed certificate appears to be a bit too obsessed with and focused on all things vagina. This throws up a big red flag. Her publicity driven stunt seems to be bathed in pride and self righteousness.
This reminds me of a chapel service when I was a 7th grader in a FUNDIE Christian school (psyco teachers from Bob Jones, Hyles Anderson and Pensacola Christian). This particular chapel was separated with girls in the main sanctuary and guys in gym. The whole chapel was on purity, avoiding porn bla bla bla. Most of the teachers were women and here they are in a room with 7-12 grade boys passing out Purity CONTRACTS that we are supposed to sign, discuss with our parents and ask them to sign. The second paragraph was all about how we will not masturbate because every time you ejaculate by yourself you are “stealing an experience from your future spouse that doesn’t YET belong to you”. That never made any sense to me and listening to the home economics teacher read off ways to avoid self gratifying behavior by sleeping in sweet pants, sleeping with your hands outside the covers and leaving your bedroom door open.
Most kids had the good sense to throw the contract away but one kid saw an opportunity to showcase what a warped school we were in. I waited till we were at the dinner table and the folks were asking the standard what did you do today at school questions. ” OH YEAH, I’m supposed to get you to sign this”. I whip it out and start reading it. My Dad took it and finished reading it and just looked at my Mom with this blank faced look that seemed to scream, UUM what do we do with this one.
LikeLike
I am almost speechless at the poor taste and utter creepiness of this whole idea. And how does this point anyone to Jesus Christ? It makes it appear he is looking for “perfect” people, not that he came to save the lost. This is not the gospel message! If a woman, or a man, remains a virgin until marriage, good for them, but blowing trumpets on the street corner about it just looks crass and ridiculous. And where do you go once you’ve announced your perfection to the world? There’s nowhere to go but down- or become a liar. Let’s point people to Christ, not ourselves “for I know that in my flesh dwells no good thing.”
LikeLiked by 1 person
Velour,
“Lord, thank you for making women. You did a great job and aren’t they beautiful?” “A woman’s breast. It’s beautiful and it keeps the product warm.”
That is the best way of looking at a woman, but the writer was talking to teenage boys, who lack the maturity to remotely understand the beauty and artful creation of a woman or girl. I believe Carty was doing what he could to help them from lust.
LikeLike
Dee said: “And a torn hymen is not proof positive of sexual activity. Any girl who is active, riding bikes, gymnastics, martial arts, etc. can tear a hymen.”
That brought to mind a terrible thought. It can’t be. But maybe it is. There were so many unwritten rules at our former church, so many unspoken reasons for doing things. Perhaps *this* is one of the reasons some of the leadership frowned on girls being active (especially things like playing sports), and wanted them to have quieter pursuits. Oh, the excuses they gave were that it wasn’t good for girls and boys to become too familiar with each other, or that girls should not be encouraged to act/think themselves equal to or even superior to the boys they knew, since they were being brought up to be submissive… We kind of joked that it was sour grapes, that some of the sons of the elders had complained because some girls were actually more competitive and more athletically gifted in the group sports the young people played, like volleyball or soccer or ultimate frisbee… In any event, the leadership clamped down more and more, first encouraging and then getting more and more firm about insisting on gender-segregated volleyball games, and forbidding girls to play paint-ball (nothing official, but social pressure can accomplish a lot), and banning frisbee at official church functions when they couldn’t discourage the parents of girls from allowing daughters to play, all on the pretext that it was because they were protecting the girls from serious injury because the games could get rough.
Looking back, I am once again sickened that we bought into this bilge.
LikeLike
Katy said: “And what happens if these young ladies break their contracts and have to lie to their parents for safety’s sake as well as appearing holy within the context of a highly volatile religious church where shame by leadership is the name of the religious game?”
I remember a Greek guy (think My Big Fat Greek Wedding — yes, it appears that culture really does exist, or at least it did when I knew this guy) telling me that the Greek girls he’d grown up with had plenty of sexual experience before marrying, but they had ways of getting around the “virginity thing” so that a girl could technically still claim to be a virgin at the altar. He was quite explicit and matter-of-fact about it.
And, yeah, his parents expected him to marry and settle down with a nice Greek girl, eventually.
LikeLike
Kathi said: “I wonder when she presented this certificate to her father. Can you imagine being a guest at the wedding and she makes a formal presentation? How uncomfortable would that be?”
It is creepy. It’s a point of pride in that kind of community. There’s applause and whooping and cheering, and parents look fondly down at their wide-eyed younger daughters and whisper, “That’s what I’m hoping for you, sweetheart.” and mean it like it’s the true ending of the fairy tale.
And people from outside the community (like relatives, attending the wedding) look on in wonder and amazement and not a little disgust. At least, from what has been expressed to me, after such an event (which we didn’t attend, because we were long gone and having no intentions of ever going back for *any* reason, even a “joyous” wedding celebration), and from having taken part in such events in the past, before we left that church.
If the people in the church think it’s a testimony and encouragement to the unbelievers in their extended family, they’ve got another think coming.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Lisa said: “And how does this point anyone to Jesus Christ? It makes it appear he is looking for “perfect” people, not that he came to save the lost. This is not the gospel message! If a woman, or a man, remains a virgin until marriage, good for them, but blowing trumpets on the street corner about it just looks crass and ridiculous. And where do you go once you’ve announced your perfection to the world? There’s nowhere to go but down- or become a liar.”
Bingo. You’ve pretty much summed up some of the major problems with our former “church”.
LikeLike
@Brenda R.,
I see you point that he was addressing the sexual desires of teenage boys. I guess I disagree with how the conservative church addresses sex, even with teenage boys.
LikeLike
“It is creepy. It’s a point of pride in that kind of community. There’s applause and whooping and cheering,” refugee
And given that 1 out of 3 girls are sexually abused before the age of 17, and 1 out of 6 boys before the age of 17, imagine all of the wedding guests who were victims of sexual abuse who are having this purity certificate shoved down their throats like it’s the end all and be all.
I’ve seen stories of Christians who were pregnant before marriage and had abortions to keep up the whole pretense of “sexual purity” before friends, family and church members at the wedding. How sad is that??
LikeLiked by 1 person
Velour,
I haven’t been part of a church that didn’t want both genders to save themselves for marriage. I don’t agree with the crazy of a signed doc’s certificate. It is nuts. The whole thing is creepy and gives Jesus no glory whatsoever.
I also agree about the stats for the sexual abuse having been one of them. I don’t want to be reminded of it at a wedding. The abortion thing is horrific. How can anyone claim Christ and do such a thing? It is sure not pleasing God. It is a façade and a slap in the face.
LikeLike
Brenda R. said: “It is sure not pleasing God. It is a façade and a slap in the face.”
Yeah, that was life in our old church, pretty much. I can’t believe it took us so long to realize that it was the opposite of the abundant life promised by Christ.
It just felt like the chains kept getting heavier and heavier, instead.
LikeLike
An outward show of “purity” in one thing, which is more important than life itself? Sick and sad.
LikeLiked by 1 person
@Katy:
Because now that she’s said “I Do” and got the Ring, she is now her hubby’s personal porn star/sex doll, fulfilling ALL the years of sexual fantasies and paraphiliae he’s acquired during his Purity Culture upbringing. IMMEDIATELY.
LikeLike
So my Bible doesn’t show any written confirmation of women presenting their virginity certificates at the wedding feast Jesus attended back in His day, with the applause of guests. Maybe I missed something studying the Gospels.
And Brenda, I will always wonder what Jesus wrote in the sand to His male counterparts as they stood there with their pseudo pure hearts being convicted as they left the scene of a woman caught in shame. Often wonder too, if those faces of the Pharisees had those oh so proud religious sneers and jeers often seen on the pious. I do realize that account doesn’t have the same case scenario as the above article, and I also realize that being a virgin upon marriage is not an automatic ticket to heaven, ie., non-salvation issue. Circumcision is of the heart, not our documented covenants and contracts.
Headless, what are we going to do with you!
LikeLike
The whole thing seems to be to be just another exercise in vanity, self-obsession and narcissism along the lines of what you see in those dreadful cable TV bride shows. The only difference is this is exponentially worse, because Jesus’ name is being dragged along behind this young woman’s narcissism.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Katy,
No, we don’t know what Jesus wrote in the same, but it’s on my list of questions when I get to Heaven. It’s not the same scenario. I just don’t see what that piece of paper proved. We can do nothing to earn salvation. Jesus did all of that for us. That is the best news ever!!!
I look forward to HUG’s comments. I’m sure someone took the bride aside and gave her literature that she would need for whatever her new husband might desire. NOT!!
LikeLike
“To the pure, all things are pure, but to the defiled and unbelieving, nothing is pure; but both their minds and their consciences are defiled.” (Titus 1:15 ESV)
So what are we to make of a father who does not just take his daughter’s purity as a given, going even so far as to send her off to have her genitalia probed and inspected?
LikeLiked by 2 people
I just found this blog and I must say it’s nice to read comments from people of like mind! It’s been many years since I attended a controlling, abusive church but the experience stays with you. I will say this- possibly no one appreciates grace like the person who has struggled in a group like that and came to the knowledge of the truth. And no one is more zealous to safeguard their freedom in Christ once they’ve found it. “It was for freedom that Christ set us free; therefore keep standing firm and do not be subject again to a yoke of slavery.”
LikeLiked by 3 people
Welcome, Lisa! Nice comment.
Glad you are out of a bad church!
Hopefully we can all find grace and help each other.
LikeLike
By the way, Lisa, at the top of the page if you go to the Off-Topic Discussion tab, there are resources, books, videos, and articles that have been posted there, along with discussions of course, that you might find helpful. (Someone recently described this area of the board as like the secret menu at a burger place.)
LikeLike
“The abortion thing is horrific. How can anyone claim Christ and do such a thing? It is sure not pleasing God. It is a façade and a slap in the face.” Brenda R.
Agreed. But another point that I see, the downside of the purity culture and how strong it is in some areas of the country (and in some churches), are look at what people are willing to do to *save face* and make *everything perfect* because that’s what everyone around them demands and it would be scandalous to portray anything else. It would be scandalous for them to say that they aren’t pure before marriage and are pregnant. So the live the lie, instead of becoming targets of gossip. The stories I’ve read from some Christians describe the abortions they got so they could portray being the *perfect, pure* Christian before their church, families, and peers. Don’t these purity cultures share in the blame?
LikeLike
Welcome, Lisa. I loved your comment so much, I tweeted it. You are so right. Those of us who have been in abusive churches really do know grace. What a gift! I’m glad you’re on the safe side of the fence. 🙂
LikeLiked by 2 people
Gary W,
I like what you said there. What father would expect or ask something as humiliating as a Certificate of Authenticity? It is sickening.
LikeLiked by 3 people
Hi Lisa,
So glad you are free and happy to read your comment.
Brenda
LikeLike
Velour,
Yes, Yes and Yes. The Purity Culture IS to blame. How horrible it must be to make a decision to abort your child because of the shame that you would go through and possibly your entire family turn against you. The purity culture is wrong, the families supporting this are wrong and abortion is wrong.
People make mistakes, we all sin. A child should not have to die or be labeled as a consequence of that. They should not have to feel as thought they are a mistake. God created that life, no matter how they were conceived. There was a guy involved in this somewhere. What is he going through? Does he know his child is being killed or is he the potential mate and is also hiding his “so called shame”. If they are marrying after the fact, isn’t that good enough or are we all suppose to be people pleasers instead of God pleasers?
After having said all that, right now I am feeling a bit judgmental.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Brenda, I have a cousin whose ex-wife aborted the last child they conceived together, something he only found out after the fact. It hit him pretty hard and was one of the factors in their divorce. He would have gladly been a single father to that little one in addition to the three children they already had.
Any church with a social environment such that, an unborn child’s life is seen as a reasonable price to pay to avoid the consequences of fornication becoming known, is not a church. It’s a club to itself be avoided.
LikeLike
@GaryW:
Paranoid?
LikeLiked by 1 person
P.S. Hubby also showing off his Smokin’ Hawt Wife(TM) to all the others? Like certain Alpha Male Pastors(TM) parading their Alpha Females before the Omegas in the pews — “LOOK WHAT *I* GOT THAT YOU CAN’T HAVE!”?
LikeLike
Like they say, it’s impossible to make this stuff up. I wonder if the fathers who are so into this horse$hit would be as willing to have their daughters stoned to death for not having ‘the tokens of virginity’ like it sez in the word – o’ – gawd.
(Deuteronomy 22 : 13-21)
LikeLiked by 1 person
You know the more I think about this the more I realize how these purity movement folks just don’t get it. They minimize the finished work of the cross and greatly exaggerate their own self importance and righteousness. We as people greatly in need of a savior, can’t make Jesus famous with our hymens or any other part of our body regardless of our sex. Male or female, hymen or NO hymen , Jesus Christ was made famous when he hung on the cross for us. That day he became more than a teacher or a historical figure, he became our savior and Lord. The sooner the church refocuses on that and off this tendency to constantly be reinventing itself or the ” next big movement ” the better off we will be. The church has had enough movements. Time to protect the abused, expose the heretical abuser and spread the gospel because we are commanded by God to do it and not because it pays well.
LikeLiked by 4 people
How many people clicked on her name to look at her twitter handle? She owns a boutique and the other aspect to this story – without getting into the whole topic of women as commodities – is this —
Je$u$ $ell$
LikeLiked by 1 person
Re: Luther’s wedding night. I somewhat doubt that any actual intercourse was witnessed. There was an old custom called beilager, which consisted of witnesses putting the bride and groom to bed, both bride and groom being attired in sleeping clothes. This was a part of the wedding festivities, with the witnesses then leaving the room.
i will gladly yield this point if anyone was solid evidence to the contrary. In any case, the only situation where intercourse was usually witnessed involved royalty, as far as I can tell.
This hymen-obsession proves to me the perverse and degenerate nature of our culture. Dressing it up as some sort of “Christian purity” doctrine is just a mask for this degeneracy.
LikeLike
The links above do not include primary sources as far as I can tell.
LikeLike
I think it certainly sends a horrible message to female sexual abuse victims. Do the proponents of this idea offer any explanation of how to deal with such victims? I am not a big proponent of the buzz-words which seem to be so popular these days, but here communal “shaming’ is the probable effect.
LikeLike
So….what if something happens to her hymen between the doctor visit and the hotel room on their wedding night?
LikeLiked by 1 person
Here’s an excellent article on this topic –
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/lovejoyfeminism/
Libby Anne echoes what many have touched on, here on your blog, JA. She references the same article you do. (It’s one of three she discusses, on this topic of ‘purity’)
LikeLiked by 1 person
I came back to save a copy of this for my research tonight. The story Jesus told of the publican and the Pharisee came to mind!
Luke 18:11-14 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican. I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess. And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner. I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.
Also – STILL mind-boggled (is that a word?) that she would present the certificate to her father and not her new husband. Not enough question marks in the world for that one.
LikeLike
Another thought – I recently came to realize that the Quiverfull belief system may indeed be another gospel for some of its adherents. Thinking about the purity cult I would say it is too because of how they trust in themselves and their works, and in this case are “preaching” about intact hymens instead of the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ. He is “famous” for saving our souls and our message is that gospel, not how good we are now.
This should be our claim too: Galatians 6:14 But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.
LikeLiked by 1 person